[hanumanbob]

There is no need to buy another amp if you don't want to spend 1000$.
Most of audiophile equipment are just "expensive toys for expensive boys".

People just have fun buying and selling gear and trying to achieve perfect sound which is not possible. As long as you have the money play around and have fun. If you don't be happy with what you have.

 

[axle_69]

What will give me the most bang for my buck, Feliks Audio Echo MKII or Violectric 222? as it is now I'm happy with what the RME headpfone amp gives me with my HD800s, but I read here on the forum that RME' headphopne amp is crap compared to these amplifiers, is it really worth spending 1000$ more on an amplifier that so many people recommend?

I have a v222 + Qutest on another system and an ADI-2 that is mostly being used with a pair of Genelecs, but when I had them together I did some testing and the ADI-2 actually has a very decent amplifier, yes the V222 is better but the difference is small. This is the level where it costs a lot more to get a slight increase in performance.

 

[IXOYE]

I have a v222 + Qutest on another system and an ADI-2 that is mostly being used with a pair of Genelecs, but when I had them together I did some testing and the ADI-2 actually has a very decent amplifier, yes the V222 is better but the difference is small. This is the level where it costs a lot more to get a slight increase in performance.

That's what I suspected, but since I'm an AudioPhool I'll probably spend 1500€ for the small difference

 

[hanumanbob]

That's what I suspected, but since I'm an AudioPhool I'll probably spend 1500€ for the small difference

I think you'd get a bigger bang for the money with another set of headphones Like an E3

 

[IXOYE]

I think you'd get a bigger bang for the money with another set of headphones Like an E3

You're probably right, the E3s are very interesting, but I really love my 800s and I doubt that E3 is better for me as they are closed, but I can be wrong, I have to listen to them first when I got an opportunity.

 

[hanumanbob]

You're probably right, the E3s are very interesting, but I really love my 800s and I doubt that E3 is better for me as they are closed, but I can be wrong, I have to listen to them first when I got an opportunity.

I still think you should use the RME as DAC and order an FA 10 from Flux for $750 I found that this combo was especially excellent for the 800s. And considering you have a hardware EQ you can't go wrong.

 

[IXOYE]

I'm thinking of hooking up my RME ADI-2 FS with an external amplifier, I found this info on the RME forum.

"CASE 1, analog volume control:

To maximize ADI-2's dynamic range (S/N ratio) it's best to have ADI-2's volume control at 0 dB, using the external ANALOG AMP's volume control to set listening level:

• Set external amp's volume control to middle position or some above.
• Switch OFF ADI-2's "Auto Reference Level".
• Set ADI-2's volume control to 0 dB.
• Select the reference level that fits best to your loudness demands.
• Use the ext. amp's volume dial to control the final loudness.

• Once you start to use any of ADI-2's DSP functions like e.g. the EQ:
- Compensate possible level boosts with ADI-2's volume control until the Level Meter does not show overs.
- Or switch back On "Auto Reference Level" and let ADI-2 calculate the best value.

CASE 2, digital volume control:

If you want to use ADI-2's digital volume control to set listening level, ADI-2 DAC / (Pro) has a clever option that increases the usable dynamic range by 18 / (20) dB: "Auto Reference Level":

• Switch ON ADI-2's "Auto Reference Level".
• Set ADI-2 DAC's (Pro's) volume control to -18 / (-20) dBr. (1)
• Set ext. amp's volume control (or passive attenuators) slightly above your normal listening level.
• Use the ADI-2's volume control to set the final listening level.

Now ADI-2 automatically adapts the reference level for best fit to your loudness demands, while maximizing it's DAC's dynamic range.

If your external amp does not have a volume control, use variable passive attenuators to fit the level:"

If I want to use all functions such as, for example, Loudness on RME I have read that only CASE 2 will work, but what I wonder about is why I should only raise the volume on the amplifier to a little above my normal listening level, why not set it at max? Am I not using the amp to the max if I doesn't?

 

[evhvis]

I'm thinking of hooking up my RME ADI-2 FS with an external amplifier, I found this info on the RME forum.

"CASE 1, analog volume control:

To maximize ADI-2's dynamic range (S/N ratio) it's best to have ADI-2's volume control at 0 dB, using the external ANALOG AMP's volume control to set listening level:

• Set external amp's volume control to middle position or some above.
• Switch OFF ADI-2's "Auto Reference Level".
• Set ADI-2's volume control to 0 dB.
• Select the reference level that fits best to your loudness demands.
• Use the ext. amp's volume dial to control the final loudness.

• Once you start to use any of ADI-2's DSP functions like e.g. the EQ:
- Compensate possible level boosts with ADI-2's volume control until the Level Meter does not show overs.
- Or switch back On "Auto Reference Level" and let ADI-2 calculate the best value.

CASE 2, digital volume control:

If you want to use ADI-2's digital volume control to set listening level, ADI-2 DAC / (Pro) has a clever option that increases the usable dynamic range by 18 / (20) dB: "Auto Reference Level":

• Switch ON ADI-2's "Auto Reference Level".
• Set ADI-2 DAC's (Pro's) volume control to -18 / (-20) dBr. (1)
• Set ext. amp's volume control (or passive attenuators) slightly above your normal listening level.
• Use the ADI-2's volume control to set the final listening level.

Now ADI-2 automatically adapts the reference level for best fit to your loudness demands, while maximizing it's DAC's dynamic range.

If your external amp does not have a volume control, use variable passive attenuators to fit the level:"

If I want to use all functions such as, for example, Loudness on RME I have read that only CASE 2 will work, but what I wonder about is why I should only raise the volume on the amplifier to a little above my normal listening level, why not set it at max? Am I not using the amp to the max if I doesn't?

Setting the auto ref on and set the volume control to -6 is the best option IMO. Gives you close to 2 volts out, leaves 6db headroom and is equivalent to setting +7dBu gain and 0 on the volume. It will automatically go to +13dBu if you turn on EQ. If the external amp has gain settings than set them as low as possible while leaving yourself enough headroom on the amp to be able to turn up the volume to loud enough on all types of music.

Some amps can take the full +13dBu and in those cases you may want to set the volume to 0 and either auto ref or +13dBu if you don't plan to use the EQ or similar. Just be aware that a lot of amps will distort with +13dBu on the input.

 

[IXOYE]

Setting the auto ref on and set the volume control to -6 is the best option IMO. Gives you close to 2 volts out, leaves 6db headroom and is equivalent to setting +7dBu gain and 0 on the volume. It will automatically go to +13dBu if you turn on EQ. If the external amp has gain settings than set them as low as possible while leaving yourself enough headroom on the amp to be able to turn up the volume to loud enough on all types of music.

Some amps can take the full +13dBu and in those cases you may want to set the volume to 0 and either auto ref or +13dBu if you don't plan to use the EQ or similar. Just be aware that a lot of amps will distort with +13dBu on the input.

Thanks, but according to RME the loudness option will only work if you use RME to control the volume, and for me using RME for adjusting volume would be more user-friendly the way I will have it set up.

But my question still remains, why shouldn't I set the volume knob to a higher value on the amp than slightly above my normal listening level? that's what i don't understand.

 

[evhvis]

Thanks, but according to RME the loudness option will only work if you use RME to control the volume, and for me using RME for adjusting volume would be more user-friendly the way I will have it set up.

But my question still remains, why shouldn't I set the volume knob to a higher value on the amp than slightly above my normal listening level? that's what i don't understand.

Gain settings lower or increase the gain on an amp. The volume controls on an amp work after the gain settings have done their job. If you lower the gain by -18dB on an amp then you might not have enough range on the volume control to go loud enough and if you have +12dB gain on you might not have much usable range on the volume control before it gets too loud. Ideal is to have normal volume somewhere around 12 o'clock on the volume knob while being able to go loud enough on music that is mastered at low levels. Gain settings and volume control are two separate things that work together on most amps. Some amps do not have gain settings, which can be an issue with headphones varying a lot in sensitivity.

Analog volume controls lower both incoming noise and volume while digital volume controls typically only lower the volume. Personally I prefer to optimize gain in the playback chain and then use the volume control on my amplifiers rather than using volume controls on the source.

Setting the auto-ref to on and volume to -6 on the RME means the volume control is still available, it just doesn't do anything as you have 0dB attenuation and the -6 is done in hardware/output stage switching. As soon as you add EQ that goes above 0dBfs the unit will switch on the hardware output stages for +13dBu. The loudness and EQ are available with these settings.

 

[IXOYE]

Setting the auto-ref to on and volume to -6 on the RME means the volume control is still available, it just doesn't do anything as you have 0dB attenuation and the -6 is done in hardware/output stage switching. As soon as you add EQ that goes above 0dBfs the unit will switch on the hardware output stages for +13dBu. The loudness and EQ are available with these settings.

Thanks for the explanation, I think I understand now

 

[TK33]

Gain settings lower or increase the gain on an amp. The volume controls on an amp work after the gain settings have done their job. If you lower the gain by -18dB on an amp then you might not have enough range on the volume control to go loud enough and if you have +12dB gain on you might not have much usable range on the volume control before it gets too loud. Ideal is to have normal volume somewhere around 12 o'clock on the volume knob while being able to go loud enough on music that is mastered at low levels. Gain settings and volume control are two separate things that work together on most amps. Some amps do not have gain settings, which can be an issue with headphones varying a lot in sensitivity.

Analog volume controls lower both incoming noise and volume while digital volume controls typically only lower the volume. Personally I prefer to optimize gain in the playback chain and then use the volume control on my amplifiers rather than using volume controls on the source.

Setting the auto-ref to on and volume to -6 on the RME means the volume control is still available, it just doesn't do anything as you have 0dB attenuation and the -6 is done in hardware/output stage switching. As soon as you add EQ that goes above 0dBfs the unit will switch on the hardware output stages for +13dBu. The loudness and EQ are available with these settings.

I have my RME ADI-2 DAC FS feeding a NAD M10 V2 via RCA and do something similar but use -4.5 db (fixed) with Auto Ref ON. Has been working fine for me. I used the attached chart to set the volume on my RME ADI-2 and I haven't had any issues. I forget where I found this sp I can't give proper credit (could have been from this thread) but hopefully it helps.

 

[IXOYE]

I am using EQ and I would like to use a setting that eliminates the problem of overloading the signal, I thought Auto Ref would fix that automatically, have I understood correctly then?

 

[Jagamov]

I am using EQ and I would like to use a setting that eliminates the problem of overloading the signal, I thought Auto Ref would fix that automatically, have I understood correctly then?

Thanks for posting these questions. I thought I had mine set right, but now I'm not sure. I see OVR sometimes, but I never paid much attention to it. Seems I need too.

I'm using the XLR out with it set to +7db and volume locked at 0 db.... That might not be right...

 

[hanumanbob]

Thanks for posting these questions. I thought I had mine set right, but now I'm not sure. I see OVR sometimes, but I never paid much attention to it. Seems I need too.

I'm using the XLR out with it set to +7db and volume locked at 0 db.... That might not be right...

What i use