[FinalJenemba]

So I made this thread a couple of weeks ago: http://www.head-fi.org/t/570154/did-i-get-knockoff-xb700-s
 
Asking if I had gotten some fake XB700's, the general consensus was that I did.  Now that I have a real pair of XB700's, I can say with absolute certainty that they are super fake, the real ones are night and day better.  Well I was under the impression, and I think everyone else was too, that because I payed with paypal, I would be taken care of.  Wrong.
 
I opened a case with paypal claiming the items where fake, providing them with pictures of my headphones, and links to pictures of some real ones, its so blatantly obvious they are fake.  The seller responded back with a refund offer of $11, I payed him $60.  Naturally I refused but said in fairness I would take $40, I never heard from him. And now, a few weeks later, I gt this message from paypal:
 
 
 
Dear Benson,

We are currently investigating your complaint listed below.
 

To continue, we need documentation supporting your claim that the item is
not authentic.

Here’s what you need to do.

1. Obtain a document from an unbiased third-party, such as a dealer,
appraiser, or an organization that is qualified in the area of the item in
question (other than you). This document should contain the following:
•       Detailed description as to why the item is not authentic (i.e., how the
item differs from an authentic item, how the person evaluating the item
determined that it is not authentic, etc.).
•       If possible, the document should include a serial number and must be on
letterhead that includes the name, address, and phone number of the
authenticating party so that we can contact them directly, if necessary.

2. Fax the documents to PayPal at ******* (please note this is a
United States phone number, if you are faxing from outside the United
States, you will generally need to dial 00 1 before the number). Please
include a cover sheet with your fax that includes the email address
registered to your PayPal account and the ID number of your claim
(**************). That way we can attach the documents to your claim as
quickly as possible.
 
3. We need to receive your fax by September 29, 2011 in order to proceed
with the investigation of your claim. If we don’t receive your fax by
September 29, 2011, your claim will be canceled and no further action will
be taken on our part.

Please note that PayPal is unable to reimburse you for any costs or fees
that may be incurred in obtaining the requested documents. Any documents
you provide may also be supplied to the seller if necessary.

Thanks you for your cooperation and patience.
 
 
Well frak.  I don't have any headphone dealers around me, and definitely none that sell XB700's.  If I did, I would have bought them there.  So now I'm pretty much screwed.  Getting the kind of paperwork they want is more or less impossible, and they know it.  I really hate paypal, they don't care about protecting anyone, only that they get their fees.  Iv been screwed by them as a seller, and now as a buyer.  Guess I'm out $60....
 
Gah, I just had to vent.  Thanks for listening.

 

[Lurkumaural]

Bad thread title.
 
I buy headphones on eBay.  The last such purchase was HD 25-1 for my wife.  I bought from an authorized dealer and audio retailer, checked up on the seller prior to purchase, and made sure the return policy was solid (it was).
 
You've caught some bad luck, and I'm sorry to hear about it.  I made a similar mistake and received a fake once.  The seller was trying to lowball my refund, but I stood my ground and came away with my money and the fake piece.  No mediation to deal with.
 
So again, you had a bad transaction.  It's a learning experience.  eBay and Paypal have decent buyer protection, and will side with the buyer in most practical cases.  Now you know to furnish proof before you make a claim to money that you gave someone.
 
Please don't take your frustrations out on eBay. That's a sore misapplication of your energy.

 

[jackwess]

It happens when buying on Ebay, im always aware of fakes. 
Sorry about it man. 

 

[jasonb]

Yes, bad thread title. I have bought tons of stuff off of Ebay. Including 2 pairs of headphones. With ebay, you just have to be careful, but there is no reason to avoid it completely.

 

[Croozer]

I buy a lot of things on ebay without a problem, but I also know what to look for in a shady seller.

 

[Hackez]

As others have said there's nothing inherently wrong with eBay. Out of six or seven headphone purchases through eBay only one was defective and the seller was very understanding and I eventually ended up with a full refund.
 
With regards to what PayPal is asking you to do, I would contact the manufacturer of the headphones and see if they will verify for you that they're fake. As you said its blatantly obvious from the pictures so perhaps they will help you? Its worth a shot.

 

[Gurloes]

I've purchased headphones twice from eBay with no problem. I've also made over 1,000 other purchases/sales on eBay & have rarely ever had a problem with anyone. Like Croozer said, you need to look out for those sellers with signs of being shady & stay away.
 
Some things I watch out for:
I rarely ever buy from anyone with under 100 feedback rating
I rarely buy from a seller selling more than one of something, unless they are genuinely an authorized retailer, or it's something like a book & they're a bookstore
If a BIN deal sounds too good to be true, it's a good chance it's fake/knockoff/bootleg
I look for actual photos of the item, stock photos can hide fake/knockoff/bootleg products

 

[gelocks]

As others have said, be very aware of sellers.
Some of them you can tell that they just plainly suck!
Always check the comments of their transactions in an of chance that
they actually repeated a sale and someone has negative comments towards them.
 
Anyway, it's all part of the experience.
Sorry you lost a couple of smackers but eBay in my mind kicks butt!
 
Go eBay!!!!
 

 

[sphinxvc]

Quote:

So I made this thread a couple of weeks ago: http://www.head-fi.org/t/570154/did-i-get-knockoff-xb700-s
 
Asking if I had gotten some fake XB700's, the general consensus was that I did.  Now that I have a real pair of XB700's, I can say with absolute certainty that they are super fake, the real ones are night and day better.  Well I was under the impression, and I think everyone else was too, that because I payed with paypal, I would be taken care of.  Wrong.
 
I opened a case with paypal claiming the items where fake, providing them with pictures of my headphones, and links to pictures of some real ones, its so blatantly obvious they are fake.  The seller responded back with a refund offer of $11, I payed him $60.  Naturally I refused but said in fairness I would take $40, I never heard from him. And now, a few weeks later, I gt this message from paypal:
 
 
 
Dear Benson,

We are currently investigating your complaint listed below.
 

To continue, we need documentation supporting your claim that the item is
not authentic.

Here’s what you need to do.

1. Obtain a document from an unbiased third-party, such as a dealer,
appraiser, or an organization that is qualified in the area of the item in
question (other than you). This document should contain the following:
•       Detailed description as to why the item is not authentic (i.e., how the
item differs from an authentic item, how the person evaluating the item
determined that it is not authentic, etc.).
•       If possible, the document should include a serial number and must be on
letterhead that includes the name, address, and phone number of the
authenticating party so that we can contact them directly, if necessary.

2. Fax the documents to PayPal at ******* (please note this is a
United States phone number, if you are faxing from outside the United
States, you will generally need to dial 00 1 before the number). Please
include a cover sheet with your fax that includes the email address
registered to your PayPal account and the ID number of your claim
(**************). That way we can attach the documents to your claim as
quickly as possible.
 
3. We need to receive your fax by September 29, 2011 in order to proceed
with the investigation of your claim. If we don’t receive your fax by
September 29, 2011, your claim will be canceled and no further action will
be taken on our part.

Please note that PayPal is unable to reimburse you for any costs or fees
that may be incurred in obtaining the requested documents. Any documents
you provide may also be supplied to the seller if necessary.

Thanks you for your cooperation and patience.
 
 
Well frak.  I don't have any headphone dealers around me, and definitely none that sell XB700's.  If I did, I would have bought them there.  So now I'm pretty much screwed.  Getting the kind of paperwork they want is more or less impossible, and they know it.  I really hate paypal, they don't care about protecting anyone, only that they get their fees.  Iv been screwed by them as a seller, and now as a buyer.  Guess I'm out $60....
 
Gah, I just had to vent.  Thanks for listening.

 
Hmm -- yes, most likely they're just wasting your time.  I've provided that kind of documentation before at their request (and paid for it) only to have nothing come of it in the end.  Here's a hint, as a buyer you always have all the leverage on Paypal.  Sellers have a very hard time defending against item not as described cases.  I speak from experience.
 
If you're a buyer, things are different.  Instead of claiming they were fakes, you should have simply said you know what these are supposed to sound like and that these are defective.  That's all.  You would have had your money back for SNAD easy peasy.  Technically, you aren't even lying.

 

[sphinxvc]

Oh, and if you are planning to get the documentation.  Go to an appropriate store and offer them $5-10 to sign off on a document you will write & to verify what you have written to Paypal when they call.

 

[sphinxvc]

Might not work though, lol.

 

[FinalJenemba]

Ok, I relent, BAD thread title. I was just ticked off.  I still use ebay, and will continue to do so, im more upset with paypal than ebay.
 
And sphinxvc, I work at Radioshack, we sell some Sony headphones.  Maybe ill just write something and have my manager sign it, I know he'd back me if they called him lol.

 

[sphinxvc]

There you go.  And maybe have him fax it into Paypal on company letterhead.  
 
I have had my own fair share of troubles on Ebay and Paypal.  Probably 80% of cases have gone my way but unfortunately the 20% I have lost have cost me thousands of dollars, mostly due to the inept-ness of Paypal and their methods.  And the scam-artists, of course.

 

[fabio-fi]

It was bad luck Imo. 
 
Sometimes you can find good deals at Ebay.
Be careful next time. 
 
Im wondering, is there a way to report that kind of buyers?

 

[lossfizzle]

I had a seller sell me a $300 guitar "in great shape" (and with totally worthless / miserable photos, but his feedback was good!). I opened it and instantly knew it would need a $200 fret job. We went back and forth on the difference between "great shape" and "unplayable" until he dared me to get documentation from a third party. I made a quick form up with carefully written, unloaded questions about the guitar's condition and simple "yes / no" checkboxes, and took it along with me to a luthier. He looked it over, checked the boxes indicating the guitar was not "in great shape," signed his name and phone number, and didn't even charge me.
 
I sent that to the seller and of course he immediately stopped responding. I then opened a case with eBay, sent them a copy of the form the luthier signed, and had a full refund including prepaid return shipping in 36 hours.
 
And jeez, you work at Radio Shack? Just make a similar "check yes or no" type form with the right questions ("the Sonys we carry from legit channels have x, this [ ] does [ ] does NOT have x") and give it to your manager. That's your two-second documentation.
 
If you don't carry the XBs, go buy a set from BB, let him look them over vs your fakes, and then return them.
 
As someone else pointed out, Paypal / eBay is inherently buyer-biased. They probably won't even follow up, and if they do it won't be the Spanish inquisition.