[kova4a]

  What I think the OP is trying to say is that it is a risk spending $1000 on an item that cannot be returned without a large (and 20% + shipping both ways is large) hit. So he is ruminating on how a company could make it easier for the customer to hear it, while still being fair to the company. 1964 offers demos - you state a company can't afford to send 100's of demos out to people - that's a spurious argument. 1964 doesn't create a new demo for every time one is requested - I'm sure you have to wait for one to be available. And they make sure the shipping is borne by the prospective buyer. You seem to think it is proper to charge a prospective customer for the honor of just hearing a certain IEM (see bolded) - there I don't agree with you. This industry is a very subjective one - not everybody is going to hear the same thing - or like the same thing. We know Noble would rather not send out a demo - their belief is that to hear it is to love it - and for most that is probably true. But at the same time it can hamstring growth - but growth is not always a good thing (read: Roxanne rollout) But this disdain for those who would like to hear what they are buying before dropping a wad of cash is troubling. And lastly - you don't have a Verizon store or a Best Buy store near you? Are you on an island? Incarcerated? Locked in a basement? I'm fairly certain there is a cellular phone shop and an electronics store close by you.  In your argument you make valid points. I don't know why you need to resort to obstructionism. 

As I mentioned, it's possible to contact Noble to contact for a demo unit. No disdain for people who want to hear stuff before buying it. Everyone would like that option. In a perfect world everyone will have all of the newest and best gear in the store right behind the nearest street corner. I'm not affiliated with Noble and I bought the N4 without auditioning it or anything, so I understand your point. My point is that on some matters people attack Noble as if they are the only people doing a certain thing. Like the complaints and hateful comments about Noble not providing measurements and fp graphs for their product while 99.999999999% of the companies don't do it or just provide wrong info. The same goes for the demo units. Most of the companies in the high-end market don't do it for the average customer and people rely on luck and other people's opinion - thus one of the main reasons for head-fi to be so popular.
And I don't have verizon and bestbuy coz I'm in EU lol 

 

[kova4a]

And yes, if I'm in the US and a company is located in the US and they are marketing to US customers then I do hold priority in their eyes therefore making me more "special"

Nah, you don't - a priority customer is one who is willing to pay more and get the top of the line product, so in reality Asia should probably be every audiophile company main goal, coz it has the biggest audio market and many many times more "audiophiles" who are gladly willing to pay for the more expensive offering, especially when it's coming from a western company. And anyway, you're not more "special" than someone on the other side of the world coz both of you pay exactly the same amount of money.

 

[bobby12]

Nah, you don't - a priority customer is one who is willing to pay more and get the top of the line product, so in reality Asia should probably be every audiophile company main goal, coz it has the biggest audio market and many many times more "audiophiles" who are gladly willing to pay for the more expensive offering, especially when it's coming from a western company. And anyway, you're not more "special" than someone on the other side of the world coz both of you pay exactly the same amount of money.

If 1964 ears moved to china and sold there they would have a smaller market with more competition. A market is the people who can afford one and are willing to pay for it. Average salary in china is much lower than the US. CIEM is a luxury. US consumes more per head thus better market when selling a luxury.
And yes, I do take priority over international customers. There is more profit on me than something who lives outside their territory. It's also easier to deal with especially when it comes to customs. That's why verizon doesn't care much for you. You live in a place where there's less profit to be had. It would cost more to operate there, with a smaller market, and more competition, and being a US based company there will be some bias.
Anyone who has taken basic economics should know this. Looks like you're just blindly defending noble at this point.

 

[minhminh93]

Maybe, just maybe, those that Noble send out is not demo unit but actually retail unit, hence, the 20% fee. That would make sense imo as boxed vs unboxed product price are very different. You guys should wait for more clarification from Noble at this poiny.

 

[kh600rr]

If 1964 ears moved to china and sold there they would have a smaller market with more competition. A market is the people who can afford one and are willing to pay for it. Average salary in china is much lower than the US. CIEM is a luxury. US consumes more per head thus better market when selling a luxury.
And yes, I do take priority over international customers. There is more profit on me than something who lives outside their territory. It's also easier to deal with especially when it comes to customs. That's why verizon doesn't care much for you. You live in a place where there's less profit to be had. It would cost more to operate there, with a smaller market, and more competition, and being a US based company there will be some bias.
Anyone who has taken basic economics should know this. Looks like you're just blindly defending noble at this point.

It seems to me, that you have all the answers, on how someone should run there business, here's a thought, why don't you start up a audio company, then I'll be the very first person, you can mail a demo out, for only shipping costs Good luck with that by the way

 

[doublea71]

Oy vey so many MBAs in this forum...

 

[kova4a]

If 1964 ears moved to china and sold there they would have a smaller market with more competition. A market is the people who can afford one and are willing to pay for it. Average salary in china is much lower than the US. CIEM is a luxury. US consumes more per head thus better market when selling a luxury.
And yes, I do take priority over international customers. There is more profit on me than something who lives outside their territory. It's also easier to deal with especially when it comes to customs. That's why verizon doesn't care much for you. You live in a place where there's less profit to be had. It would cost more to operate there, with a smaller market, and more competition, and being a US based company there will be some bias.
Anyone who has taken basic economics should know this. Looks like you're just blindly defending noble at this point.

LOL Sorry but do you actually believe yourself? Do you have any idea how many people are there in China and how big the market is - let alone how many trillion the US owes to China. For someone who's taken basic economics (at least I assume so otherwise why would you mention it) you surely took the most basic class there is.Even if 90% of the Chinese population couldn't afford a ciem (which isn't the case at all), there will still be more potential buyers of hi-end audio gear than the US. In fact, you can't imagine how many people in a country like China care about audio stuff and carry around $1000+ gears around every day. In fact, there are stores in Asia that have Noble products for sale and demoing - why is that you wonder - coz the stores there know that people are interested and buy stuff like that, while in US people care mostly about consumer-oriented products like beats, sony, sennheiser, etc, and that's why you want see Noble in the nearest bestbuy anytime soon.

 

[fzman]

Yeah, but the thing is they can lend it out many times. 1964 ears charges shipping only which is more reasonable. Charging nothing for a demo besides shipping could actually boost sales because it means you'll get more buyers. Most people aren't willing to jump in blindly, and some aren't lucky enough to go to those meets, and you'd lose most of those types of people.
There's a difference between a demo unit and a new unit meant for sale. Don't compare the two.

I agree that some policies may lead to more sales than others -- it wold take real research to see which ones those are.  I also appreciate that you did not take my post as an attack, but simply as an expression of an alternative viewpoint.  
 
I would imagine that for a product like the Noble iems, that the presentation- i.e., how they arrive in their retail package is part of the overall appeal and value of the product.  I would also imagine that they would not want to demo-out the same set more than a few times, since there is bound to be some wear and tear.  It also takes time and money to test them when they come back, and 'repack' them so they give the next audition-er the 'what it's like to buy a Noble iem" experience.  
 
Without a restock fee, there is also the possibility of the 'wear it to the prom, then return it on Monday -- no spilling!!!!!!"
 
Not a fanboy, my comments apply to most any brand.  

 

[FullCircle]

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/collateral

Every company loses profit in the short run. A good company profits in the long run. Some companies are better than others. 1964 ears had losses making those demos, but look how popular they are now. Much more customers, much more staff, much more overall customer satisfaction, much more profitable. They had a good plan that caused them to lose a bit of money in the short run, but now they are one of the most known CIEM company. They're also doing giveaways on their facebook/twitter to expand even more! Again, it's about expanding.
And yes, if I'm in the US and a company is located in the US and they are marketing to US customers then I do hold priority in their eyes therefore making me more "special"

 
 
Hi Bobby12
 
Firstly, thanks for brining up your observations, I can assure you they will be discussed internally.
 
As for failure.....  
 
Food for thought
 
 

 
 
As for what "market is important."   Folks, the world market it important to me.  That being said, the life style for portable audio is here in Asia. Most people live in apartments, most people in Asia endure long commutes in some form of public transportation.  A lot of areas in Asia have some disposable income. But they do not have enough money to tune a car, or spend money on off shore fishing or other "semi" expensive hobbies, as these hobbies are crazy expensive in Asia.
 
A lot of folks don't even own a car, not so much because the car is expensive, the parking spot in the apartment complex may cost as much as the apartment.  So cars are out, fishing is crazy expensive and is seen as an occupation not a hobby.  Camping....   hot and sticky....  not an option
 
Usually what you find in Asia for hobbies are; traveling, RC (boats, cars, planes etc), cameras, and portable audio.   
 
 
This is no secret to the folks in the portable audio industry, we have the information and see it daily, as we look at who is going to our web sites, where the orders are comming from etc etc.
 
Even the recent Google Interview with Jerry Harvey, he mentioned a new focus on Asia....
 
As I said before the world is my market, but Brannan and I have spent a great portion of our lives in Asia.  Brannan lived in Thailand for 18 years, me around 7, Taiwan around 3, China around 2 years, and with that experience, we certainly understand and do not unerestimate the value of the Asian market.

 

[kh600rr]

Oy vey so many MBAs in this forum...

By the way, I graduated Kindergarten,summa cum laude .

 

[FullCircle]

  I agree that some policies may lead to more sales than others -- it wold take real research to see which ones those are.  I also appreciate that you did not take my post as an attack, but simply as an expression of an alternative viewpoint.  
 
I would imagine that for a product like the Noble iems, that the presentation- i.e., how they arrive in their retail package is part of the overall appeal and value of the product.  I would also imagine that they would not want to demo-out the same set more than a few times, since there is bound to be some wear and tear.  It also takes time and money to test them when they come back, and 'repack' them so they give the next audition-er the 'what it's like to buy a Noble iem" experience.  
 
Without a restock fee, there is also the possibility of the 'wear it to the prom, then return it on Monday -- no spilling!!!!!!"
 
Not a fanboy, my comments apply to most any brand.  

Not to mention....   and I hate to say it.....   sockets....   folks have a tendency to swap cables, checking out the sound signature with their 90Kt pure copper/gold cable etc etc
 
eventually the socket will wear out, and that can't be simply replaced, as it is essentially welded into the shell.  It would be a complete over haul, = hrs of work, and every time you heat these tiny fragile BA's via soldering, you throw the dice.... 

 

[Ivabign]

 
Not to mention....   and I hate to say it.....   sockets....   folks have a tendency to swap cables, checking out the sound signature with their 90Kt pure copper/gold cable etc etc
 
eventually the socket will wear out, and that can't be simply replaced, as it is essentially welded into the shell.  It would be a complete over haul, = hrs of work, and every time you heat these tiny fragile BA's via soldering, you throw the dice.... 

LOL - see - its all you guys who can't live with a standard cable make it tough on the rest of us who've aged past the point where we could hear the difference! 

 

[Hifi Nutter]

Nah, you don't - a priority customer is one who is willing to pay more and get the top of the line product, so in reality Asia should probably be every audiophile company main goal, coz it has the biggest audio market and many many times more "audiophiles" who are gladly willing to pay for the more expensive offering, especially when it's coming from a western company. And anyway, you're not more "special" than someone on the other side of the world coz both of you pay exactly the same amount of money.

My mum says im special

 

[Hifi Nutter]

Hi Bobby12

Firstly, thanks for brining up your observations, I can assure you they will be discussed internally.

As for failure.....  

Food for thought






As for what "market is important."   Folks, the world market it important to me.  That being said, the life style for portable audio is here in Asia. Most people live in apartments, most people in Asia endure long commutes in some form of public transportation.  A lot of areas in Asia have some disposable income. But they do not have enough money to tune a car, or spend money on off shore fishing or other "semi" expensive hobbies, as these hobbies are crazy expensive in Asia.

A lot of folks don't even own a car, not so much because the car is expensive, the parking spot in the apartment complex may cost as much as the apartment.  So cars are out, fishing is crazy expensive and is seen as an occupation not a hobby.  Camping....   hot and sticky....  not an option

Usually what you find in Asia for hobbies are; traveling, RC (boats, cars, planes etc), cameras, and portable audio.   


This is no secret to the folks in the portable audio industry, we have the information and see it daily, as we look at who is going to our web sites, where the orders are comming from etc etc.

Even the recent Google Interview with Jerry Harvey, he mentioned a new focus on Asia....

As I said before the world is my market, but Brannan and I have spent a great portion of our lives in Asia.  Brannan lived in Thailand for 18 years, me around 7, Taiwan around 3, China around 2 years, and with that experience, we certainly understand and do not unerestimate the value of the Asian market.

I lived in Singapore for over 2 years in the eighties and they love their gadgets,you could get stuff their that wasn't even in England at the time and they were willing to pay for it

 

[hatefulsandwich]

Huh, funny to see someone who keeps gushing on about 1964 Ears come into the Noble thread accusing its posters of Fanboyism.