[RRod]

  I have the Modi and it only supports up to 24/92, no expert mode. Not that you really need anything other than 16/44.1, just sayin'

 

[StanD]

  I have the Modi and it only supports up to 24/92, no expert mode. Not that you really need anything other than 16/44.1, just sayin'

Now you've gone and upset all of those platinum eared experts. 

 

[Kapazza]

  Thanks , I will investigate. As to the $$$ it's my 65th birthday, give me a break.

 
Happy birthday!  Here, enjoy TWO free months of Spotify Premium (new subscribers only):  https://www.spotify.com/us/2014promobby/

 

[Pirakaphile]

  Now you've gone and upset all of those platinum eared experts. 

Everyone's entitled to all the extra artificial useless bits of information on the top of their music that they want. :3

 

[BeatsWork]

 
From your post I glean that the signal coming out of the headphone jack is identical to the preamp RCA outputs on the back.  Is that how I should understand it?  I was always under the impression that the preamp outs totally bypassed both "stages" as you describe or at the very least bypasses the second stage.  (To prevent double amping?)  
Sorry if I am totally off base on that.
 
Thank you for taking the time to post this as I was trying to wrap my head around how this works for a while.
 
 
Again, THANK YOU for noting that.  I have been searching posts as to an explanation of the detriments of double amping, and could not find a post with the reasoning behind it other than "its bad, don't do it..  cuz my mom said so "

 


What exactly are you trying to accomplish? There are situations which require "double amping" where you might be feeding a pair of 500w monoblocks and need a preamp - which is .... a low powered amp in chain prior to main amps(s). If you're talking about two headphone amps then taking amplified signal from 1st to 2nd will cause 2nd to amplify distortion introduced by 1st amp. And you risk damaging the 2nd amp which is not designed to take amplified signal. Bad idea.


If Amp 1 has true line out (pre-amp) then no you are not "double amping" but what configuration is forcing you to use the output of one amp in to another (vs. from source) where you are not trying to use the 1st as a pre-amp? If source only has one out and you want to connect two amps for switching back and forth then using pre-amp out of 1st amp should be fine. Obviously direct from source would be better but ... Alternatively you could look at SYS http://schiit.com/products/sys

 

[StanD]

   
From your post I glean that the signal coming out of the headphone jack is identical to the preamp RCA outputs on the back.  Is that how I should understand it?  I was always under the impression that the preamp outs totally bypassed both "stages" as you describe or at the very least bypasses the second stage.  (To prevent double amping?)  
Sorry if I am totally off base on that.
 
Thank you for taking the time to post this as I was trying to wrap my head around how this works for a while.
 
 
Again, THANK YOU for noting that.  I have been searching posts as to an explanation of the detriments of double amping, and could not find a post with the reasoning behind it other than "its bad, don't do it..  cuz my mom said so "

When one double Amps they are amplifying the noise and distortion from the preceeding amp. Using a lineout as one's input is preferred as it is usually before any amplification, or at least it is before the power amp stage. If one is double amping something like an iPod Touch 5G, its noise and distortion is so low that one might not notice. If one is double amping something like an Ocean V_n or Bravo or the like, one will get a large dose of noise and some extra distortion.

 

[Guidostrunk]

Has anyone been to the schiit website lately? It appears their website has some security issues. It won't let you login stating that there's a hack attempt coming from schiit.com

 

[Mr Rick]

Has anyone been to the schiit website lately? It appears their website has some security issues. It won't let you login stating that there's a hack attempt coming from schiit.com

I logged in with no problem.

 

[cspirou]

   
From your post I glean that the signal coming out of the headphone jack is identical to the preamp RCA outputs on the back.  Is that how I should understand it?  I was always under the impression that the preamp outs totally bypassed both "stages" as you describe or at the very least bypasses the second stage.  (To prevent double amping?)  
Sorry if I am totally off base on that.
 
Thank you for taking the time to post this as I was trying to wrap my head around how this works for a while.
 

 
Now we get into a conversation of passive vs active preamps. Passive preamps (like the Schiit Sys) just use a potentiometer or resistors to lower the signal voltage for volume control. Active preamps are powered and can not only lower the signal but increase it as well.
 
A good preamp needs to be able to vary the voltage without adding any noise. Headphone amps only supply enough current to drive headphones (except maybe the Lyr/Lyr2) and have very low noise because of the intended use with headphones. The requirements for a headphone amp basically match the requirements for a good active preamp which is why you can take the output and not have to worry about "double amping".
 
Bypassing the two stages would mean that the outputs are only passively controlled. This would be ok as well but as I understand it, the preamp outs are muted when the headphones are plugged in with the exception of the Ragnarok. This would mean you need a relay switch of some sort to detect when the headphones are plugged in to know when to cut off the output. It's pretty complicated additional circuitry and would add to the cost of the amp. Meanwhile for active amplification you only need a switching jack which cuts off the signal to the output as soon as the headphones are plugged in and vice versa.

 

[Sniperboy]

BeatsWork & StanD
 
Gents, this is going to get very convoluted so I'll try to be simple as I may have phrased the questions unclearly earlier.
 
1.  I was not trying to accomplish anything, I was merely asking cspirou to clarify since this was posted "The preamp output should just be a redirection of the headphone output towards the RCA jacks." I think this is not accurate, but I am not sure.  I was not trying to be confrontational, I just wanted to know if my understanding is wrong that preamp outs were not amplified, while the headphone jack out is.
 
2.  The second part of my question comes from a comment on Schiit's website:
Valhalla 2 also adds two important features: preamp outs and a gain switch. Preamp outs let you connect your powered monitors directly to Valhalla 2, to give them some of what some people call “tube magic.”
So far, cspirou's description of the hybrid amp "first stage is tube powered and second stage is the power stage" is the closest I have to a logical explanation to Schiit's comment.  I wanted to know if the first and second stage as he describes has anything to do with the preamp out.
 
3.  Finally I have no desire to daisy chain amps, I will leave that to our resident expert Mr Rick : )
This whole inquisitive chain started when I one day asked myself "what is so bad about amping an already active speaker set?"
 
Anyways I am sure this is showing my ignorance and I am reminded why I have been lurking and not posting for very long. 
Looks like less posting and more reading is in order for me.  Thanks for your patience thus far.

 

[StanD]

  Anyways I am sure this is showing my ignorance and I am reminded why I have been lurking and not posting for very long. 
Looks like less posting and more reading is in order for me.  Thanks for your patience thus far.

It never hurts to ask an honest question. This stuff is not always obvious so don't feel ignorant or anything negative.

 

[rovopio]

  It never hurts to ask an honest question. This stuff is not always obvious so don't feel ignorant or anything negative.

 
StanD...
 
i think im getting the hd650 soon. very very soon. There's no delivery domestic delivery here, so i gotta go to the store. so as soon as i can go to the store, i'll probably get it.
 
1) my question is... will schiit OTL tube gives me night and day difference with the magni 2 uber i currently have?
Or is it more the 5 or so percent that music-lover here seek for?
I think i can live with 5% less sound quality with my magni 2 uber, but if it's like, oh, 20% less, maybe i'm getting OTL for the hd650...
 
 
By the way, i can't remember which thread... "hd 600 appreciation thread" maybe, but um, im in the similar opinion to be honest. i like hd600 better.
two things however, hinders from getting them. one it's not available locally, and two, the marble granite looks made me physically nauseous. I don't think i could keep that in my room.
But i did audition the hd600 for like, 5 minutes? and hd650 for like 2 hours...
 
i truly think i like the hd600 female vocals better (less bass doesn't hurt), and i think i'm brain-adjusting myself to like the hd650...
2) oh, hd650 here is $640.. if i import hd600, it's going to be $600 total i reckon. In your personal do you think i should buy hd600 instead?
 
i couldn't audition hd600 for as long as i would like to, because it's on a different store with the hd650, and that one aren't really keen with people auditioning, and all the time i'm auditioning, the clerk mention that it's not available locally so, i didn't pay 100% attention listening to it. I think i hav an idea in that short 5 minutes that i prefer hd600 though.
How much i'm not sure because 600 / 650 seems to share that similar sound signature if not being listened to side-by-side. Well maybe hd650 has more bass and less forward vocals maybe?
Or similarly as forward as hd600, but smoother?
 
im really not sure.
Also, going back to the store is not an option either because... i had to buy something just to get him to let me audition. I really don't want to buy another junk.
So here i am asking, since i know you have the hd600...
By the way, do you still use it or have you move on to another headphone?

 

[Rossliew]

   
1) my question is... will schiit OTL tube gives me night and day difference with the magni 2 uber i currently have?
Or is it more the 5 or so percent that music-lover here seek for?
I think i can live with 5% less sound quality with my magni 2 uber, but if it's like, oh, 20% less, maybe i'm getting OTL for the hd650...
 
Sound preference is and always will be a very subjective topic. I would say the HD6xx series will sound good out of both but the OTL will give you that slight tubey richness which usually translates into a holographic, sweeter, more musical sound. Bass may be slightly rounded and some may not prefer such a signature. SS amps usually tightens the FS giving a tauter sound which some may translate to sounding a tad dry. The new Valhalla 2 may be more neutral sounding as compared to the previous version but you have the added benefit of tube rolling to tweak the sound slightly.
 
By the way, i can't remember which thread... "hd 600 appreciation thread" maybe, but um, im in the similar opinion to be honest. i like hd600 better.
two things however, hinders from getting them. one it's not available locally, and two, the marble granite looks made me physically nauseous. I don't think i could keep that in my room.
But i did audition the hd600 for like, 5 minutes? and hd650 for like 2 hours...
 
i truly think i like the hd600 female vocals better (less bass doesn't hurt), and i think i'm brain-adjusting myself to like the hd650...
2) oh, hd650 here is $640.. if i import hd600, it's going to be $600 total i reckon. In your personal do you think i should buy hd600 instead?
 
The HD600 to my ears, sound more neutral as compared to the HD650, which is a very dark can. Having said that, both headphones will scale well with better equipment. To me, you can't go wrong with either. If price is a concern, then get the cheaper one and upgrade later when you have the funds.
 
i couldn't audition hd600 for as long as i would like to, because it's on a different store with the hd650, and that one aren't really keen with people auditioning, and all the time i'm auditioning, the clerk mention that it's not available locally so, i didn't pay 100% attention listening to it. I think i hav an idea in that short 5 minutes that i prefer hd600 though.
How much i'm not sure because 600 / 650 seems to share that similar sound signature if not being listened to side-by-side. Well maybe hd650 has more bass and less forward vocals maybe?
Or similarly as forward as hd600, but smoother?
 
im really not sure.
Also, going back to the store is not an option either because... i had to buy something just to get him to let me audition. I really don't want to buy another junk.
So here i am asking, since i know you have the hd600...
By the way, do you still use it or have you move on to another headphone?

 

[StanD]

   
StanD...
 
i think im getting the hd650 soon. very very soon. There's no delivery domestic delivery here, so i gotta go to the store. so as soon as i can go to the store, i'll probably get it.
 
1) my question is... will schiit OTL tube gives me night and day difference with the magni 2 uber i currently have?
Or is it more the 5 or so percent that music-lover here seek for?
I think i can live with 5% less sound quality with my magni 2 uber, but if it's like, oh, 20% less, maybe i'm getting OTL for the hd650...
 
 
By the way, i can't remember which thread... "hd 600 appreciation thread" maybe, but um, im in the similar opinion to be honest. i like hd600 better.
two things however, hinders from getting them. one it's not available locally, and two, the marble granite looks made me physically nauseous. I don't think i could keep that in my room.
But i did audition the hd600 for like, 5 minutes? and hd650 for like 2 hours...
 
i truly think i like the hd600 female vocals better (less bass doesn't hurt), and i think i'm brain-adjusting myself to like the hd650...
2) oh, hd650 here is $640.. if i import hd600, it's going to be $600 total i reckon. In your personal do you think i should buy hd600 instead?
 
i couldn't audition hd600 for as long as i would like to, because it's on a different store with the hd650, and that one aren't really keen with people auditioning, and all the time i'm auditioning, the clerk mention that it's not available locally so, i didn't pay 100% attention listening to it. I think i hav an idea in that short 5 minutes that i prefer hd600 though.
How much i'm not sure because 600 / 650 seems to share that similar sound signature if not being listened to side-by-side. Well maybe hd650 has more bass and less forward vocals maybe?
Or similarly as forward as hd600, but smoother?
 
im really not sure.
Also, going back to the store is not an option either because... i had to buy something just to get him to let me audition. I really don't want to buy another junk.
So here i am asking, since i know you have the hd600...
By the way, do you still use it or have you move on to another headphone?

At home my I use both the HD600 and HE-500 headphones, I like both of them.
WHen I got my HD600's I was looking to buy the HD700's and spent severeal lenghty sessions comparing the HD600, HD650, HD700 and HD800. The HD800 was over budget but very desirable. Although I was ready to pay up for the HD700's I found them to be a bit strident (too much treble) and left the choice to the HD650 and HD600. I was agonizing back and forth between the two as they are very much alike. The HD650 has a bit more bass and a bit less treble whicih to me gives a sloping trendline that loses treble. I found the HD600's to be most neutral and went with them. If I had got the HD650's, I wouldn't have lost any sleep over the choice.
As far as amps go, I prefer a clean neutral SS Amp so I would go with the Magni 2 Uber. Among my piles of Schiit is a Magni 1 which works rather nicely with the HD600's. SOme folks claim the Magni 1 is bright, I don't believe that to be true as I compared it with other amps using an A/B switch. If you're looking at the Valhalla 2, I'm not sure if its tube sound will be very noticable as its THD figures are too low for human ears to notice. I don't follow the flash mob's cries so I won't just repeat what I've heard without saying so.
Are you looking for as close to reproduction as was recorded, then SS is the way to go. If you want some coloration, then a tube amp with the right kind and amounts of distortion are worth considering. IMO, this is not an electric guitar so tubes are not important to me as I'm not looking for any soft clipping when I listen to music as opposed to guitar playing.

 

[Spiral Out]

I'm throughly enjoying the Magni 2 Uber with the HD600. The pairing is fantastic. I find myself using the Magni 2U over the Vali most of the time. Many people around here say that tube amps are preferable with the HD600/650, but I simply prefer the sound of the Magni to the Vali with my HD600. The Magni sounds much quicker, better seperation,tighter bass, and a wider sound stage without being bright at all. I listen predominantly to rock so that may be why I find the sound of solid state more appealing with the HD600. Of course this is only my subjective opinion...