[reddog]

Let's all have a beer and listen to some music

Yes a good beer and listen to some great music. I am going to have a can of circus city IPA and shot of dark rum. Single malt scotch is getting to expensive lately.

 

[jcn3]

I just think it is counterproductive, when someone asked for a recommendation on what to do with the Gungnir, and the answer was to bypass one of the most important features.

My post with the analogy taken from the Yggdrasil review did not mention any other posters.

At this point, I'm happy to let it stand at this, but I also am fine with everyone saying whatever they like in reply.

Dude, if you go read my original post, I didn't give a recommendation, I just said what I did. I even said it was contrary to what was recommended by Schiit.

This is not a black and white hobby.

BTW - you haven't said whether you have a Gumby or heard one or have compared the settings in jriver. What's the story?

 

[ToTo Man]

The quote is comparing perceived air in sigma-delta converters vs. the Multibit architecture of the Yggy.

 
A few weeks ago I had Gungnir Multibit, Mjolnir 2, and Ether, on home demo (lucky me!).  The combination of all three provided me with by far the finest listening experience I've had to date.  
 
However when I installed Gumby into my main HiFi system along side my existing D/S Bifrost Uber and performed real-time A/B switching between the two, the results were mixed.  Gumby sounded more relaxed and fluid, with increased space and depth (the soundstage moved backward behind the speakers), but Bifrost Uber had more immediacy and sparkle which gave the impression of superior crispness and clarity.  I didn't know why this was at the time, but my findings would appear to be consistent with those of the author of the CA review of Yggy, who notes the lack of perceived air in multibit DACs compared to D/S due to the absence of pre- and post-ringing in the former.  
 
I'm not disputing that the multibit presentation is the more accurate one, but it seems that in my system the flaws of the D/S presentation are actually beneficial in livening things up.  I don't know if this is due to inadequate resolving capabilities in my amplification, loudspeakers, or the possibility that I have over-treated my room with absorption to lower reverb times and thus reduce bass boom.  
 
To those who have been fortunate enough to audition Bimby, Gumby and Yggy, what differences are there in the tonal presentations between all three?  Which is the perceived crispest/clearest/airiest sounding, if not the most accurate, of the three?  I've heard people describe Gumby as "warmer and more euphonic" than Yggy, but I don't know how to interpret this with regards to how the high frequencies are presented.

 

[reddog]

A few weeks ago I had Gungnir Multibit, Mjolnir 2, and Ether, on home demo (lucky me!).  The combination of all three provided me with by far the finest listening experience I've had to date.  

However when I installed Gumby into my main HiFi system along side my existing D/S Bifrost Uber and performed real-time A/B switching between the two, the results were mixed.  Gumby sounded more relaxed and fluid, with increased space and depth (the soundstage moved backward behind the speakers), but Bifrost Uber had more immediacy and sparkle which gave the impression of superior crispness and clarity.  I didn't know why this was at the time, but my findings would appear to be consistent with those of the author of the CA review of Yggy, who notes the lack of perceived air in multibit DACs compared to D/S due to the absence of pre- and post-ringing in the former.  

I'm not disputing that the multibit presentation is the more accurate one, but it seems that in my system the flaws of the D/S presentation are actually beneficial in livening things up.  I don't know if this is due to inadequate resolving capabilities in my amplification, loudspeakers, or the possibility that I have over-treated my room with absorption to lower reverb times and thus reduce bass boom.  

To those who have been fortunate enough to audition Bimby, Gumby and Yggy, what differences are there in the tonal presentations between all three?  Which is the perceived crispest/clearest/airiest sounding, if not the most accurate, of the three?  I've heard people describe Gumby as "warmer and more euphonic" than Yggy, but I don't know how to interpret this with regards to how the high frequencies are presented.

I have listened to the GMB and the Yggdrasil. And thev Yggy has more detailed high frequency sound, that allows the overall sound signature to be so neutral, resolving and detailed, yet remain so musical and engaging. I agree the Gumby is warmer and more euphoric sounding do to the lack of such fine micro high frequency detail. The Gumby is not as crispy and resolving sounding as the Yggy. The Yggy has better overall tonality and transparency of the sound than the Gumby.

 

[ToTo Man]

I have listened to the GMB and the Yggdrasil. And thev Yggy has more detailed high frequency sound, that allows the overall sound signature to be so neutral, resolving and detailed, yet remain so musical and engaging. I agree the Gumby is warmer and more euphoric sounding do to the lack of such fine micro high frequency detail. The Gumby is not as crispy and resolving sounding as the Yggy. The Yggy has better overall tonality and transparency of the sound than the Gumby.

Thanks for that reddog, I fear my wallet is going to be taking a huge hit in the near future!...

 

[johndean]

I have listened to the GMB and the Yggdrasil. And thev Yggy has more detailed high frequency sound, that allows the overall sound signature to be so neutral, resolving and detailed, yet remain so musical and engaging. I agree the Gumby is warmer and more euphoric sounding do to the lack of such fine micro high frequency detail. The Gumby is not as crispy and resolving sounding as the Yggy. The Yggy has better overall tonality and transparency of the sound than the Gumby.

I have a GMB and Yggy and I agree with everything you say here. That's not saying the GMB is a slouch .It is much better than the Delta Sigma version
and at its price point I dont know of any dac that can beat it. 
 
Is it worth spending an extra 1 k for the Yggy? Absolutely ,if you have the extra 1 k .

 

[schneller]

  I have a GMB and Yggy and I agree with everything you say here. That's not saying the GMB is a slouch .It is much better than the Delta Sigma version
and at its price point I dont know of any dac that can beat it. 
 
Is it worth spending an extra 1 k for the Yggy? Absolutely ,if you have the extra 1 k .

 
Yes, but the value equation is always tricky. Does the GMB buy 75% of the Yggy for $1K less? 25%? 90%? 50%?  And then enter the Mojo for $600. How does it stack up?

 

[Vanquisher]

Bumping back up my Q. So I've decided I'd probably like to keep my next dac upgrade probably around the DS Gungnir $ range. I'm leaning towards just picking up the DS Gungnir will full intentions probably within the next few months of sending it back for an upgrade to multibit. I'm also hoping if I do that and hold out they'll have a USB3 upgrade option as well.
 
Guess my Q is would you guys go for the DS Gung if you had full intentions of upgrading or go Bimby? My only reservation of going with the Bimby is I know i'd be leaving a bit on the table. But IMO coming from my Modi 2 Uber i'm sure either will be significant upgrades.

 

[kstuart]

All of these questions are relying on the issue of money ($$).
 
The three DACs offer increasing sound quality for increasing price.  Which one to buy is dependent solely on your budget - not on the DACs.
 
It's just a question of whether you want to spend $600 on a DAC or $1250 or $2200 - and what that means for everything else in your life that also requires money.
 
From atomicbob's reviews of all three DACs, it is clear that spending more gets you improved sound, but the Multibit Bifrost still gets you the "multibit sound" - atomicbob was happy to spend hours listening to the Multibit Bifrost, even though he had the other ones on hand.  atomicbob states:
 

Then there is the Bimby. For the last seven days I've spent almost all of my disposable time listening to the Bifrost MB and asking myself, do I really need the extra resolution of Gumby for most of my listening enjoyment? Plenty to enjoy about this DAC. So get a Bimby and go explore your library. Be prepared to hear things you never experienced before.

 
Other than that, you will have to go to a Meet (you can find announcements here on head-fi) to hear for yourself.
 
@Vanquisher- If you get a DS Gungnir and then update it to MB, the total cost is more.  Jason said that USB3 is only for Yggy (and it's possible that there are logistical reasons for that - it may not fit the connectors on other DACs or it may be too big for them).

 

[Vanquisher]

 All of these questions are relying on the issue of money ($$).
 
The three DACs offer increasing sound quality for increasing price.  Which one to buy is dependent solely on your budget - not on the DACs.
 
It's just a question of whether you want to spend $600 on a DAC or $1250 or $2200 - and what that means for everything else in your life that also requires money.
 
From atomicbob's reviews of all three DACs, it is clear that spending more gets you improved sound, but the Multibit Bifrost still gets you the "multibit sound" - atomicbob was happy to spend hours listening to the Multibit Bifrost, even though he had the other ones on hand.  atomicbob states:
 
 
Other than that, you will have to go to a Meet (you can find announcements here on head-fi) to hear for yourself.

 
Makes sense. Again its not the loot that is the issue for me its more than coming from a Modi 2, yeah I could buy a 1200 dollar dac but who knows what i'd be missing if I never heard it. Bimby probably is a nice upgrade. I only say that too because frankly there is a lot of percieved value between bimby and gumby for me anyway. Looking for those that have had both to chime in on the worth of that upgrade taking into consideration the majority of my listening is done on casually. Mainly on spotify but I do have my stash of flac. I mean I'm a bit new to this so at some point if your not increasing the quality of the music your listening to does the more expensive hardware still make as noticeable a difference as it could say on lossless material?
 
I was thinking though would there be any benefit to running balanced out of gungnir into my mjolnir? 

 

[hodgjy]

   
 
I was thinking though would there be any benefit to running balanced out of gungnir into my mjolnir? 

From my review of the Gumby:
 
3. The unbalanced outputs are not crippled at all. Several are reporting the Gumby's unbalanced outputs "clearly" lack behind the balanced ones. This is false. My Teac HA-501 is a single-ended amp, but can accept both unbalanced and balanced connections. I tried them both when using the Gumby. So, I had either the Gumby or the Teac do the summing. I could tell no difference between the connection type, and assuming my Teac isn't a piece of junk (it's not, it's a fabulous amp), it's because there isn't a difference at the human hearing level. Obviously, use balanced if you have an amp that receives them. Otherwise, use unbalanced without any fears at all.
 

 

[Vanquisher]

From my review of the Gumby:

[COLOR=3B3B3B]3. The unbalanced outputs are not crippled at all. Several are reporting the Gumby's unbalanced outputs "clearly" lack behind the balanced ones. This is false. My Teac HA-501 is a single-ended amp, but can accept both unbalanced and balanced connections. I tried them both when using the Gumby. So, I had either the Gumby or the Teac do the summing. I could tell no difference between the connection type, and assuming my Teac isn't a piece of junk (it's not, it's a fabulous amp), it's because there isn't a difference at the human hearing level. Obviously, use balanced if you have an amp that receives them. Otherwise, use unbalanced without any fears at all.[/COLOR]

Thanks!

 

[Turn&cough]

I've been holding off buying a new DAC since last spring. The idea of paying $2000-2500 was the main reason.
 
I had been looking mainly at Chord 2Qute and Aqua La Voce being under the impression that the Yggy was a bit of a letdown. Thin sounding, needing long warm ups, and lacking bass. I was off the forums all summer and have only recently started looking again. The Computer Audiophile rave review kind of surprised me and got me digging for more opinions which of course landed me here. 
 
To me the Yggy is definitely out of my budget but the Gumby is starting to look really good and about $500 less than the 2Qute. In addition comparisons of the two seem to slightly favor the Gumby. Seems like a no brainer and considering the law of diminishing returns I figure it's probably closer to the Yggy than its price suggests. I suspect it's more than 75% as good as a previous poster mentioned.
 
What I'm now wondering is if it's in a different league as my aging modded EE Minimax or is it just marginally better and the money could be better spent elsewhere...
 
End of ramblings

 

[sheldaze]

  I was thinking though would there be any benefit to running balanced out of gungnir into my mjolnir? 

 
 

  From my review of the Gumby:
 
3. The unbalanced outputs are not crippled at all. Several are reporting the Gumby's unbalanced outputs "clearly" lack behind the balanced ones. This is false. My Teac HA-501 is a single-ended amp, but can accept both unbalanced and balanced connections. I tried them both when using the Gumby. So, I had either the Gumby or the Teac do the summing. I could tell no difference between the connection type, and assuming my Teac isn't a piece of junk (it's not, it's a fabulous amp), it's because there isn't a difference at the human hearing level. Obviously, use balanced if you have an amp that receives them. Otherwise, use unbalanced without any fears at all.
 

I understand that the unbalanced outputs of the Gungnir are in no way crippled. I ran this way happily 

 
But if you're running from a balanced DAC into a balanced amplifier, why connect them via single-ended cables? Even if it is not crippled?
 
The benefit I think would just be shorter electronics path. Instead of first being converted back to single-ended for output from the Gungnir, then in the Mjolnir being converted back to balanced again, just connect to the two boxes via a balanced cable - good to go 

 

 

[Liu Junyuan]

  Sorry, but you must conform.  Go Vols.

 
 

   
definitely, Go Vols!

Lol. I am currently at UT as a graduate student. Go Vols! I mean...go Gumby!