[captkirk]

I own both the MJ2 and Ragnarok (as well as the Jotunheim) for 16, 13, and 12 months respectively, and so no axe to grind with respect to favoring any one of them over the others. I've been listening between the 3 over the past year (all balanced in / balanced out, and with my Utopias since March 2017 and the HD800 since July 2016). At this point I wouldn't be without either the MJ2 or Ragnarok, they both sound that good to my ears. I've been rolling 12 different matched pairs of tubes from the stock on up to Amperex 7308 vintage Gold Pins and Telefunken E88CC's in my MJ2. The tube pair I keep coming back to time and again are the NOS 5670's I picked up at music direct for $99.00 the pair. (I keep forgetting to order a backup pair). They really make my MJ2 come alive for me especially with vocals. And in comparing the MJ2 with 5670's to my Ragnarok I am very impressed with the air, dynamics, attack and decay characteristics, and the hard hitting bass the MJ2 displays and how very close it is sonically to the Ragnarok. The Ragnarok sounds a little laid back in the mids where the MJ2 sounds a little forward. Bass and highs are as good as the recording allows either amp to reproduce.

The MJ2 is not tube-y sounding to my ears, I usually associate that traditional tube sound with amps that use output transformers.

I listen mostly to large scale orchestral music and my ears tell me the slightly relaxed mid-range presentation with the Ragnarok suits the aggressively over-miked recordings that started being produced in the early 70's. But the MJ2 is very seductive with vocals and a good all around-er with a variety of genres including large orchestral, jazz, rock, and film soundtracks.

I'm just glad I don't have to choose between the two. Sometimes I actually have to look and see which one of the two I've got the phones plugged into, (especially with the 5670's), they are both just that enjoyable.

So my suggestion would be, if you already have an MJ2, find the tubes that do it for you and focus on the best DAC you can afford. I've never heard / owned any Schiit DAC but the Yggdrasil (which I preferred over 5 other DACs I own or got some time in-home with) so I can't comment on the Gungnir Multibit or any others down the line. But multibit is the Schiit as far as I'm concerned.

The MJ2 with the right tubes (for you) is a great performer and a very good value. And no, I will not be deserting my Ragnarok (until the Ragnarok comes). I need both!

I apprecIte the comparisons you mention here, specifically the similarities between the Rag and MJ2.

I've been looking at the Ragnarok more often as of late. I like its power, ability to drive speakers and lack of tubes. Nothing against tubes, just not sure I want to go down that rabbit hole...

How would you compare the Rag and Jot? I like the Jot, but I wish it was a bit more open and a touch laid back. I've heard good things about using a Saga as a pre, but the differences are said to be subtle.

 

[Gavin C4]

I have only a mere Audioengine A5+ speakers that im powering through a $150 dac/amp. I wish to focus more on the ability of the device to power headphones, having the speakers connectivity is just a mere plus!

Thanks for your insights in the mjol2s though, the only reason why im hesitant to get it is that i might invest in a pure tube amp in the future (looking at you woo audio!) and im not sure if i'll be using the tube component of the mjol2 after that. Im really not sure how the capabilities of the mjol2 compare to the ragnarok in terms of headphones capabilities. Of course, i think i should heavily consider the mjol2 and gumby as my end gear.. Its definitely cheaper and sounds wiser on my part..
I wish i could demo these units that i have interest in, but there arent any shops with schiit products to demo unless i take a 4 hour flight away haha! Relying on online reviews sure is a messy process!

I also have the Audio engine A5+. I just connect them with RCA directly to my Gungnir multibit. Cuz the A5+ already have volume control, I dont need the preamp function of the Mjolnir 2. Unless you want a tube preamp

 

[Charente]

... The MJ2 with the right tubes (for you) is a great performer and a very good value. And no, I will not be deserting my Ragnarok (until the Ragnarok comes). I need both!

Great comparison ... and completely agree with your MJ2 + 5670 tubes assessment ... I've been trying GE 5670W 5 STAR and highly recommend them in the MJ2 (I paid €44 the pair from a German dealer) ... that's about as much as I've paid for any pair, not that I've bought that many.

 

[FLTWS]

I apprecIte the comparisons you mention here, specifically the similarities between the Rag and MJ2.

I've been looking at the Ragnarok more often as of late. I like its power, ability to drive speakers and lack of tubes. Nothing against tubes, just not sure I want to go down that rabbit hole...

How would you compare the Rag and Jot? I like the Jot, but I wish it was a bit more open and a touch laid back. I've heard good things about using a Saga as a pre, but the differences are said to be subtle.

You've answered your own question. In comparison with both the MJ2 and Ragnarok I find the Jotunheim; brighter and more forward sounding, the sound stage is up close, it doesn't display depth within the sound stage as well as either of the other two (but all HP's I've auditioned suk at this compared to speakers), and I never get the same sense of air between instruments or of the halls or recording locations character or space. The differences between the MJ2 and Ragnarok are much smaller. It's not just a case of diminishing returns because that is always a gorilla in the room, I just enjoy my music more with the other two. But, $399 for this level of performance is a steal and this is what I would recommend to any acquaintance of mine if they wanted a separate HP amp because these people are not audiophiles and are not going to put in the many hours necessary to make themselves crazy obsessing over mole hills to metamorphose into "audiophile" status. Always live within the budget you've got and balance out the performance over the entire system and understand where your weakest link(s) will be (the front and back of the complete chain the way I hear things).

If you've got to drive speakers as well the decision becomes more difficult if you go all the way with Schiit. Absolute power delivery aside; Ragnarok is $1699 versus an MJ2 plus Vidar which is $1548 (if you like Vidar's sound and can integrate 2 boxes into your system layout and are willing to buy at least 1 pair of modestly priced upgraded tubes, the stock tubescan become backups, and if you want the preamp to pull double duty as a HP amp). If you want to avoid that "rabbit hole" then it's easy, Ragnarok, if the power is adequate.

I have no experience with any other Schiit gear other than what's in my signature. I find the simplest approach usually best. If differences aren't subtle I suspect a malfunction or mismatch.

The 3 most important aspects that will affect the sound your going to experience are (and in this order):
1. The quality of the recording
2. The quality of the recording
3. The quality of the recording

 

[Snowpuppy77]

You've answered your own question. In comparison with both the MJ2 and Ragnarok I find the Jotunheim; brighter and more forward sounding, the sound stage is up close, it doesn't display depth within the sound stage as well as either of the other two (but all HP's I've auditioned suk at this compared to speakers), and I never get the same sense of air between instruments or of the halls or recording locations character or space. The differences between the MJ2 and Ragnarok are much smaller. It's not just a case of diminishing returns because that is always a gorilla in the room, I just enjoy my music more with the other two. But, $399 for this level of performance is a steal and this is what I would recommend to any acquaintance of mine if they wanted a separate HP amp because these people are not audiophiles and are not going to put in the many hours necessary to make themselves crazy obsessing over mole hills to metamorphose into "audiophile" status. Always live within the budget you've got and balance out the performance over the entire system and understand where your weakest link(s) will be (the front and back of the complete chain the way I hear things).

If you've got to drive speakers as well the decision becomes more difficult if you go all the way with Schiit. Absolute power delivery aside; Ragnarok is $1699 versus an MJ2 plus Vidar which is $1548 (if you like Vidar's sound and can integrate 2 boxes into your system layout and are willing to buy at least 1 pair of modestly priced upgraded tubes, the stock can become backups). If you want to avoid that "rabbit hole" then it's easy, Ragnarok, if the power is adequate.

I have no experience with any other Schiit gear other than what's in my signature. I find the simplest approach usually best. If differences aren't subtle I suspect a malfunction or mismatch.

The 3 most important aspects that will affect the sound your going to experience are (and in this order):
1. The quality of the recording
2. The quality of the recording
3. The quality of the recording

Excellent post. I was planning on getting the MJ2/Gumby combo as an upgrade from my Asgard 2/Bimby combo. I have a pair of HD800S headphones and a pair of Paradigm Studio 100v.2 speakers that have not been used for music for a long time. Then I got this crazy idea. Why not put a Ragnarok in place of the Asgard 2 by my listening chair which is convenient for headphones and just run 28' of speaker cable to my speakers that are on the other wall facing me. So I got the Ragnarok and but did not quite have enough funds to get the Yggy yet. So I bought a turntable that I have been wanting for a while instead (and Schiit Mani). I also figured if Steve Guttenberg could give the Ragnarok a component of the year award using the Bimby then the match up would be good enough at least for now. Another main reason for me to get the Ragnarok is that I ultimately want a Yggy which I hope to get in about a year.

Now that the system is in place I can say that even with just the Bimby the Ragnarok makes my HD800S sound sublime. I do not care what anyone says about HD800S being too bright with solid state or the Ragnarok. The Ragnarok has a smooth non fatiguing sound and excellent tone to instruments. It also has better depth to the soundfield which is a key thing I was wanting. However the biggest surprise was hearing the Ragnarok on speakers. My dad was not sure if the 60wpc would be enough to properly drive the Paradigm 100s. We were both surprised to hear that the Ragnarok drives the Paradigm 100s with ease leaving no want for power. And the Paradigms sound better than ever and I have to be practically pried away from listening to them with the Ragnarok. I have now switch from almost 100% headphone listening to 60% speaker and 40% headphone listening. I would listen to my speakers even more if my family could tolerate it. Also I will also add that my original vinyl pressings that I was able to properly clean sound significantly better to me than their hi res digital counterparts on the Bimby. This is even more reason to get Yggy for me so my vast digital collection can sound even better. Playing the right vinyl on a decent rig through the Ragnarok and HD800S balanced is the best sound I have personally heard.

 

[FLTWS]

Excellent post. I was planning on getting the MJ2/Gumby combo as an upgrade from my Asgard 2/Bimby combo. I have a pair of HD800S headphones and a pair of Paradigm Studio 100v.2 speakers that have not been used for music for a long time. Then I got this crazy idea. Why not put a Ragnarok in place of the Asgard 2 by my listening chair which is convenient for headphones and just run 28' of speaker cable to my speakers that are on the other wall facing me. So I got the Ragnarok and could not quite have enough to get the Yggy yet. So I bought a turntable as I have wanted for a while instead (and Schiit Mani). I figured if Steve Guttenberg could give the Ragnarok a component of the year award using the Bimby then the match up would be good enough at least for now. Another real reason for me to get the Ragnarok is that I ultimately want a Yggy which I hope to get in about a year.

Now that the system is in place I can say that even with just the Bimby the Ragnarok makes my HD800S sound sublime. I do not care what anyone says about HD800S being too bring for solid state or the Ragnarok. The Ragnarok has a smooth non fatiguing sound and excellent tone to instruments. I also have better depth to the soundfield which is a key thing I was wanting. However the biggest surprise was hearing the Ragnarok on speakers. My dad was not sure if the 60wpc would be enough to properly drive the Paradigm 100s. We were both surprised to hear that the Ragnarok drives the Paradigm 100s with ease leaving no want for power. And the Paradigms sound better than ever and I have to be practically pried away from listening to them with the Ragnarok. I have now switch from almost 100% headphone listening to 60% speaker and 40% headphone listening. I would listen to my speakers even more if my family could tolerate it. Also I will also add that my original vinyl pressings that I was able to properly clean sound significantly better to me than their hi res digital counterparts on the Bimby. This is even more reason to get Yggy for me so my vast digital collection can sound even better. Playing the right vinyl on a decent rig through the HD800S is the best sound I have personally heard.

Yes,,a Ragnarok (or MJ2) plus HD800 is a great sounding pairing.

 

[Darren G]

... Nothing against tubes, just not sure I want to go down that rabbit hole...

I avoided them for a long time too, but it's worth noting that the rabbit hole is not as deep as it seems. The pre-amp tubes supported by the MJ2 are more common than is obvious, including multiple current manufacturers. The numbering scheme can be intimidating, but reading a single article will clear that all up. Personally I don't hear differences between cables, but tubes I do. While there are some expensive old tubes out there (that some covet), there are plenty of modern choices, often under $100 a pair (i.e., cheaper than many interconnects), that typically will last many years, and (I find) really do make a difference in the sound.

p.s. And really, the MJ2 with tubes does not sound mushy, syrupy, noisy, whatever stereotypical image that some think of when they think of tubes.

 

[Baldr]

I avoided them for a long time too, but it's worth noting that the rabbit hole is not as deep as it seems. The pre-amp tubes supported by the MJ2 are more common than is obvious, including multiple current manufacturers. The numbering scheme can be intimidating, but reading a single article will clear that all up. Personally I don't hear differences between cables, but tubes I do. While there are some expensive old tubes out there (that some covet), there are plenty of modern choices, often under $100 a pair (i.e., cheaper than many interconnects), that typically will last many years, and (I find) really do make a difference in the sound.

p.s. And really, the MJ2 with tubes does not sound mushy, syrupy, noisy, whatever stereotypical image that some think of when they think of tubes.

GE5670s with adapters are stunning bang for the buck in 6DJ8, 6922, or 7308 sockets.

 

[FLTWS]

GE5670s with adapters are stunning bang for the buck in 6DJ8, 6922, or 7308 sockets.

LOL! I just ordered that back up pair of 5670's I alluded to in an earlier post from Music Direct. Come back here and read Baldr's recommendation, looks like for once I beat the inevitable rush that will surely follow now. Seriously though, they do pair very well with MJ2 imparting to it some of the better sonic attributes of the Ragnarok. That's why I wouldn't be happy without the MJ2 and the Ragnarok; double the pleasure, double the fun!

 

[captkirk]

Considering that I have limited space, a fairly small listening room, and more-than-some set of efficient speakers, the Rag may be my ideal solution. Looking at integrated amps out there, it's nice knowing that Schiit's headphone section in the Rag is top-notch.

As for tubes, the MJ2 has great appeal. The pairing with my Gungnir MB would likely sound sublime. But if I go tubes, I'm leaning more towards high powered OTLs, so for the moment, looking elsewhere.

 

[eee1111]

Tomorrow is the day

mj2 and gen 5 Gungnir MultiBit

I got the balanced cables, headphones, tubes, and music ready

 

[FLTWS]

Tomorrow is the day

mj2 and gen 5 Gungnir MultiBit

I got the balanced cables, headphones, tubes, and music ready

Ain't foreplay great!?

 

[UntilThen]

Playing the right vinyl on a decent rig through the Ragnarok and HD800S balanced is the best sound I have personally heard.

I'm glad others are getting the same experience. Yggdrasil and Ragnarok pairing with Audeze LCD-2f or HD800 sounds absolutely stunning. This combination is incredible for details, dynamics and musicality.

Switching Yggdrasil to my Rega RP8 with Apheta moving coil cartridge and Avid Pellar phono preamp is even more euphonic for me. Ragnarok is an end game amp as far as I'm concerned. It does everything right and sounds great. On a back to back audition with Violectric v281 on 3 lengthy occasions, I chose Ragnarok at the end. I have ZMF Eikon and Atticus incoming and I can't wait to hear them on the Rag.

I spend 90% of my time with Rag now and 10% with my OTL tube amp Euforia.

 

[Charente]

LOL! I just ordered that back up pair of 5670's I alluded to in an earlier post from Music Direct. Come back here and read Baldr's recommendation, looks like for once I beat the inevitable rush that will surely follow now. Seriously though, they do pair very well with MJ2 imparting to it some of the better sonic attributes of the Ragnarok. That's why I wouldn't be happy without the MJ2 and the Ragnarok; double the pleasure, double the fun!

I have also just bought the last of the stock of GE 5670W 5* from my dealer in Europe ... no more available on his radar over here. These are superb. They should last me me a long time. Thanks to @Baldr for first bringing this family of tubes to our attention some months ago.

 

[Defiant00]

Considering that I have limited space, a fairly small listening room, and more-than-some set of efficient speakers, the Rag may be my ideal solution. Looking at integrated amps out there, it's nice knowing that Schiit's headphone section in the Rag is top-notch.

As for tubes, the MJ2 has great appeal. The pairing with my Gungnir MB would likely sound sublime. But if I go tubes, I'm leaning more towards high powered OTLs, so for the moment, looking elsewhere.

Don't forget, the Rag doesn't have a "headphone section" or "speaker section," it's all the same thing, just with different connectors.