New Audio-gd R-7, R-7HE R-8, R-27, R-27HE, R-28 Flagship Resistor Ladder DACs and DAC/amps
Mar 7, 2021 at 4:18 AM Post #6,631 of 11,260
Did you try those ? https://magnahifi.com/m-way-acss-ntrl-reference-analogue-balanced-interlink-mini-xlr/
I compared several and found the mway by far the most natural and smooth sounding.
I think the best acss cable set also depends on the speakers. The silver cables are preferred for my Usher Mini-X speakers, so I use silver / copper speaker cables.
The mini-xlr accs is Robertson silver, the 4-pin-acss is M-Way copper from MagnaHifi (between HE1 and Master3). I replaced the M-Way with silver, not clearly better. Maybe too much silver? :slight_smile:
Of course, personal taste is also important, so it’s a long, long journey.
 
Mar 7, 2021 at 6:21 AM Post #6,632 of 11,260
any of you ever replace the feet on an r8 or r7? is it easy or difficult? anyone know what threading it might use? like M6, 6mm or 8mm? looking at isoacoustics gaia
 
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Mar 7, 2021 at 7:13 AM Post #6,634 of 11,260
I think the best acss cable set also depends on the speakers. The silver cables are preferred for my Usher Mini-X speakers, so I use silver / copper speaker cables.
The mini-xlr accs is Robertson silver, the 4-pin-acss is M-Way copper from MagnaHifi (between HE1 and Master3). I replaced the M-Way with silver, not clearly better. Maybe too much silver? :slight_smile:
Of course, personal taste is also important, so it’s a long, long journey.
The best silver cables sound dead flat. And smoother.
 
Mar 7, 2021 at 7:13 AM Post #6,635 of 11,260

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Mar 7, 2021 at 10:14 AM Post #6,636 of 11,260
Kingwa said he is revamping the amplifier line up. Parts costs/ availability, labor, and other factors would require price increases. After 5-6 years of production Kingwa said it was time for change.

The Master 10 discontinued with no replacement.

The Master 3 will be replaced by a new model, 3A. 50W pure class A/ ch, 100W 8 ohms/ ch, 400W 2 ohms/ ch.

The 2H will be replaced with model HE2 SE. Still mono block but separate HE power supply chassis. Price will increase accordingly.
 
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Mar 7, 2021 at 5:12 PM Post #6,637 of 11,260
Thanks Scott for that reassuring and exciting heads up!

So one could get what remains of the current models at a better price / higher value, or wait a bit for improved/tweaked but sliiiiiiightly less value models.

The existing non-SE HE2 power amps go for $7000 USD/pair, I believe.

I wonder just how much warmer sounding the Master-2A (and upcoming 3A) are than their non-A, lower class A bias siblings). If it's a subtle extra touch of "naturalness" or sweetness, or whathaveyou, I'd be interested! If it's clearly warmer, too rolled off on top, and a bit lacking in detail, then I would probably shy away. I used to own an Ayre V-1xe that hit that sweet spot, I believe. Although, my setup has changed so much since... (don't mind me, just thinking aloud here).
 
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Mar 7, 2021 at 5:43 PM Post #6,638 of 11,260
I think an integrated amp with headphone jacks like Audio-gd's Precision 2 will be very competitive for those users wants to drive phones like HE-6 and only want a single amp to connect DAC. (The schiit audio's similar product costs $1500 now. But precision 2 only costed around $1000+shipping in its age and it had ACSS input and diamond cross zero distortion NFB output.)

(Of course now we can still use a tap on the precision 3 in this case.)
 
Mar 7, 2021 at 7:41 PM Post #6,639 of 11,260
I think an integrated amp with headphone jacks like Audio-gd's Precision 2 will be very competitive for those users wants to drive phones like HE-6 and only want a single amp to connect DAC. (The schiit audio's similar product costs $1500 now. But precision 2 only costed around $1000+shipping in its age and it had ACSS input and diamond cross zero distortion NFB output.)

(Of course now we can still use a tap on the precision 3 in this case.)

Have the same situaton with speakers. Only one source input so just want to connect DAC - ACSS - Amp. But need a gain control. I have that now with the M10 amp. But any other amp requires a preamp in front. What I really need is a DAC with gain control on its outputs. No sound sacrifice of course. As a option maybe. Then would more have more amplifier choices.
 
Mar 7, 2021 at 8:08 PM Post #6,640 of 11,260
The regenerative he2 is the best amp Kingwa has ever made You can bet the HE2 SE will be even better. For the people who have a dedicated room, of course. Maybe i should build one in the basement... :)
 
Mar 7, 2021 at 9:05 PM Post #6,642 of 11,260
Auralic’s Aries G1 Transport – How Important is the Bridge? Maybe more Important than the DAC?

I’ll answer that question first up by admitting that for me, the G1 has been far more important than I previously realized in my pursuit of audio quality. You could find the same – it depends on the system of digital input being used for your DAC. In this house it is hard wired, not wireless, with quality Canare cabling being used to carry the balanced digital signal out from the G1 and hard wired input to the G1 being from the home network..



Bear with my while I relate my recent audiophilia journey and the reasons for my re-admiration for the G1 will emerge.



Moving from a Meridian system into ROON over 4 years ago required a bridge so the first unit was the smaller Auralic Aries. Next move was a better DAC in the form of an LKS DA-004 modified by Rick Schultz. Several headphones were tried during this journey starting off with a Sennheiser HD800, then the 800S and finally the Focal Utopia. Headamps were the Auralic, the Violectric V281 & V280 and finally the Audio-gd Master 9, a unit which surprised me with the difference it made and had me reassessing the importance of the amplifier. At around the Violectric/Focal Utopia mark I purchased the Aries G1 to replace the smaller bridge. All moves were positive with some very nice sounding music (generally classical), the result.



But the audiophilia bug kept nagging me despite the superb AQ having reached the stage where well recorded CD quality FLAC files sounded just as good as hi-rez.



Could the highly regarded and well reviewed Audio-gd R8 DAC improve things further? Unable to resist, I purchased one and set it up in the main headphone system so, with a passive balanced splitter feeding the LKS and the R8, a simple switching of the Master 9 could compare these two toys.



The result was I could hear absolutely no difference in the sound between them, something which frustrated me and annoyed some posters who owned the R8 and found it difficult to accept what I said. All sorts of suggestions about what I was doing wrong followed with the only plausible one for me being that it was unfair to compare the well bedded in LKS to an R8 with only a few hundred hours on it. BUT, the audio quality of the two DACs remained identical and a few hundred more hours of bedding in for the R8 made no difference.



Well I’ve finally woken up to what is going on with the digital to analog processing here.



Both DACs are receiving a balanced digital signal from the Auralic’s Aries G1 Wireless Streaming Transport, a unit very positively reviewed for its ability to deliver a quality digital output, stripped of heaps of jitter. So the following DAC has its hard work already done and sophisticated units like the LKS and Audio-gd are overkill!!



Therefore it is unsurprising I hear no difference between these two DACs but it also is not a valid conclusion to say there is no difference in their processing power because neither is really being challenged!



It all opens the question about how simple a DAC can be following on from the Auralic’s Aries G1 Wireless Streaming Transport? And a very simple one might indeed do the job as I inadvertently discovered (but did not realise) recently when I bought a used Schiit multibit Bifrost DAC for a friend and was highly impressed with the audio it generated in this system. I did not listen for long so did not compare it to the LKS but now wish I had as it might have prevented me from spending more in a useless attempt to improve AQ with a “better” DAC.



So folks, no need to be upset at my claims the R8 is no better than the less expensive LKS. In different circumstances it might indeed be better but there is no question it is no better in this system. That in no way reflects adversely on either the Audio-gd or LKS. BUT it does reflect very positively on the Auralic’s Aries G1 Wireless Streaming Transport, an expensive device, but one which can do far more for a good system than I previously appreciated.
 

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Mar 7, 2021 at 9:26 PM Post #6,643 of 11,260
Auralic’s Aries G1 Transport – How Important is the Bridge? Maybe more Important than the DAC?

I’ll answer that question first up by admitting that for me, the G1 has been far more important than I previously realized in my pursuit of audio quality. You could find the same – it depends on the system of digital input being used for your DAC. In this house it is hard wired, not wireless, with quality Canare cabling being used to carry the balanced digital signal out from the G1 and hard wired input to the G1 being from the home network..



Bear with my while I relate my recent audiophilia journey and the reasons for my re-admiration for the G1 will emerge.



Moving from a Meridian system into ROON over 4 years ago required a bridge so the first unit was the smaller Auralic Aries. Next move was a better DAC in the form of an LKS DA-004 modified by Rick Schultz. Several headphones were tried during this journey starting off with a Sennheiser HD800, then the 800S and finally the Focal Utopia. Headamps were the Auralic, the Violectric V281 & V280 and finally the Audio-gd Master 9, a unit which surprised me with the difference it made and had me reassessing the importance of the amplifier. At around the Violectric/Focal Utopia mark I purchased the Aries G1 to replace the smaller bridge. All moves were positive with some very nice sounding music (generally classical), the result.



But the audiophilia bug kept nagging me despite the superb AQ having reached the stage where well recorded CD quality FLAC files sounded just as good as hi-rez.



Could the highly regarded and well reviewed Audio-gd R8 DAC improve things further? Unable to resist, I purchased one and set it up in the main headphone system so, with a passive balanced splitter feeding the LKS and the R8, a simple switching of the Master 9 could compare these two toys.



The result was I could hear absolutely no difference in the sound between them, something which frustrated me and annoyed some posters who owned the R8 and found it difficult to accept what I said. All sorts of suggestions about what I was doing wrong followed with the only plausible one for me being that it was unfair to compare the well bedded in LKS to an R8 with only a few hundred hours on it. BUT, the audio quality of the two DACs remained identical and a few hundred more hours of bedding in for the R8 made no difference.



Well I’ve finally woken up to what is going on with the digital to analog processing here.



Both DACs are receiving a balanced digital signal from the Auralic’s Aries G1 Wireless Streaming Transport, a unit very positively reviewed for its ability to deliver a quality digital output, stripped of heaps of jitter. So the following DAC has its hard work already done and sophisticated units like the LKS and Audio-gd are overkill!!



Therefore it is unsurprising I hear no difference between these two DACs but it also is not a valid conclusion to say there is no difference in their processing power because neither is really being challenged!



It all opens the question about how simple a DAC can be following on from the Auralic’s Aries G1 Wireless Streaming Transport? And a very simple one might indeed do the job as I inadvertently discovered (but did not realise) recently when I bought a used Schiit multibit Bifrost DAC for a friend and was highly impressed with the audio it generated in this system. I did not listen for long so did not compare it to the LKS but now wish I had as it might have prevented me from spending more in a useless attempt to improve AQ with a “better” DAC.



So folks, no need to be upset at my claims the R8 is no better than the less expensive LKS. In different circumstances it might indeed be better but there is no question it is no better in this system. That in no way reflects adversely on either the Audio-gd or LKS. BUT it does reflect very positively on the Auralic’s Aries G1 Wireless Streaming Transport, an expensive device, but one which can do far more for a good system than I previously appreciated.
I don't mean to contradict you, but you should do the test without the active splitter.

From experience, i know the opposite of your conclusion is also true. If you feed a jittery signal to two very different dacs, you will hear no difference when the quality of the dacs is at least Ok.
 
Mar 8, 2021 at 7:44 AM Post #6,645 of 11,260
From experience, i know the opposite of your conclusion is also true. If you feed a jittery signal to two very different dacs, you will hear no difference when the quality of the dacs is at least Ok.
Yip, Conclusion was contradictory. Auralic’s Aries G1 is so good that there is no difference between DACs, amaizing!!!

I wrote the same few days ago when a person tried to argue that G1 connection was bringing no audible noise and based on this an assumption was made on a jitter-free transmission.

This is not only your experience, but is a part of a general knowledge, there are no exceptions. Jitter produce absolutely no noise on a digital silence, but products of intermodulation spread across the entire spectrum when music is playing. Details in the music can only show when jitter amount is below perceived level. Serial communication with embedded clock is jittery by a nature. A long cable, multiroom cable connection is adding more interference. I am afraid a passive splitter won't help much as reflections of the signal from another room will mix with on a splitter.

Good DACs have an internal jitter removal circuit which is usually done by PLL (Phase Controlled Locked Loop). It has limitations, as attempting to maximise loop gain leads to occasional losss of synchronisation. The older equipment had a manual switch for increasing frequency range the PLL can achieve a lock to deal with cases when it happens. These days designers use more relaxed loop gain (meaning allowing more jitter). This is because there are other ways to deal with an issue. One solution is to use a separate clock line for the synchronisation of the clock when using S/PDIF, the other is I2S connection, but both work well only on short distances. The other one use a feedback packet clock synchronisation method, so far only implemented on the USB connection.
 
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