[betula]

There's something weird/shady going on at the Stereophile site. I registered, left a very polite comment asking for clarification on the pads used in the review. Now my comment is no longer present, and I can't log in to the site. Very strange...

Meze shared the review on their Facebook page too. Perhaps we should start commenting there. Apparently the Meze marketing/internet team did not catch up on the pad confusion in the review.

 

[ckhirnigs113]

Meze shared the review on their Facebook page too. Perhaps we should start commenting there. Apparently the Meze marketing/internet team did not catch up on the pad confusion in the review.

I posted my question about the pads on their Facebook page. It would be very interesting if Meze developed a new thinner, all-leather pad for the Elite and didn't bother to tell anyone about it!

 

[paradoxper]

Best cable I have found for Elite is Hapa KnØt full size Ag. Absolutely better than everything else I’ve tried in terms of detail, stage, control, and bass/treble extension. No criticism at all of it. Reveals everything that a headphone is capable of. Shows the weaknesses of your chain, or lack thereof. Highly recommend. Sadly, not cheap.

What models did you compare to. I'd not heard of Hapa seeing they're popular for IEM but they look overt.

 

[betula]

I posted my question about the pads on their Facebook page. It would be very interesting if Meze developed a new thinner, all-leather pad for the Elite and didn't bother to tell anyone about it!

I am sure, that is, not the case. The reviewer got confused along the lines. He might call the Alcantara pads 'full leather' pads, but then again the thickness of the pads he is describing about the hybrid pads do not line up with Meze's offerings. I am sure there are no new secret pads, we just have to clear some unfortunate confusion.

 

[ckhirnigs113]

I am sure, that is, not the case. The reviewer got confused along the lines. He might call the Alcantara pads 'full leather' pads, but then again the thickness of the pads he is describing about the hybrid pads do not line up with Meze's offerings. I am sure there are no new secret pads, we just have to clear some unfortunate confusion.

That's certainly the most likely explanation. There are very few that prefer the Alcantara pads to the hybrids, so even that would be a strange clarification.

 

[betula]

That's certainly the most likely explanation. There are very few that prefer the Alcantara pads to the hybrids, so even that would be a strange clarification.

That is correct, however I wouldn't say 'few' is preferring the Alcantara versus the hybrids.

My experience as a long time Empyrean and Elite owner is that pad preference seems to be 50-50. I do not quite understand it myself as I always preferred the leather pads on the Empyrean and the hybrid pads on my Elite, but after careful testing I can see all pads have some benefits and drawbacks.

After some years there seems to be an equal preference between pads.
What I can confirm from a personal point of view is that to me the full leather Empyrean pads do not work on the Elite and the Elite hybrid pads do not work on the Empyrean.

 

[rsbrsvp]

I had a chance to compare the Elite to the Atrium in my system. The Elite is definitely the more neutral reference sound. It seems the most evenly balanced of all the TOTL cans to my ears. Very smooth. Very good soundstage, and detail. Way better than Susvara in my opinion if you want the smooth presentation. Just a fuller sound with better base. The Susvara is anemic. This is the best rendition of smooth I have ever heard. For reference sound with killer dynamics- TC is it; but smooth it is not.

The Atrium is more of a colored can. In my opinion- colored nicely; lush as they say. The sound has decent bite to it also, which I like. The Eite is so so smooth, and do to this, my perception is it lacks this bite almost entirely. I'm Not choosing sides, just pitching in my two cents.

 

[adrianm]

With all due respect, driving the Susvara with the Oor won't optimize its soundstage dimensions, particularly width. I've listened to the Elite on a handful of different headphone amps, and even a Purifi-based speaker amp, and have never found the soundstage particularly expansive. This was confirmed on my last audition when I then switched to the LCD-5, and thought the stage got noticeably larger and more open. The LCD-5 was also clearly faster and more technically accomplished. Still, between the two, I'd opt for the Elite for its more accurate timbre, given that I don't like to deal with EQ. As much as I enjoyed the Elite, I don't think I'd be happy with it as my only headphone. It's just not quite reference level for genres like jazz. IMHO.

All that said, it's a superb headphone (sonically and aesthetically!) and I certainly understand why it's the #1 choice for a lot of people.

Well soundstage also depends on the dac used, Dave is pretty wide. Ran out of Dave, Elites were much much wider than LCD-5, it wasn't even close. Granted, they might need more power, just like Susvara might need a nuclear reactor to power them , but that's really not a saving grace in my book. Oor is more powerful than most headphone amps, and one of the better synergies for Susvara from what i've read.
LCD-5 did sound more impressive in a vacuum, but when I've had them side by side for 4 days before buying them, it felt like a chore listening to them over the Elites. I feel like they had more apparent detail, but in a very clinical way. Just like with the Susvara, I couldn't really pinpoint anything missing on the Elites. Just different presentations. Also keep in mind the stock cable on it is just bad, the silver plated one does make a surprising difference.
As a counter-example, having Dave vs Lina + clock here, I did notice stuff missing on Dave, so i would call Lina+clock "better" in my book. I get why people like Susvara but they're just not for me, and didn't seem a cut above technically to me.
In my mind, if I'd get something to "outdo" the Elites, it would be the X9000 or the Aperio.

 

[ra990]

Well soundstage also depends on the dac used, Dave is pretty wide. Ran out of Dave, Elites were much much wider than LCD-5, it wasn't even close. Granted, they might need more power, just like Susvara might need a nuclear reactor to power them , but that's really not a saving grace in my book. Oor is more powerful than most headphone amps, and one of the better synergies for Susvara from what i've read.
LCD-5 did sound more impressive in a vacuum, but when I've had them side by side for 4 days before buying them, it felt like a chore listening to them over the Elites. I feel like they had more apparent detail, but in a very clinical way. Just like with the Susvara, I couldn't really pinpoint anything missing on the Elites. Just different presentations. Also keep in mind the stock cable on it is just bad, the silver plated one does make a surprising difference.
As a counter-example, having Dave vs Lina + clock here, I did notice stuff missing on Dave, so i would call Lina+clock "better" in my book. I get why people like Susvara but they're just not for me, and didn't seem a cut above technically to me.
In my mind, if I'd get something to "outdo" the Elites, it would be the X9000 or the Aperio.

As much as I liked the LCD5 when I first got them, I have to agree with you...there's no comparison. I reach for the Elite every time if I want to sit back and enjoy the music. Like you said, in a vacuum, they're very impressive and do a lot of things really well, but when you have other choices, it does seem like a chore to listen on them. I will use the LCD5 in the studio for mixing or tracking, but rarely use them otherwise. They're ridiculously over-the-top for studio use as well really. They are more enjoyable with EQ but I'm always going back and fourth between headphones and it's just easier to not EQ.

 

[BassicScience]

Well soundstage also depends on the dac used, Dave is pretty wide. Ran out of Dave, Elites were much much wider than LCD-5, it wasn't even close. Granted, they might need more power, just like Susvara might need a nuclear reactor to power them , but that's really not a saving grace in my book. Oor is more powerful than most headphone amps, and one of the better synergies for Susvara from what i've read.
LCD-5 did sound more impressive in a vacuum, but when I've had them side by side for 4 days before buying them, it felt like a chore listening to them over the Elites. I feel like they had more apparent detail, but in a very clinical way. Just like with the Susvara, I couldn't really pinpoint anything missing on the Elites. Just different presentations. Also keep in mind the stock cable on it is just bad, the silver plated one does make a surprising difference.
As a counter-example, having Dave vs Lina + clock here, I did notice stuff missing on Dave, so i would call Lina+clock "better" in my book. I get why people like Susvara but they're just not for me, and didn't seem a cut above technically to me.
In my mind, if I'd get something to "outdo" the Elites, it would be the X9000 or the Aperio.

Thanks for your input. My observations of the Elite are based on very limited, anecdotal auditions, as I mentioned. I might well find its soundstage subjectively larger if I played with the chain, changed pads, let my brain adapt, etc. The Oor is a fine amp for the Susvara, but soundstage width is not one of its strengths to my ears. Like many Susvara owners, I highly recommend driving it from a speaker amp for best results.

Regarding the LCD-5, you'll note that I also preferred the Elite overall, but the comparison did highlight (again) to me that the Elite is not the last word in technical performance. A number of respected reviewers also share that view, but it really doesn't matter because the end goal is musical enjoyment. The Elite certainly provides that, and doesn't require EQ or special amping to do so. There's a hell of a lot to be said for that, and I'm happy to give it its due. Meze is also a fabulous company.

I also totally understand why many people don't like the Susvara. There are a number of headphones that better it in one or more areas. But as a genre-agnostic all-rounder, it's still one of the top headphones on the market. IMHO, as always. Cheers.

 

[adrianm]

Thanks for your input. My observations of the Elite are based on very limited, anecdotal auditions, as I mentioned. I might well find its soundstage subjectively larger if I played with the chain, changed pads, let my brain adapt, etc. The Oor is a fine amp for the Susvara, but soundstage width is not one of its strengths to my ears. Like many Susvara owners, I highly recommend driving it from a speaker amp for best results.

Regarding the LCD-5, you'll note that I also preferred the Elite overall, but the comparison did highlight (again) to me that the Elite is not the last word in technical performance. A number of respected reviewers also share that view, but it really doesn't matter because the end goal is musical enjoyment. The Elite certainly provides that, and doesn't require EQ or special amping to do so. There's a hell of a lot to be said for that, and I'm happy to give it its due. Meze is also a fabulous company.

I also totally understand why many people don't like the Susvara. There are a number of headphones that better it in one or more areas. But as a genre-agnostic all-rounder, it's still one of the top headphones on the market. IMHO, as always. Cheers.

Agreed on all points, now you're making me curious to hear the LCD-5 again on the Oor. But besides the sound signature there was also poor comfort that killed it for me. I love the Elites for what they are, but I'm definitely always open to upgrading.
How are you finding your E-stat setup compared to Susvara+the speaker amp for example?

 

[BassicScience]

Agreed on all points, now you're making me curious to hear the LCD-5 again on the Oor. But besides the sound signature there was also poor comfort that killed it for me. I love the Elites for what they are, but I'm definitely always open to upgrading.
How are you finding your E-stat setup compared to Susvara+the speaker amp for example?

A lot of people love the LCD-5, but EQ is pretty universally acknowledged as mandatory for best results. Mandatory EQ is a deal-breaker for me personally, and I've never heard the LCD-5 with it applied. Agreed also on the comfort, although I've never experienced the wider headband that Audeze released in response to initial user complaints.

I'm really loving the STAX X9000, and it's getting the clear majority of head time over the Susvara since I acquired it. The Susvara is better for some rock, but not all. You can read a more fleshed out comparison of the two on page 7 of my "Estat Summit" thread, if you're interested. I don't (yet, anyway) have any plans to sell the Susvara. Outside of estats, it's still my favorite headphone overall, and it's got that extra dollop of bass thump (vs. any estat) that conveys certain tracks better.

 

[Somatic]

Anyone looking to trade Elites for SolPs? Pay difference? PM if interested.

 

[ColSaulTigh]

What models did you compare to. I'd not heard of Hapa seeing they're popular for IEM but they look overt.

Did somebody say "Meze Elite Dark Mystery with a Norne Solvine on a Woo Audio WA5-LE with Elrog and Melz tubes"???

Because that's what I heard

 

[paradoxper]

Did somebody say "Meze Elite Dark Mystery with a Norne Solvine on a Woo Audio WA5-LE with Elrog and Melz tubes"???

Because that's what I heard

LOL. I'll grant you the Norne and Elrogs. Elite.

Oooh and MELZ!