[Chiron]

[size=medium]Hi[/size]
 
[size=medium]I am fairly new to the world of Head-Fi, but am looking into putting together a new combination. I live in South Africa, so everything has to be shipped here at enormous cost and there is no chance to listen comparatively to equipment locally and very little chance to listen at anything beyond Sennheisers. So I rely on reviews entirely. I have read so much in the past three weeks that my head is bubbling and I am now tired.[/size]
 
[size=medium]My budget is about $1000 - $1100 shipping included.[/size]
 
[size=medium]I have put together the following list:[/size]
[size=medium]1) Audio gd NFB-3 DAC[/size]
[size=medium]2) Little Dot MKIV Tube Amp[/size]
[size=medium]3) Beyerdynamic DT880 600 ohm[/size]
 
[size=medium]Source: Squeezebox duet (not changeable)[/size]
 
[size=medium]I listen almost exclusively to[/size]
[size=medium]1) Choral (all eras)[/size]
[size=medium]2) Classical (mainly solo instrumental Baroque)[/size]
[size=medium]3) Opera[/size]
[size=medium]4) Some Jazz (mainly West Coast or Cool or whatever you want to call it)[/size]
 
[size=medium]I have owned really high end stuff. I have owned a pair of Sennheiser 555s powered, by a Cambridge Audio A340, but have found it even after extensive burn-in to be distant or recessed (my terms). These have now been redistributed without my consent. I currently also own an Arcam FMJ A18 (from a duet) with Monitor Audio Silver RX2, and a Harman Kardon AVR220 Monitor Audio Silver RX11 combination (Denon with Infinity Beta before the redistribution).[/size]
 
[size=medium]I have spent some time thinking of what I have heard so far and my perceived preferences (keeping in mind my inexperience with really high-end stuff). I am definitely not a bass-head. I HATE an overpowering or booming bass (a critsism I have of the RX11 that I am trying to limit). I just cannot listen to this without getting a headache. I like a slightly warm sound (hence my choice of a tube amp).  I am also very sensitive to any (perceived?) back-pressure and just cannot listen to any of the noise cancelation headphones that I have tried. [/size]
 
[size=medium]In my listening experience with the setups mentioned I have found the treble of my setups a bit harsh. Not so much for solo instruments or voices, but as soon as there is a full orchestra or choir, the violins seem to start squeaking and almost disappear. Having heard this in two different setups, I ascribe it to the DAC in the squeezebox (which is very cheap after all). I also find an overly large sound-stage distracting. I would like more resolution in the high end, but am not so worried about precise positioning of instruments (but no wandering as I have also heard before with cheap equipment).[/size]
 
[size=medium]Sorry about the long ramble, but $1000 is a lot for me to spend on myself alone (with a wife and kid) and I would not have any chance of upgrading or changing in the next 2 or 3 years so this is it. Or maybe I would just like a little reassurance that I am not completely wasting my money with no chance of going back.[/size]
 
[size=medium]Regards[/size]
 
[size=medium]Neels[/size]

 

[ThePhoenix924S]

I know the Sennheiser HD600s and HD650s are highly regarded (I own the latter and love them), but if you really failed to enjoy the HD555s I'm not sure that either one of these would be for you.  You can find the HD600s for right around $300 and are often considered one of the better headphones money can buy, even though the design is over a decade old.

 

[Ridleyguy]

Welcome to Head-Fi!  From your description of the music you listen to, and the sound signature you prefer, I think you would also enjoy the ATH-W1000X.  The W1000X gives you slight warmth, intimacy with its slightly forward mids, and a 3D soundstage. I would also consider the AKG 701/702, which is considerably less expensive than the W1000X, but with the right amp/dac may be perfect for the type of music you listen to, although it is very revealing of flaws in the recording, which makes it less musical IMO.  I own them both, and like them both for different reasons.  
 
If you think you might prefer a headphone that is a little more laid back, i.e. giving you more more of a sense of being in a concert hall, with some distance to the stage, the Sennheiser HD650 would be my choice in your price range, and it is by far the best of the three mentioned with poor recordings. Unfortunately I haven't heard the DT880, other than briefly at CanJam, and so can't compare it to those I have mentioned. 

 

[Chiron]

Thanks for the replies guys. I guess there are not that many non bass loving classical listeners on this forum.
 
ThePhoenix924s
I would not say that I did not like the HD555. Just though them I bait shy. But I am sure it has more to do with my equipment at the time than the cans. As I said I have played the Squeezebox reciever over three different (albeit fairly mid end equipement) and I found the same defects. The Senns have only been driven by the Cambride Audio.
I have seriously considered (and still am) the HD600, but unfortunaly they are almost twice as expensive as the DT880 here in South Africa DTT800 ~ $340 equivalent, HD600 ~ $600 equivalent. Which means I will have to probably forego another component. I think it is all the middle men with the Senns, they are locally represented and you find their entry cans in all the shops around here. Whereas with the DT8800 the importer sells directly to the public.
 
RidleyGuy
I think the ATH-W1000X.is going to be much to expensive over here but will enquire. I read a lot about the AKG 701. The one thing that turned me to the DT880 is that people mentioned that it got a very wide soundstage. Now too big a soundstage is something I find unconfortable, don't know why? I always sit more to the back in the concert halls. I have even find stereo separation to big on some of my recordings with speakers (OK much cheaper gear).
 
The only other thing is that I have some not so good material (all in FLAC though). Even some 78 transfers which I would still like to listen to. Furthermore, one of my top three records is Byron Yanis with the Rachmaninov 3, which has noticible tape his, but god can he play - I get goose bumps every time I listen and I must have listened more than 500 times. So the setup must be somewhat forgiving, hence my choice of a tube amp.
 
Regards
 
Neels
 
 
 
 

 

[Uncle Erik]

I'd also recommend the Sennheiser HD-600.  It's wonderful with the music you listed and is something of a classic around here.  I found it more neutral than the DT880, and I've owned both pairs. 
 
However, you might want to keep an eye out for a pair of used AKG K-501s.  Sadly, they were discontinued, but used ones still turn up regularly.  I think you'd find them a perfect fit for your listening.
 
Another pair that might interest you is the Beyerdynamic DT48.  A lot of people here hate them because they lack bass.  It is a little on the light side, but the DT48 is very accurate and you'll get great bass texture and accuracy.  There's little bass impact, which is why I think a lot of people don't like them.  I love them, though, and use them for plenty of acoustic and vocal music.  They're a bit expensive new, but you should be able to find used pairs around $75-$150.  Well worth the investment if you find a reasonably priced used one.

 

[Ridleyguy]

Although I haven't heard the HD600 myself, and have invested more money in my HD650s with the SAA Equinox cable, what Uncle Erik says makes sense to me based on all the feedback people have given on the HD600 vs the HD650.  I had bought my HD650s before joining Head-Fi, and never considered the HD600s as I assumed the HD650s were better.
 
On the subject of the AKG 701/702, you're right, the soundstage is very wide and not particularly deep, and their analytical sound is also not for everyone - or for poorly recorded material!  I like mine mainly for solo piano and only on certain recordings.
 
If you like to sit near the back of concert halls though, as you mentioned, the Sennheiser HD650s certainly (and I assume HD600s?)  give you just that, plus concert hall like acoustics, and they can handle any recording - which is as you know an issue with many 60's and 70's classical recordings in particular.  I even have some of the old Richter recordings which are virtually unlistenable with a lot of headphones, but the 650s tame them .
 
Regarding prices in S Africa, why can't you use ebay or import from a Sennheiser dealer in the USA?  It has to be cheaper than the prices you quoted, even with duty/taxes.
 
Oh, and Byron Janis, I believe he was one of the few students Horowitz had, which says a lot.  Cheers.

 

[chrisjackson]

 

And the other two top records are...?
 
If you were to go the HD600 route, would a Nuforce HDP have any chance of squeezing into the budget? No, OK. Those two would be about £500 in UK.
 
Still, you must be doing something right as no one's "lol"ed at your proposed sytem; or maybe classical music is anathema to "lol"ers 

 Those Beyerdynamics sure have a good reputation for comfort. 
I liked this line :
​

Quote:

[size=medium] These have now been redistributed without my consent.[/size]

 

[Chiron]

Hi
 
So there are some classical listeners after all.
 
Ridleyguy, Uncle Erik
I had another look at the HD600. From Amazon, imported with tax and duties only about $20 more than the Beyers. Almost $200 cheaper than local sources!!!! But I of course lose the local warantee. So I have swung back to the HD600. I also have many recordings from the 60s and 70s (some pretty good performers recording in those days) and am certainly not going to toss them out. I don't have the funds for a horses for courses collection of canns, and also would not like the hassle of swapping all the time. So your recommendation and experience in this regards is really helpful.
 
On a side note. I listened to Angela Hewitt play the Bach WTC, last year when she toured SA. I came away thinking that I have not heard anything close to the real sound of a concert grand on audio equipment. It does not even sound like the same instrument. I will probably never have the money to buy equipment to reach this (if even possible) but hopefully my new setup will bring it a bit closer.
 
Chrisjackson
 
I have read a lot about the Nuforce HDP, and since it is a DAC amp combined it is not outside my range. (I have read so much in the last three weeks that my head hurts) But, although I haven't heard one, I am strangly lured to the glowing tubes and am going to give a tube amp a try. The Adio gd dac seems to get good press here and elsewhere and also seems to be fairly neutral, so should serve both ss and tube well if I decide to change in future. The price (even including shipping) is also very friendly. I have read a lot about tube amps (LD, DarkVoice, Woo, etc etc etc) and have decided on the LD MKIV based on price recommendations and customer service experienced. Several people has the LD HD600 combination and likes it. The Woo also has an enourmous reputation but is a bit expensive.
 
Unfortunaly my medical ensurance is refusing to pay some recent hospital costs so unless I can resove it, the equipment has become longer term. sigh!!!
 
Thanks for all the replies
 
Neels

 

[chrisjackson]

 
Ouch. Hope you can get those expenses back.
 
Thanks for getting back. Guess it was obvious from your first post, you've done your homework.
 
FWIW my "I say" moment (bit of British vernacular there) occurred at a concert where the choral forces were unfashioably large for the size of venue, possibly swelled by amateur singers. That gave a result I couldn't imagine reproducing at home. Am probably being very un-HeadFi by playing period instrument recordings and one voice per part Bach Passions much louder than is realistic. But then tend to regard recorded music as the instant coffee supplement to a diet of the real stuff: enjoyable as a drink in its own right.
 
BTW I hope junior is old enough to realise that glow tends to mean unpleasantly hot.
 
Best of luck.

 

[Chiron]

Hi
 
So I just pulled the trigger:
 
Sennheiser HD 600
Little Dot MKIV
Meier CORDA STAGEDAC.
 
The DAC is more than twice my planned expenditure, but I have read a lot about crossfeed in the past few days and even tried it with Foobar and my PCX 150 set on my laptop. Ebven here it makes a lot of difference for some of my 60 - 70s recordings where the stereo has always bothered me as being to pronounced. So I hope it was worth it, because I am now a lot poorer.
 
Regards
 
Neels

 

[matthewh133]

Quote:

Hi
 
So I just pulled the trigger:
 
Sennheiser HD 600
Little Dot MKIV
Meier CORDA STAGEDAC.
 
The DAC is more than twice my planned expenditure, but I have read a lot about crossfeed in the past few days and even tried it with Foobar and my PCX 150 set on my laptop. Ebven here it makes a lot of difference for some of my 60 - 70s recordings where the stereo has always bothered me as being to pronounced. So I hope it was worth it, because I am now a lot poorer.
 
Regards
 
Neels

GL mate. Hope it's what you're looking for. Post some impressions when you get everything

 

[chrisjackson]

Hi
 
...I have read a lot about crossfeed in the past few days and even tried it with Foobar and my PCX 150 set on my laptop. Ebven here it makes a lot of difference for some of my 60 - 70s recordings where the stereo has always bothered me as being to pronounced.
 
Regards
 
Neels

Think I saw that thread about the Meier DAC. Assume you checked the one about Isone Pro in the Computer Audio forum, I think. Recently a program called Musereo Mono to Stereo was available on the Giveaway of the Day site. Made a nice job of opening up some mono recordings I have without the treble tail off that Dolby Headphone seems to apply (and was simple enough for me to use )

Congrats on your purchases.