[muaysteve]

I respectfully disagree, or would at least say that op amps can have just as a dramatic effect as tubes.
 
I only have one set of tubes besides the stock ones, and using them sounds "different" than the stock tubes.... but I ordered 3 different op amps from TI (for free) and those were all night and day from each other.  And they were each better than the stock op amp in my humble opinion. (Can remember the model numbers off hand.  I settled on the one I liked best and never looked back)

 

[muaysteve]

And now I remember why I swung by the thread in the first place:
 
Has anyone been able to compare the NE-408a to the WE-408a tubes?  Are they actually the same?  

 

[kvtaco17]

  I respectfully disagree, or would at least say that op amps can have just as a dramatic effect as tubes.
 
I only have one set of tubes besides the stock ones, and using them sounds "different" than the stock tubes.... but I ordered 3 different op amps from TI (for free) and those were all night and day from each other.  And they were each better than the stock op amp in my humble opinion. (Can remember the model numbers off hand.  I settled on the one I liked best and never looked back)

 
And I value your opinion. Its been a very long time since I've heard the stock LD1+... BUT I do remember having some heptodes in it and starting to roll opamps and it seeming like a veil was somewhat lifted... the stock opamp is pretty average. It didn't seem as revolutionary to me as moving up away from the LD approved tube families but it was noticeable. My current 627AP's have carried me very far in my tube rolling adventure... all the way into 6DJ8 territory and soon into the world of octals... I will eventually roll some of the MUSES opamps to change things up because it may be even better lol. Anyways to clarify I do recommend getting away from the stock opamp BUT I'd first find a tube you like and are comfortable with so you have a basis from comparison.
 

above is my current setup... simply amazing what this little amp is capable of when you mod it... hell it even sounds pretty sweet stock!

 

[gibosi]

  And now I remember why I swung by the thread in the first place:
 
Has anyone been able to compare the NE-408a to the WE-408a tubes?  Are they actually the same?  

 
I haven't listened to these tubes in a very long time, but to the best of my recollection, I never noticed any significant difference in their sound.
 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 
And about rolling op amps, I would say that almost any of the recommended op amps you read about in this thread will be significantly better than the stock op amp. So I would suggest that you do your research, select one, and I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. And then start rolling tubes. After you have rolled a bunch of tubes (a few hundred in my case lol), you will have a pretty good idea which tubes are your favorites. At that time, I suggest trying a few more op amps to see which ones have the best synergy with your favorite tubes. Of course, every one has different ears and different gear, and for me, the MUSES 02 op amp matches up the best.
 
Oh.. I see that kvtaco17 responded while I was writing this... But it seems that we essentially agree .
 
I sure envy how nice his amp looks... My LD1+ running a dual triode octal....
 

 

[kvtaco17]

   
I haven't listened to these tubes in a very long time, but to the best of my recollection, I never noticed any significant difference in their sound.
 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 
And about rolling op amps, I would say that almost any of the recommended op amps you read about in this thread will be significantly better than the stock op amp. So I would suggest that you do your research, select one, and I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. And then start rolling tubes. After you have rolled a bunch of tubes (a few hundred in my case lol), you will have a pretty good idea which tubes are your favorites. At that time, I suggest trying a few more op amps to see which ones have the best synergy with your favorite tubes. Of course, every one has different ears and different gear, and for me, the MUSES 02 op amp matches up the best.
 
Oh.. I see that kvtaco17 responded while I was writing this... But it seems that we essentially agree .
 
I sure envy how nice his amp looks... My LD1+ running a dual triode octal....
 

It looks ok... I'm still working on getting some time with a laser cutter to make holes for my DC regulator cards so it can be see and adjusted from the outside of my enclosure. You sir deserve 99% of the credit for inspiring my build. Thank you for continuing to be a part of pushing this tiny amp to its limits.

 

[mrlimbo]

  is ti really a big change in sound by OPamp rolling or it's better result with tube rolling?

For me ive never noticed much of a change with tubes , but have with opamps !

 

[SJWorne]

   
I haven't listened to these tubes in a very long time, but to the best of my recollection, I never noticed any significant difference in their sound.
 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 
And about rolling op amps, I would say that almost any of the recommended op amps you read about in this thread will be significantly better than the stock op amp. So I would suggest that you do your research, select one, and I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. And then start rolling tubes. After you have rolled a bunch of tubes (a few hundred in my case lol), you will have a pretty good idea which tubes are your favorites. At that time, I suggest trying a few more op amps to see which ones have the best synergy with your favorite tubes. Of course, every one has different ears and different gear, and for me, the MUSES 02 op amp matches up the best.
 
Oh.. I see that kvtaco17 responded while I was writing this... But it seems that we essentially agree .
 
I sure envy how nice his amp looks... My LD1+ running a dual triode octal....
 

Mind = Blown
I have to say, I know very little about amps and triodes and stuff... this looks like so much fun to try and mod... how much does doing something like that cost you?

 

[kvtaco17]

  Mind = Blown
I have to say, I know very little about amps and triodes and stuff... this looks like so much fun to try and mod... how much does doing something like that cost you?

Couple bucks lol
 
the vector adapters are like $7 a piece... the bread board is like $15... DC regulator is like $13 and the power adapter to go with it is like $5 if you don't have one laying around... plus wire, and time and tubes lol

 

[gibosi]

  Mind = Blown
I have to say, I know very little about amps and triodes and stuff... this looks like so much fun to try and mod... how much does doing something like that cost you?

 
Not much....
 
Breadboard 9-pin socket = $18.00
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/9-pin-breadboard-prototype-tube-socket-for-DIY-experimenting-/151176364267?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item2332d040eb
 
Two 7-pin test sockets = $10.00
 
http://www.radiodaze.com/product/15450.aspx
 
But of course, you need to know what you are doing. If you are interested, a number of us began to explore using dual triodes in our Little Dot amps on page 200, post 2992:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/2985#post_9817399
 
Mine is downright crude and simple, but others, such as kvtaco17 and MIKELAP, have built very nice dual triode adapters.
 
Edit: Per kvtaco17's posting, a 24V wall adapter with a DC regulator is necessary if you wish to roll tubes drawing more than 500ma of heater current, such as 6SN7. But even if you are using low current tubes, such as 6DJ8, using DC to run the heaters, instead of AC, reduces noise.

 

[i luvmusic 2]

  Tubes will make a bigger difference

Thank You!
so no need for me to change my OP amp.

 

[i luvmusic 2]

  For me ive never noticed much of a change with tubes , but have with opamps !

Thank You!
I know that everytime i changed Tubes i noticed a big deffirence in sound.

 

[SJWorne]

I shall certainly have a look into it at some point
Just enjoying my new amp as it is right now, but at some point I'll have a crack!
Thanks guys!

 

[Arsis]

I respectfully disagree, or would at least say that op amps can have just as a dramatic effect as tubes.

I only have one set of tubes besides the stock ones, and using them sounds "different" than the stock tubes.... but I ordered 3 different op amps from TI (for free) and those were all night and day from each other.  And they were each better than the stock op amp in my humble opinion. (Can remember the model numbers off hand.  I settled on the one I liked best and never looked back)

I switched to an OPA2107 and noticed very little change. I'm still using the stock 6JI tubes and the bass is very mushy. I'm thinking I'll try the Mullard 8161 and swap back to the stock op-amp just to see if I notice a bigger difference.

 

[muaysteve]

I switched to an OPA2107 and noticed very little change. I'm still using the stock 6JI tubes and the bass is very mushy. I'm thinking I'll try the Mullard 8161 and swap back to the stock op-amp just to see if I notice a bigger difference.

 
I'm really surprised to hear that.  2 of the OP amps that I have are the OPA2107 and the LM4562, with the 2107 being the one I prefer.  I thought it brough out a lot of the detail in the songs and opened things up.  I think I'll try throwing the LM4562 back in for a week or so.  I remember it being darker and accentuating the base.  I just switched from Grado sr80i's to ATH-m50's  so maybe I'll hear something different this time.
 
 
And holy cap at those rigs you guys posted... I had no idea stuff like that was even possible.  What does it do for the overall sound?

 

[i luvmusic 2]

   
I'm really surprised to hear that.  2 of the OP amps that I have are the OPA2107 and the LM4562, with the 2107 being the one I prefer.  I thought it brough out a lot of the detail in the songs and opened things up.  I think I'll try throwing the LM4562 back in for a week or so.  I remember it being darker and accentuating the base.  I just switched from Grado sr80i's to ATH-m50's  so maybe I'll hear something different this time.
 
 
And holy cap at those rigs you guys posted... I had no idea stuff like that was even possible.  What does it do for the overall sound?

You should check these out "Little Dot Tube Amps: Vacuum Tube Rolling Guide"....