[Omega17TheTrue]

The new roc seem VERY interesting but i still wonder is balanced is worth the extra money especially pre-amping studio monitors.

 
edit : yes i bet he will make all his products a musical version.

 

[nigeljames]

I wonder if there is a 'musical' Phoenix in the pipeline?

 

[FauDrei]

Opa! Diamond buffer Roc... Monster power, but I doubt is in class A... Still, I'd like to compare to my more current/lower bias ACSS Roc.
 
Sometime I wonder if this "unit" called KingWa is in fact some Chinese Borg Collective...

 

[Zombie_X]

Holy crap!! The power output for 600Ohm headphones has been doubled!! Must buy... but need to sell the current ROC first.....

 

[TigzStudio]

I dunno man I am loving my "old" Roc still with balanced/ACSS, and it holds its own against my newly aquired Stacker II.... 
 
Maybe when I get my LCD-2's I will be able to tell a bigger difference than with the dt-880's.  
 
So what does he change to make the "new" Roc musical?

 

[FauDrei]

Everything: input stage does not convert voltage to current signals, gain is not ACSS, output is diamond differential, volume pot is new relay design, PS has better discrete regulation (only, I think, it is not class A because of output power amount)... Just the case remained the same.
 
Amazing.
 
I admit moments of weakness seeing this... but I'll keep my "neutral" and "transparent" "old" Roc. It is too good ACSS combination with RE-1 to let it go.
 
...but if in couple of months current mode Roc or, God help my wallet, Phoenix gets updated...

 

[yukechuuka]

Awesome review.
 
Now if only I could afford it.. sigh. 

 

[tim3320070]

I wonder what would work better if one is looking for a little color in the sound- his Ref-8 DAC with a neutral amp like the original Roc or the Ref-1 with the warm Roc (or warm DAC and amp)?

 

[realmassy]

Quote:

Everything: input stage does not convert voltage to current signals, gain is not ACSS, output is diamond differential, volume pot is new relay design, PS has better discrete regulation (only, I think, it is not class A because of output power amount)... Just the case remained the same.
 
Amazing.
 
I admit moments of weakness seeing this... but I'll keep my "neutral" and "transparent" "old" Roc. It is too good ACSS combination with RE-1 to let it go.
 
...but if in couple of months current mode Roc or, God help my wallet, Phoenix gets updated...

Some moments of weakness for me as well
But I like the sound of my rig now, I can't see how a warmer signature can improve it. The combination of Audio-GD electronics and the HE-5(LE) is very very good, as you did suggest, so I'll stick with my amp and enjoy the music.

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

I wonder what would work better if one is looking for a little color in the sound- his Ref-8 DAC with a neutral amp like the original Roc or the Ref-1 with the warm Roc (or warm DAC and amp)?

My thought is always, get a colourless source. If you want a little colour, there are plenty of amps out there that have just that.  However, if your source is already coloured, then you're going to end up playing a harder game of gear matching.  That being said, regal reckons that the non-ACSS DAC he has isn't that coloured anyway.  It could be that every time I see "musical" mentioned with Audio-gd gear, I think of the Moon OPAMP which was described that way, and is very distinctly audibly and measurably not neutral. 

 

[realmassy]

If you want a different sound signature then change your headphones.
Headphones (and speakers) have major impact on the sound, and you replace them easily. Amp and source should not add or remove anything, just be as transparent as possible, so you can play with headphones to find the right sound. 

 

[TigzStudio]

Quote:

If you want a different sound signature then change your headphones.
Headphones (and speakers) have major impact on the sound, and you replace them easily. Amp and source should not add or remove anything, just be as transparent as possible, so you can play with headphones to find the right sound. 

This ^^ is what I am after as well.....the last piece to the puzzle will hopefully be the LCD's

 

[tim3320070]

All good responses- but so many here use gear and sources that add some richness/smoothness to the sound (vinyl, tubes, etc.) and that's what I find I am wanting after all the experiments with headphones. It seems a lot of good headphones offer detail at the expense of harshness in the treble (which I cannot tolerate)- my recent experiment will see if the source can soften these likable headphones (Grado, Beyer,Hifiman). Neutral is great for a small percentage of good recordings I am finding.
 

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

If you want a different sound signature then change your headphones.
Headphones (and speakers) have major impact on the sound, and you replace them easily. Amp and source should not add or remove anything, just be as transparent as possible, so you can play with headphones to find the right sound. 

I agree, generally, as well.  However, I did have a "musical" tube amp here for a while, which with HD-800s, was fantastic. The problem is, there isn't an equivalent headphone to the HD-800s, except maybe now the Audeze.

 

[Ypoknons]

I think one of the key appeals for amp&dac coloration is that it introduces us to new (subtle) colorations we like, even if that combination is possible from an EQ it might just be a setting we just haven't tried or didn't know we liked. That's my theory, at least.