[fjrabon]

Apologies. Meant Volume Control. Corrected my reply.

No worries. People see "digital amp" and they freak out about class D amps, just wanted to clarify. Cheers.

 

[Mr Newyear]

Using DFB here. Additionally, if you're on Mac and download the program Karabiner (not sure if on windows), you can have the volume keys default to being 1/4 steps like holding Shift+Option+Volume does. I'm sure you can reprogram the keys somehow without an app (and if someone figures it out please let me know) but this has been my solution thus far. I'm using some Alclair CIEMS and i really only get to 1.5 steps on the mac's volume, so the incremental adjustment really helps. 

 

[joeq70]

To those of you who have tried the DFR on both an android device and an Apple i-device: Would you say that one necessarily sounds better than the other?

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  To those of you who have tried the DFR on both an android device and an Apple i-device: Would you say that one necessarily sounds better than the other?

 
Well there's no reason it would, considering it's going to result in the same signal.

 

[joeq70]

   
Well there's no reason it would, considering it's going to result in the same signal.

The main reason I ask is because of the issues with volume control on Android. UAPP seems to solve it mostly, but it still requires fiddling with. Now that I think about it, some of my family have iphones. I'll test out the two and see if there is a difference.

 

[brent75]

You can get a varying sound just on Apple depending on what player you use.

 

[good sound]

You can get a varying sound just on Apple depending on what player you use.

I've experienced the same with Android as well.

 

[DJ The Rocket]

This might be related to my "junior head-fier" tag, but having two separate devices to use my Black with has definitely benefitted me education-wise, and prevented user error from marring my impression of this great product. I have an LG G3 and a Galaxy Tab 3, and I was getting much better sound from my tablet thank from my phone, so I investigated. It turned out that the tablet was set to ~50% system volume, ~50% UAPP volume, with my E11 at 100%, and copying those settings to my phone got me the exact same sound quality. I had my phone system volume up at 90-100%, and it was ruining the clarity, dynamic range, and soundstage. I think it got to that point because I hadn't realized changing the UAPP volume didn't change the system volume and vice versa, which is how it works in any non-audiophile player. I was making reasonable assumptions that happened to turn out to be wrong, and without that diligence I could easily have concluded that the Black hardly sounds better than the G3's native DAC, which is said to be "pretty good for a stock DAC."

In fact, I suspect that everyone in this thread who has a poor impression of the Dragonfly's sound quality is quite likely making some similar kind of user error. They're probably not doing anything stupid, they're just doing things the way they always have for optimal SQ. It's hard to change habits that have been positively reinforced for years, sometimes, if you don't have something explicitly hit you over the head to make you take notice of this new reality.

 

[west0ne]

  To those of you who have tried the DFR on both an android device and an Apple i-device: Would you say that one necessarily sounds better than the other?

 
 

   
Well there's no reason it would, considering it's going to result in the same signal.

 
Not necessarily, different Apps on the same device seem to affect the SQ so it is not inconceivable that different devices will affect SQ differently depending on how they handle USB audio devices.
 

This might be related to my "junior head-fier" tag, but having two separate devices to use my Black with has definitely benefitted me education-wise, and prevented user error from marring my impression of this great product. I have an LG G3 and a Galaxy Tab 3, and I was getting much better sound from my tablet thank from my phone, so I investigated. It turned out that the tablet was set to ~50% system volume, ~50% UAPP volume, with my E11 at 100%, and copying those settings to my phone got me the exact same sound quality. I had my phone system volume up at 90-100%, and it was ruining the clarity, dynamic range, and soundstage. I think it got to that point because I hadn't realized changing the UAPP volume didn't change the system volume and vice versa, which is how it works in any non-audiophile player. I was making reasonable assumptions that happened to turn out to be wrong, and without that diligence I could easily have concluded that the Black hardly sounds better than the G3's native DAC, which is said to be "pretty good for a stock DAC."

In fact, I suspect that everyone in this thread who has a poor impression of the Dragonfly's sound quality is quite likely making some similar kind of user error. They're probably not doing anything stupid, they're just doing things the way they always have for optimal SQ. It's hard to change habits that have been positively reinforced for years, sometimes, if you don't have something explicitly hit you over the head to make you take notice of this new reality.

This is an issue with Android devices in general. The internal hardware volume of the DFB seems to be locked in at 44/64 so a little over 68%, when you use the hardware buttons on the device or in an App Android is adjusting the volume in software rather than hardware the DFB hardware volume doesn't change.
 
UAPP allows you to adjust the internal hardware volume and then do some software based adjustment as well. Controlling the internal volume of the DFB not only allows you to put out much more power it also seems to improve sound quality. It is possible to change the internal hardware volume to any level you want between 0 & 64 but only on a rooted phone and this then gives you hardware volume control in any app not just UAPP. However it is my understanding that UAPP bypasses the Android Kernel and send the data straight out to the external DAC whereas native Apps will still send the data out to the DAC via the Kernel which may also impact on sound quality.
 
This may well be contributing to some of the comments around sound quality it also makes the DFB less convenient that it should be when paired with an Android device. I'm using my DFB with a Samsung Galaxy S5 as well as a cheap Windows tablet. The DFB is an improvement over the built in headphone output on both devices.

 

[estreeter]

FWIW, spent a large chunk of Sunday morning using the DFB+Senn CX5.00G via Roon (Win 8.1) and this afternoon I'm using Banshee on Linux. The major advantage of the latter is that I can crank the OS volume slider considerably higher than I'm able to on Windows without inducing 'ouch' moments, but if you havent tried Roon with your DF (or whatever DAC(s) you currently own), I strongly recommend you download the trial. I'm skeptical of a lot of the claims made about playback software sounding appreciably better (then competitors) without any EQ, but the people behind Roon have massaged the sound beyond anything I'm hearing in F2K, iTunes etc. Its a chronic resource hog and stubbornly refuses to recognise several of my favorite Aussie bands, but whether its lossless, Vorbis or even VBR MP3, my music has never sounded so good.  For those who are happy with Audirvana+ / JRMC etc, Roon might not be such an eye opener but I just cant afford all 3 to compare them side-by-side. As with any recommendation re software, please take this with a bucket of salt until you've had time to try it for yourself.

 

[SpiderNhan]

   
 
 
Not necessarily, different Apps on the same device seem to affect the SQ so it is not inconceivable that different devices will affect SQ differently depending on how they handle USB audio devices.
 
This is an issue with Android devices in general. The internal hardware volume of the DFB seems to be locked in at 44/64 so a little over 68%, when you use the hardware buttons on the device or in an App Android is adjusting the volume in software rather than hardware the DFB hardware volume doesn't change.
 
UAPP allows you to adjust the internal hardware volume and then do some software based adjustment as well. Controlling the internal volume of the DFB not only allows you to put out much more power it also seems to improve sound quality. It is possible to change the internal hardware volume to any level you want between 0 & 64 but only on a rooted phone and this then gives you hardware volume control in any app not just UAPP. However it is my understanding that UAPP bypasses the Android Kernel and send the data straight out to the external DAC whereas native Apps will still send the data out to the DAC via the Kernel which may also impact on sound quality.
 
This may well be contributing to some of the comments around sound quality it also makes the DFB less convenient that it should be when paired with an Android device. I'm using my DFB with a Samsung Galaxy S5 as well as a cheap Windows tablet. The DFB is an improvement over the built in headphone output on both devices.

 
 

  FWIW, spent a large chunk of Sunday morning using the DFB+Senn CX5.00G via Roon (Win 8.1) and this afternoon I'm using Banshee on Linux. The major advantage of the latter is that I can crank the OS volume slider considerably higher than I'm able to on Windows without inducing 'ouch' moments, but if you havent tried Roon with your DF (or whatever DAC(s) you currently own), I strongly recommend you download the trial. I'm skeptical of a lot of the claims made about playback software sounding appreciably better (then competitors) without any EQ, but the people behind Roon have massaged the sound beyond anything I'm hearing in F2K, iTunes etc. Its a chronic resource hog and stubbornly refuses to recognise several of my favorite Aussie bands, but whether its lossless, Vorbis or even VBR MP3, my music has never sounded so good.  For those who are happy with Audirvana+ / JRMC etc, Roon might not be such an eye opener but I just cant afford all 3 to compare them side-by-side. As with any recommendation re software, please take this with a bucket of salt until you've had time to try it for yourself.

 
From the "Best Smartphone for audiophiles" thread:
 
Quote:

I'm now not so sure...

To clear it up, if someone with a V10 can run UAPP - and see if when opening UAPP it brings up a warning, asking you if you want to use your USB device as a DAC...

The G5/B&O sounds vastly better using the native UAPP drivers than it dose LG's own Hi-Fi drivers.... massive difference - especially in high impedance mode.

 

 

[zoologico]

Just a quick answer, Does the DFB do better in quality terms and power than the headphone-out of an iPhone 6 or iPad mini retina?.
Thanks

 

[pkcpga]

Just a quick answer, Does the DFB do better in quality terms and power than the headphone-out of an iPhone 6 or iPad mini retina?.
Thanks

The dfb is definitely louder.

 

[west0ne]

Just a quick answer, Does the DFB do better in quality terms and power than the headphone-out of an iPhone 6 or iPad mini retina?.
Thanks

Definitely louder. SQ is subjective but I felt the DFB improved the quality of the 6S+.

 

[canali]

my monks plus will be arriving shortly...if they fit ok i might try the more refined/pricey zen 2.0
...but have heard they require a good amp to really drive them.
 
any tried the df red with them and care to comment please?