[furyagain]

 
I just tested it for 5 min using my usual portable 
 
The Hifiman 601
 
Also tested with Fiji e10 using my tablet .
 
The AD does need more then a low end portable device to drive.
 
I kind of need to use high gain on both .
 
By the way , the AD does sound pretty open to me,
 
It sound as open as or better the the hd600
 
Can't wait to try it with my main setting tonight

 

[azteca x]

I grew up with closed headphones and enjoy their sound greatly.  They are extremely practical for many purposes as well.  I'm sure these will knock the pants off of the cheaper (cheap Audio Technica) and more clinical/studio (Sennheiser HD280 Pro) that I have had.  Openness is cool and all but if you have a great frequency response, lack of coloration and super comfy earpads-  what's not to love?
Like many others, I'll be waiting for a month or two to see how people's impressions shape up over time and more back-to-back comparisons with various headphones/amps.  Then we'll know the tale.  Jude did set people up for disappointment with that openness comment.

 

[swspiers]

The soundstage comments have left me a little puzzled.  But then, I prefer imaging to expansive soundstage.
 
For me, both of those are as much source material dependent as they are headphone dependent, perhaps even more so.
 
The remarkable thing for me about the AD is that they do not seem to add anything that isn't in the source material.  They are neither warm nor analytical, bright nor dark.  If the engineer created a wide soundstage, it's there.  If not, they don't create one.
 
The biggest thing about the AD to hype is that they do not hype anything.
 
I am extremely impressed with them so far.

 

[ssrock64]

  In theory, your definition of imaging is good, but no one here knows where the instruments are truly supposed to be in a recording so therefore the concept of "good imaging" is invalid. How do you know X sound is supposed to sound 10 meters away, 40 degrees to the left, or 1 meter away, 90 degrees from the left?

I'd say that imaging is less about where an instrument is defined to be, and more about the fact that it is defined. A headphone with stellar imaging places the instruments in distinct areas, regardless of where those areas actually are or how far they are from you. For that reason, recording and production factors heavily into imaging considerations.
 
Soundstage has to do with width and the distance of the instruments from you, whereas imaging is about the level of definition to those positions.

 

[ethan7000]

  I grew up with closed headphones and enjoy their sound greatly.  They are extremely practical for many purposes as well.  I'm sure these will knock the pants off of the cheaper (cheap Audio Technica) and more clinical/studio (Sennheiser HD280 Pro) that I have had.  Openness is cool and all but if you have a great frequency response, lack of coloration and super comfy earpads-  what's not to love?
Like many others, I'll be waiting for a month or two to see how people's impressions shape up over time and more back-to-back comparisons with various headphones/amps.  Then we'll know the tale.  Jude did set people up for disappointment with that openness comment.

All good points, closed ≠ bad

 

[zowki]

Originally Posted by swspiers /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
The remarkable thing for me about the AD is that they do not seem to add anything that isn't in the source material.  They are neither warm nor analytical, bright nor dark.  If the engineer created a wide soundstage, it's there.  If not, they don't create one.
 
The biggest thing about the AD to hype is that they do not hype anything.

The ADs are very neutral but there is still room for improvement. I find myself needing to EQ up 10KHz by 3dB and EQ down 3KHz by 3dB.
 
I usually need to EQ other headphones a lot more to reach neutral sound. The fact that the AD needs so little EQ is a testament to its neutrality.

 

[groovyd]

... so do these change after a burn-in? back to my original question...
 
and if so will the bass screw setting need to be tweaked after 100 hours to return to flat?

 

[zowki]

  ... so do these change after a burn-in? back to my original question...
 
and if so will the bass screw setting need to be tweaked after 100 hours to return to flat?

The T50RP driver doesn't need burn in. I've owned the stock T50RP and other T50RP mods (Paradox and Thunderpants). None of them change with burn in and neither will the Alpha Dogs.

 

[kstuart]

  The soundstage comments have left me a little puzzled.  But then, I prefer imaging to expansive soundstage.
 
For me, both of those are as much source material dependent as they are headphone dependent, perhaps even more so.

But that is the point of having reference tracks that you play on different equipment, in order to compare the equipment.
 
And the better recorded the reference tracks, the more likely they will show differences in the equipment.  That is why you cannot only use your favorite music to compare headphones, you also have to have some tracks that are chosen for their recording quality.
 
So, even if you listen mostly to Daft Punk and other EDM, you still might want to have one or two reference tracks recorded like so:
 

 

[miceblue]

 

  In theory, your definition of imaging is good, but no one here knows where the instruments are truly supposed to be in a recording so therefore the concept of "good imaging" is invalid. How do you know X sound is supposed to sound 10 meters away, 40 degrees to the left, or 1 meter away, 90 degrees from the left?

I'd say that imaging is less about where an instrument is defined to be, and more about the fact that it is defined. A headphone with stellar imaging places the instruments in distinct areas, regardless of where those areas actually are or how far they are from you. For that reason, recording and production factors heavily into imaging considerations.
 
Soundstage has to do with width and the distance of the instruments from you, whereas imaging is about the level of definition to those positions.

In that case, I use instrument separation in replace of so-called "imaging."

 

[Change is Good]

Those who are familiar with headphones can expect that a closed headphone will not have a soundstage to the likes of an open headphone. But hype and advertising can sometimes be misleading to people just joining the hobby.
 
Examples being Jude's hype (though he does say it doesn't compare to an open headphone) and Dan's advertising on the Alpha Dog description...
 

"If you are interested in reference-quality headphones with state of the art soundstage, detail retrieval, ambience, and linearity it's all about the Alpha Dog"

 
Some may define "state of the art soundstage" as AKG like or even HD800 like. This can be misleading to some people, hence why we are seeing some disappointments about the AD in that regard.

 

[mrspeakers]

I have said the Alpha has soundstage comparable to a quality open phone. I would not say it rivals the best possible soundstage like the 800, which not only is vastly more expensive but is also often cited as having perhaps the largest soundstage.

I intended state of the art soundstage to refer to closed headphones, I thought that was contextually clear. I will modify that copy as it seems to have confused at least one person, which means it probably confused others...

 

[jude]

Transcription from the Head-Fi TV video about the MrSpeakers Alpha Dog (emphasis added):
 

Now the most amazing thing about the Alpha Dog to me is not just how it presents all that detail, it's how it does it and sounds like an open headphone, even though it's a closed headphone. If you were to put this on my head in a silent room, with my eyes closed, I'd never heard it before, you put it on my head, I would have guessed I was listening to an open, circumaural (or around-the-ear) headphone; because that's how the soundstage sounds on this. It's not quite as biiiig and airy as an HD 800, but, really, not much is; but I would guess "open headphone." It sounds like an open headphone and it's closed.

 
I absolutely stand by that. I've been listening to this headphone (either the prototype or the production version, as I bought both) almost every day since they arrived. The reason I qualified that statement with "in a silent room" is because it's the only way to keep out the obvious external cues that quickly give away either an open headphone or a closed headphone.
 
If you're listening with an open headphone, and there's noise around you, the open nature of a headphone is given away immediately by the clearer intrusion of the ambient noise. Same with the muffled versions of those external noises when you're wearing a closed headphone--those smothered sounds making the presence of the closed cups obvious.
 
The more silent the room, the fewer the external cues play into it. And in my quiet office downstairs, I simply forget I'm listening to closed headphones with the Alpha Dog. I'm there now, at the moment listening to Beirut's "East Harlem" (from the album The Rip Tide), and the Alpha Dog images openly enough--and the closed-cup acoustic invisible enough--that this headphone does image more to me like an open headphone than a closed one, for sure.
 
If you hear it differently, that's fine. But I called it like I heard it, and still hear it.

 

[Change is Good]

I wasn't criticizing, guys... as I have yet to experience the AD, myself. I was just pointing out why someone may have been disappointed about its soundstage.

 

[magiccabbage]

anyone tried them with portable amps like the fiio e11? Are these just meant for desktop setup, i was thinking of getting them for just on the go. I don't think they would work with my WA2 but i would consider buying them if i could use them with my cowon and fiio.