[Whitigir]

The question would be...why didn't Onkyo use Exynos or Mediatek, which are known to be more friendly to DAC than snapdragon ?

 

[Sonic Defender]

   
It can be done. Simple engineering.
You can even implement a switch to switch it on/off, so really, how hard would switching it permanently off be?

Yes, but why would they I guess is my question, and more importantly do we know that they did? Is there any reason why they would have to disable the audio circuit or couldn't it just be left and not accessed?

 

[Sonic Defender]

@Zenifyx, here is something I would like to ask as it seems you might have some information to share on this. So my Blackberry Leap had excellent sound quality, and that I assume was done through the Snapdragon CPU as well. I could never find any information about whether or not there was any additional DAC circuitry on the leap so that is an assumption I am making. The real question I have is what type of amplification circuit would be used by the Leap? Would Blackberry simply spec a very basic amp, or is a CPU also capable of having analogue output circuitry integrated into it? I should just Google some tare downs, but I thought I would ask.

 

[Whitigir]

Ok I found the note 3 to use Snapdragon 801 and the tear down reveals MSM8974 is the CPU 801 and WCD9320 as DAC audio codec (Separately)

http://www.techinsights.com/teardown.com/samsung-galaxy-note-3/

That was why I Assumed that DP-X1 if does not have or use WCDxxx...then it doesn't have Snapdragon DAC...but who knows ? So far everything I have seen from Snapdragon devices, there are always WCDxxx as Audio Codec or DAC from Snaodragon which is Separately from the CPU itself. So being separately by itself, could it be just not implemented ?

Snapshot

 

[Sonic Defender]

Ok I found the note 3 to use Snapdragon 801 and the tear down reveals MSM8970 is the CPU 801 and WCD9320 as DAC audio codec (Separately)

http://www.techinsights.com/teardown.com/samsung-galaxy-note-3/

That was why I Assumed that DP-X1 if does not have or use WCDxxx...then it doesn't have Snapdragon DAC...but who knows ? So far everything I have seen from Snapdragon devices, there are always WCDxxx as Audio Codec or DAC from Snaodragon which is Separately from the CPU itself.

Desn't that tell us about how Samsung did the implementation, but not anything about how Onkyo implemented the 801? As well, that doesn't tell us that the CPU doesn't still have the audio on it, but rather that Samsung opted to bypass it for another DAC chip. It would be interesting to know why they made that decision? It would be awesome if somebody with really hands on knowledge in the smartphone world was able to tell us why these things are done. I find it fascinating, but I have no skills in this area at all.

 

[Whitigir]

Desn't that tell us about how Samsung did the implementation, but not anything about how Onkyo implemented the 801? As well, that doesn't tell us that the CPU doesn't still have the audio on it, but rather that Samsung opted to bypass it for another DAC chip. It would be interesting to know why they made that decision? It would be awesome if somebody with really hands on knowledge in the smartphone world was able to tell us why these things are done. I find it fascinating, but I have no skills in this area at all.

Yeah, I would love to learn more, because every Snapdragon Devices I have come across all of them uses WCDxxx Audio codec (which is Snapdragon DAC)...and we need DP-x1 tear down for confirmation

 

[addyg]

I honestly do not believe DP-X1 has Snapdragon DAC in there. Only ES 9018 and 2x of them ? If it default, I think it would default back to 1 of them

Agreed. From day 1, I am testing (with my ears) if many different Apps, they all share something common in sound signature. Therefore it proves the theory of of only one (or two) 9018 dac in this thing. If not, there's got to be an App you can hear it is phone like CPU dac in working.

Most people say there is a CPU dac is based on fiio x7 where there is a so call white list function. But this thing is not Onkyo from day 1.

The two dap are different. While dp-x1 share some functions from its Onkyo desktop amp (or Teac 501 series) where you find the same D.filter of Sharp/Slow,,,etc.

 

[Sonic Defender]

Yeah, I would love to learn more, because every Snapdragon Devices I have come across all of them uses WCDxxx Audio codec (which is Snapdragon DAC)...and we need DP-x1 tear down for confirmation

Interesting, but still confusing. If they are going to integrate a separate DAC section, why even bother with audio processing on the CPU at all? Unless they need both sections as the work is divided? It would interesting to see if any phone for instance had just the CPU which would suggest that the CPU was being used for all the DAC without an additional DAC section to support it.

 

[Whitigir]

And here is the tear down on LG G4, the Snapdragon 808 is layered underneath the Ram. Separate DAC Qualcomm WCd9330 again

https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/LG+G4+Teardown/42705

As I stated before, Snapdragon Processors are integrated in a weird way that things gotta be linked together....say if you use SnapDragon CPU, one of it core inside need to be routed, connected toward SnapDragon DAC (which is separate) and this DAC usually code named WCD....that is why people call it "integrated"

Not like it is built within the Processor itself, but a part of it ? I don't know, I need an engineer who knows about this to confirm. But as what I have seen so far, it is like that, and every devices that I follow which has Snapdragon processor and it DAC together with Optional DAC...take Xiaomi, Vivo...all of those Smartphones = have problems with app accessing the optional DAC.

I don't even know if it is possible to have Snapdragon processor without implementing it DAC (WCDxxx?). I only assumed that Onkyo did not implement it due to what I heard. I heard obvious sound quality differences on Lg V10 between Snapdragon DAC, and then the ES9018. I was the first one to confirm the V10 3rd party app always default onto Snapdragon DAC....and only LG stock app can access Sabres (all by my ears and hearing experiences)

To me DP-X1 does not have the distinct differences when used in Single ended connection as Lg V10. Therefore, I assumed DP-X1 always default on 1 DAC ES9018, and no Snapdragon DAC

 

[Sonic Defender]

Agreed. From day 1, I am testing (with my ears) if many different Apps, they all share something common in sound signature. Therefore it proves the theory of of only one (or two) 9018 dac in this thing. If not, there's got to be an App you can hear it is phone like CPU dac in working.

Most people say there is a CPU dac is based on fiio x7 where there is a so call white list function. But this thing is not Onkyo from day 1.

The two dap are different. While dp-x1 share some functions from its Onkyo desktop amp (or Teac 501 series) where you find the same D.filter of Sharp/Slow,,,etc.

That is just speculation, none of us know if the CPU has the ability to do DAC work right on it. I'm not saying that it does, or that Onkyo would have left it enabled, but we really have no information to suggest otherwise just yet.

 

[addyg]

dp-x1 is in some way a miniature desktop design where you see Onkyo has over 65 years of experience. Where you see pcb are separated, inter-connected with jumper cables, each board supplied by independent power. I think the power part is mentioned when it release.

 

[Zenifyx]

Originally Posted by Sonic Defender /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 

Yes, but why would they I guess is my question, and more importantly do we know that they did? Is there any reason why they would have to disable the audio circuit or couldn't it just be left and not accessed?

 
I cannot comment with certainty whether or not they did, but do ask yourself: Why would they have kept that capability then?
 
 
Quote:

  @Zenifyx, here is something I would like to ask as it seems you might have some information to share on this. So my Blackberry Leap had excellent sound quality, and that I assume was done through the Snapdragon CPU as well. I could never find any information about whether or not there was any additional DAC circuitry on the leap so that is an assumption I am making. The real question I have is what type of amplification circuit would be used by the Leap? Would Blackberry simply spec a very basic amp, or is a CPU also capable of having analogue output circuitry integrated into it? I should just Google some tare downs, but I thought I would ask.

 
Barring official word from the manufacturer, that information would be best gathered from teardowns.
And well, a CPU with analogue output circuitry integrated wouldn't be a CPU...

 

[Whitigir]

Actually I was the first one to review Lg V10 which has Snapdragon and ES9018 as well. I heard the distinct differences between Snapdragon DAC and ES9018, and was the first one to confirm the differences when and which 3rd party app did automatically default onto Snapdragon DAC regardless of Hi-Fi mode turned on....yeah I can hear the differences.

I do not hear the differences on Dp-X1 in single ended connection as the V10 on 3rd party app. Therefore I assumes the DP-X1 does not have the Snapdragon DAC....because if it had, then 3rd party app would default onto it, and there would be sound quality differences.

 

[Sonic Defender]

Actually I was the first one to review Lg V10 which has Snapdragon and ES9018 as well. I heard the distinct differences between Snapdragon DAC and ES9018, and was the first one to confirm the differences.

I do not hear the differences on Dp-X1 in single ended connection as the V10 on 3rd party app. Therefore I assumes the DP-X1 does not have the Snapdragon DAC....because if it had, then 3rd party app would default onto it, and there would be sound quality differences.

That certainly sounds reasonable. I am still curious if there could be anything that might still need access to the CPU audio section? But, yes, based on the evidence it does seem to strongly suggest that all apps are using the full DAC capability of the DP-X1, which is good.

 

[sabloke]

Here's what I have found comparing My LG G4 that has a Snapdragon 808 with DP-X1. While playing Depeche Mode' Policy of Truth in 5.6 MHz DSD using Onkyo HF player, all six cores were active and the CPU use was around 18%. Playing the same file on DP-X1, only core 1 and 4 were active in both SE and balanced mode, with CPU use around 30%. It looks like something is doing the work of decoding that 1.2GB song on the DAP since 2 cores don't bother waking up
 
I have used CPU-Z to monitor CPU use.