[richbass]

Hey Baycode, How does it compare to DT150 ?

 

[Baycode]

 
Hey Baycode, How does it compare to DT150 ?

[COLOR=FF0000]DT150 (closed back HP, 250 ohm)  vs   X2  (open back HP, 30 ohm):[/COLOR]


They do have a good fight in my possession. I can get near-equally good pleasure from both of them. So what are the differences?

DT150 bass section is slightly tighter (only very slightly). But as being a closed headphone one can predict this...

Sub bass is slightly tilted on DT150 compared to other frequencies. But this doesn't mean that DT150 shows this character on every song or every passage -only if the recording calls for it. On the other hand X2 bass section generally have more body and surprisingly -slightly- more detail (after 100 h burn-in). X2 also shows the bass with body if the recording calls for it (one of a good sign for a good HP for me).

Highs are  very competitive for both. My general feeling is that X2 delivers slightly smoother highs. On some recording passages, and if the sound level is high, both of these headphones "may" show some slightly peaky highs (grittiness is better term). But I think this is not the fault of the headphones (both DT150 and X2). Its the nature of the recording and listening level -IMO-. But highs do never made fatigue for me (for both HP's)...

Mids are close in quantity (If you swap each HP, at first you start to think that the mids sound slightly distant on X2. But after some seconds brain makes some adjustments (psychoacoustics) and the mids are excellent after that adjustment period for X2).

Intimacy is slightly better for X2. You just sank in to music and never want to take the HP out of your head!

X2 is slightly warmer than DT150 in general, where DT150 is also slightly warmer compared to neutral HP's. So, for me X2 is a warm HP.

Sound-stage is definitely wider on X2, where depth and height are near equal with DT150. On the other hand DT150 sound-stage width is not as wide but its not compressed like some of the closed back headphones as well. I like the sound-stage on X2 better. This is only because soundstage width is wider on them (I like my soundstage -width, height, depth- to be near equal and very wide).

Imaging is near equal for both. They are both excellent on this department.

Layering is better on X2. I really like this technicality of X2. IMO its one of its biggest strengths (but less people appreciate this character, I don't know why). Also X2 sounds more airier (one can predict this because X2 is open backed HP).

Clarity is very very good for both. Sometimes I feel DT150 takes the lead, sometimes I think X2 is better. You know what I mean. If two headphones are very close to being excellent it becomes very hard to put one of them on the front...

For comfort all I can say that X2 is the most comfortable HP I have ever put on my head and ears. Although DT150 can not be classified as uncomfortable -if I have to compare the both- X2 takes the lead.

If I speak only for my full sized HP's, generally I prefer to listen to the X2. It consumes my 70% head time. Other 30% is consumed by other HP's and DT150 takes that lead inside that 30% (at the period though, this may change in future, dunno).


A side note: If you prefer more neutral and natural sound, DT150 is slightly better from "this" perspective -compared to X2...
>Also if you need more isolation and don't want sound leakage then DT150 have to take the lead...


For these comparisons I have used: 

Lenovo Netbook -> GO720 -> HP's 

or Lenovo Netbook -> GO720 -> DV 336SE (front Psvane CV181 TII Classic tube, rear Zaerix or RCA Military tube)  -> HP's 

or iPod Touch 4th Gen Lineout -> DV336SE (front Psvane CV181 TII Classic tube, rear Zaerix or RCA Military tube)  -> HP's 


Note: GO720 with latest firmware 1V5 and driver.

 

[peter123]

@Baycode
Thank you for making me wanting both of them now 

 
Great and thorough comparison as always!

 

[richbass]

   
DT150 (closed back HP, 250 ohm)  vs   X2  (open back HP, 30 ohm):
 
 
They do have a good fight in my possession. I can get near-equally good pleasure from both of them. So what are the differences?
 
DT150 bass section is slightly tighter (only very slightly). But as being a closed headphone one can predict this...
 
Sub bass is slightly tilted on DT150 compared to other frequencies. But this doesn't mean that DT150 shows this character on every song or every passage -only if the recording calls for it. On the other hand X2 bass section generally have more body and surprisingly -slightly- more detail (after 100 h burn-in). X2 also shows the bass with body if the recording calls for it (one of a good sign for a good HP for me).
 
Highs are  very competitive for both. My general feeling is that X2 delivers slightly smoother highs. On some recording passages, and if the sound level is high, both of these headphones "may" show some slightly peaky highs (grittiness is better term). But I think this is not the fault of the headphones (both DT150 and X2). Its the nature of the recording and listening level -IMO-. But highs do never made fatigue for me (for both HP's)...
 
Mids are close in quantity (If you swap each HP, at first you start to think that the mids sound slightly distant on X2. But after some seconds brain makes some adjustments (psychoacoustics) and the mids are excellent after that adjustment period for X2).
 
Intimacy is slightly better for X2. You just sank in to music and never want to take the HP out of your head!
 
X2 is slightly warmer than DT150 in general, where DT150 is also slightly warmer compared to neutral HP's. So, for me X2 is a warm HP.
 
Sound-stage is definitely wider on X2, where depth and height are near equal with DT150. On the other hand DT150 sound-stage width is not as wide but its not compressed like some of the closed back headphones as well. I like the sound-stage on X2 better. This is only because soundstage width is wider on them (I like my soundstage -width, height, depth- to be near equal and very wide).
 
Imaging is near equal for both. They are both excellent on this department.
 
Layering is better on X2. I really like this technicality of X2. IMO its one of its biggest strengths (but less people appreciate this character, I don't know why). Also X2 sounds more airier (one can predict this because X2 is open backed HP).
 
Clarity is very very good for both. Sometimes I feel DT150 takes the lead, sometimes I think X2 is better. You know what I mean. If two headphones are very close to being excellent it becomes very hard to put one of them on the front...
 
For comfort all I can say that X2 is the most comfortable HP I have ever put on my head and ears. Although DT150 can not be classified as uncomfortable -if I have to compare the both- X2 takes the lead.
 
If I speak only for my full sized HP's, generally I prefer to listen to the X2. It consumes my 70% head time. Other 30% is consumed by other HP's and DT150 takes that lead inside that 30% (at the period though, this may change in future, dunno).
 
 
A side note: If you prefer more neutral sound, DT150 is slightly better from "this" perspective...
>Also if you need more isolation and don't want sound leakage than DT150 have to take the lead...
 
 
For these comparisons I have used: 
 
Lenovo Netbook -> GO720 -> HP's 
 
or Lenovo Netbook -> GO720 -> DV 336SE (front Psvane CV181 TII Classic tube, rear Zaerix or RCA Military tube)  -> HP's 
 
or iPod Touch 4th Gen Lineout -> DV336SE (front Psvane CV181 TII Classic tube, rear Zaerix or RCA Military tube)  -> HP's 
 
 
Note: GO720 with latest firmware 1V5 and driver.

Thank you so much man ! How would the Valhalla 2 pair with DT150 ? Better than DV336SE ?

 

[Baycode]

  @Baycode
Thank you for making me wanting both of them now 

 
Great and thorough comparison as always!

 
You're welcome my friend @peter123  and, as always, never ending sentence "sorry about the wallet"

  
 
PS: wait for me re-modding the T50RP man!
 
 
 
Quote:

 
Thank you so much man ! How would the Valhalla 2 pair with DT150 ? Better than DV336SE ?

 
You're welcome

 
You may be able to reach someone who pairs DT150 with Valhalla 2 on the DT150 threads (I hope). So it's better to ask the question there...  Since I don't have and didn't heard Valhalla 2, I am sorry that I am not be able to compare them...

 

[Zennheiserie8]

Excellent review Baycode! I just received my X2s this week from Amazon in the US. I listened to them once or twice after unboxing at work and thought they were pleasant enough. They didn't quite knock my socks off though, and I began lamenting that I'd made it to the precipice of "diminishing returns" in audio gear. At first I thought they were a perfectly worthy addition to a headphone stable including my NAD HP50s, Sennheiser HD600s, Dennon AHD 2000s et al but they didn't really seem to differentiate.
 
Today I've begun listening to them in earnest. Right now I am doing the obligatory run through Dire Straits' "Brothers in Arms" an album I know inside and out on the HD600 and AHD 2000s.
 
The X2s are Incredible! Listening to music on them I no longer feel any concerns about how they compare to the other headphones I mentioned. This is because it is just genuinely, rhapsodically gratifying listening to music on them.
 
I was persuaded to pre-order them from Amazon a few weeks ago based on Tyll's review on Inner Fidelity. Today as I found myself genuinely enjoying albums I've heard a million times before as though I were hearing then anwew I started browsing the web to read even more about these amazing headphones. That's when I found this thread.
 
Kudos to Baycode. From my perspective your impressions are spot on and not exaggerated in the least. These are standout headphones. For others who are wondering about these headphones, based on my benchmark headphones, listed here, I can't recommend these enough.
 
I really don't *want* to find myself typing they are "better" than the HD600, a possibility alluded to on Inner Fidelity... but I do think the presentation of the hi frequencies is different, and to my ears more natural. The sound stage is much wider, and the bass is much more present without sounding remotely hyped... all this with less than 20 hours "burn in" / "brain in" (whatever it is due to, speaking for myself, subjectively, I do find I tend to react differently to headphones over time).
 
Based on my palate for comparison I'd suggest subjectively I experience these as a bit of a hybrid between the Dennon AHD2000 and the Senn HD600. They have have the weight of the Dennon's, with things located certainly and positioned firmly within the soundstage ... all with perhaps a hair less bloat and a touch more control in the bottom end, and they have the "motion", the openness and, more importantly, the mids of the HD600.
 
Again I have much further to go with them in the ... "burn in" / "brain in" adaptive cycle... but as of the moment I think these headphones are so impressive I thought I would chime in. Since these headphones are only just now reaching those of us who pre-ordered it occurred to me there might be some value to providing a testimonial.
 
Headphone junkies with sufficient disposable income to check these out will be rewarded with the genuine joys that accompany falling in love with a new pair of headphones all over again. For my part ... it's just really a magical thing hearing a headphone that makes me stop and listen to things all over again.
 
They're great. Enjoy a pair as able. Cheers!

 

[Stochastic]

Thanks so much for posting your impressions Zennheiserie8!  I was torn between getting the NAD HP50s and the Philips Fidelio X2s as an upgrade to my trusty ATH-M50s.  In the end I've decided to go with the X2s as they are in a different league with regards to build quality and aesthetics in my opinion.  I was also eager to try open-back headphones and experience a wide sound stage.  
 
I know you're still adjusting to the X2s, but how would you say they compare to the NAD HP50s?  

 

[Zennheiserie8]

Hi,
 
I think the NAD 50s are incredible. I think both these headphones are incredible, but they are very different animals. The NAD 50 is a much more versatile headphone because it has a closed back, and is more portable. (The earcups pivot flat, and it weighs less).
 
Rather than saying one is better and one is worse, what I will say is that it is exciting to perceive that progress and genuine improvements are being made in what I might have previously considered to be "the standard" available through headphone listening. This progress is starting to emerge with the most recent generation of benchmark headphones.
 
Rather than being *more* of a stand out than the NAD HP50 I think what I want to convey is that the X2 is *as much* of a standout as the HP50.
 
With that said, I still really like the Dennon and Sennheisers I mentioned. To clarify my comments, I don't think there is a "better" or "worse" element to great headphones. It's more a matter of taking into account that spending a lot of time with a headphone, is just that, an investment of a lot of time. I don't think that there is one headphone that is going to be so much better than all other headphones that I would want to spend all my time only with that headphone. Rather, I wouldn't want to waste time with a headphone that isn't really interesting and rewarding to listen to in the first place.
 
To me the X2 AND the NAD Hp 50 fall into the category of amazingly interesting and rewarding headphones to listen to. So do the Dennon and Sennheiser. I'm glad I have all of them and have gotten to spend time with all of them. The reason I mention them in my previous post is to help follks who are also trying to budget not only their funds, but their time, to take notice of the X2 and let them know that for one listener who has spent time with other well regarded headphones, the X2 are worthy of the investment of time as well as funds.
 
By mentioning such well regarded headphones as the NAD, Dennon and Sennheiser I was trying to say the X2 is going to be in the same league. It's not better... but the big news for lovers of those headphones is going to be... *it's not worse*. That is the X2 is in the absolute top tier of headphones, at least so far as I've ever personally heard relative to the benchmark pairs I mention.
 
What makes a headphone worthy of being in the top tier? Precisely the fact that there is something about it which is so enjoyable that it's not possible to say another headphone is "better" than it is. So I can't say the NAD 50 is "better" than the X2... just as I can't say the X2 is "better" than the NAD 50... Rather I want to spend time with *each* of them because they both provide something, for me, which makes it incredibly fun enjoyable to listen to music. Not only that, but they each provide something the other doesn't. With that said... the differences are subtle, like flavors. I would never choose to eat only Itallian and never Chinese. But some nights I would rather one type of dinner as opposed to another.
 
What I can say is that if funds are tight, and you can only get one, then for mechanical, technical, logistical reasons, go with the NAD. As noted above I don't think the X2 is "better" than the NAD 50... but the NAD is more portable and you can listen to it in more situations. (Though just a note, the headband on the NAD 50 is almost horizontal, so you can wind up looking like a cyberman from "Doctor Who" when wearing a pair).
 
There are some distinct differences that are a function of physics. The NAD are tighter in the bass. The X2 are a bit more "open" in the mids. But that is a function of the fact a closed back headphone (NAD) benefits from a controlled amount of air around the drivers, and an open back (the X2) from the free movement of air around the drivers.
 
Beyond this I think there are subtle differences of character rather than of quality. They both have very very impressive sound stages, but there are some differences in how I am experiencing the soundstages. Personally I feel more surrounded and immersed by the X2. It is lush, and I feel I'm being surrounded by music. The NAD gives me a sense that I'm in front of a performance, and that is an amazing thing too. So no better or worse. Put another way I think the NAD make me feel more like I'm listening in a concert hall and the X2 make me feel more like I'm listening in some sort of immersive environment like a planetarium.
 
I think they are both great. The NAD 50 are a well regarded and loved headphone that have rightly and rapidly stood out out as ahead of the pack in the world of headphone enthusiasts. The point of my post is just to provide one more bit of "crowd sourced" testamonial that the early buzz from Baycode and Inner Fidelity is, in my experience, spot on. The X2 are another "must hear" for folks who love headphones. They are as good, to my ears, as the great ones I mentioned. But you will find they are all worth spending time with. I note Baycode mentioned in the original review the X2 made it difficult to go back to some AKG headphones. I would agree with that. Subjectively I thought the NAD 50s were also ahead of the AKG headphones, and I also preferred the Dennons / Sennheiser to AKG. That's just a matter of my personal taste. Others might not agree. I think the X2 are probably the most impressive open backed pair I've heard (but can't really admit that to myself because the HD600 are phones I wanted as a kid, and I felt like a real live grown up when I finally got a pair). So... I don't know that they make it impossible for me to go back and enjoy my other favorite pairs of headphones, but they sure make it clear to me that I only want to spend time with headphones that have *as* deep an emotional impact on me as my favorite headphones.
 
The X2 are now on my list of favorite headphones, but personally, I think you will enjoy any one of the ones I mentioned greatly.

 

[CoiL]

Zennheiserie8 ,what are You using for amping and DAC ? Sry if I missed You mentioning it.

 

[Zennheiserie8]

I use both a Corda Head Five and a Little Dot Mark II+. I tend to prefer the Little Dot set for high impedence with the Senns and the Corda with the Dennons (helps tighten them a bit). I will sometimes run from a computer going from a Yamaha outboard DAC (an I88x which is part of a DAW interface rather than being a dedicated standalone DAC) and also (for convenience sometimes) 30 pin out from a 5th gen Ipod. When mobile I will use a Fiio Mont Blanc to Ipod. Sooo... I must confess I tend to invest more in headphones than in signal chain... and it is absolutely true that can have *significant* impact. Per the review on Inner Fidelity an OTA on the Senns could take them up a notch (and I was pricing a bottle head crack for a bit... but then... heh... I saw the review of the X2! and ordered them... so yes, impulse (to buy) response on phones tends to hit me hard...)
 
Having noted all that... I think CoiL's question is a good one in this context. Because as much as I have rhapsodized about the X2 being on par with my other favorite phones... I did also mention I have less than 20 hrs burn in time on the X2. So far I have only heard them on the Corda, which is solid state... so no feedback yet on how they play with tubes.

 

[Stochastic]

Thank you again for your detailed and informative response Zennheiserie8!  It's members such as yourself that help make Head-Fi such a great community and very welcoming to neophytes like me.
 
I agree wholeheartedly that headphones can't always be ranked in a straightforward, hierarchical way.  Your food analogy is very apt--different sound signatures can be just as valid as different flavors.  After all, the end goal here is enjoyment and not necessarily "perfect", faithful reproduction (whatever that might mean).  
 
With access to unlimited funds I'd love to audition all of the headphones you've mentioned.  Alas, I can't justify the expense at this time so I'm forced into making a difficult decision.  Given their closed nature and light weight I think that the NAD 50s would be the more practical choice.  However, I already have a semi-decent set of closed headphones for portable use (ATH-M50s), and I'm really drawn to the build quality and open, airy sound of the X2s.  Is this the "best" choice?  Who knows, but as you say, any one of these headphones is capable of offering an enjoyable listening experience.
 
And yes, it is very exciting that things seem to be moving forward in the mid-grade headphone space.  Audio is tricky in that it isn't always obvious what is an improvement relative to what has come before.  I think that both NAD and Philips are on the right track, NAD by leveraging Harman's and Sean Olive's research into target response curves for headphones and Philips with their empirically driven approach to headphone design.  I wish we could see this level of dedication and scientific objectivity from all manufacturers!     
 
EDIT:  Here's a worthwhile read on the relationship between headphone measurements and sound perception: http://seanolive.blogspot.com/2013/04/the-relationship-between-perception-and.html

 

[CoiL]

Fidelio X1 is huge jump up from ATH-M50 imho, so X2 should be even better.

 

[trip5]

Great review! The X2s are out of stock on amazon. Must resist buying! 

 

[Zennheiserie8]

Cool Stochastic! A closed back and now an open back! That's how great collections begin. Again I do think the Nad 50 are fantastic, but the X2 are as well, and yes, it makes total sense to try out the differences between closed back design and open back first hand. Again, the open back will only be an option in some environments, when there isn't a lot of noise around you, and when there is no one around whom you don't want hearing what you are listening to, but if you are planning to use them in the right conditions... oh my! You are in for a treat! Been continuing my listening today. The imaging on these is the most impressive I have personally heard (I've pretty much kept in this range of cost and don't have experience with things like Audeze or electro stats).
 
Right now I'm listening to "six Marimbas" by Steve Reich and it is a really remarkable experience. I'm enjoying these headphones as much as any other headphone I've ever been excited about. Given the possibilities of "burn in" / "brain in" and the fact I still have less than 30 hrs. on these who knows how far this is going to go? I don't necessarily *want* to wind up preferring one set of headphones over others, but I certainly don't currently prefer any others ahead of the X2. Very very impressed.
 
You will have a blast!
 
Re: articles... yep agreed on all points. Very excited for you, and anyone else getting a pair of the X2. Sooo enjoying listening to them. This is just fun!
 
Cheers

 

[406976]

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