LH Labs Geek Out v2+ Discussion Thread

[senorx12562]

They sold cheap options to buy, and now, due to complaints from the non-buyers of those options, they're retroactively and unilaterally modifying the terms under which those options were sold.

This might make a decent exam question in a law school Contracts exam. The only reason they're going to get away with this is the fact that the dollar sums involved are small. If the sums were worth litigating over, they would be in a world of hurt.

I'd say it is safe to assume you are not a lawyer.

 

[senorx12562]

I purchased a Pulse vanilla through their indiegogo campaign, and have no complaints about the way that was handled. The device itself sounds fantastic, and their customer support has been impeccable. I pre-ordered ordered the v2+, and had no problem paying in full when asked. I also had no problem with them bumping people who had paid in full ahead of people who'd paid $2. I'm excited to get the device. My 2 cents.

 

[Joeybgood]

  I purchased a Pulse vanilla through their indiegogo campaign, and have no complaints about the way that was handled. The device itself sounds fantastic, and their customer support has been impeccable. I pre-ordered ordered the v2+, and had no problem paying in full when asked. I also had no problem with them bumping people who had paid in full ahead of people who'd paid $2. I'm excited to get the device. My 2 cents.

This may have already been addressed, but is the USB port on the V2+ a micro? If so, can anyone recommend a micro to micro OTG cable to connect to my android phone? tks!!

 

[DecentLevi]

Yes it appears that V2+ uses a micro cable, but I would assume that perhaps one is already included. Quite honestly, probably only 1 out of a million people are able to hear any difference for sound quality of digital signal cables (I speak from experience), so just about any micro to micro USB cable that you can find online (Google shopping, Amazon, eBay, etc.) would yield precisely the same result, starting at around $3.

 

[Joeybgood]

I would agree but I'm not having much luck locating one as yet . only want it to be 4" or so in length. I'll touch base with Gavin to see if one will be included.

 

[gikigill]

Fiio does make one. Can't remember the name though.

 

[Dithyrambes]

I would agree but I'm not having much luck locating one as yet . only want it to be 4" or so in length. I'll touch base with Gavin to see if one will be included.

They said only a charging cable would be included.

 

[senorx12562]

Ironic that after posting that I had no problem paying them up front, when inquiring about I found out that one can only use their proprietary cable which is a micro to micro usg OTG cable (and one terminal has the sense pin grounded so a plain micro to micro cable will not work. Apparently ONLY LH makes such a cable. $99. There is no other way to get a digital signal into the V2+. It can only be used with an OTG enabled Android (Lollipop and above only please,which nothing I own is) and their bespoke cable. I assume it can be used with an ios cck kit as well (don't know- don't do ios). Since my plan was to use my x5 as transport using the v2+ as DAC/amp, It is totally worthless to me. As far as portability goes, for me, it's as portable as my pulse sitting on my desk. Which was not clearly disclosed before I had to pony up. Manny at LH Labs has assured me that I will be refunded my $ as soon as they can get " all the data" from IGG. In the meantime, They have $286 of mine that they can't refund, while I wait for a device I can't use. We'll see. Oh, and as an aside, their ticket system for customer support is, bar none, the absolute worst model I've ever seen. LH could learn from Comcast when it comes to customer support. More fool me, I guess. Hoist on my own petard.

 

[senorx12562]

Fiio does make one. Can't remember the name though.

I do not believe this is true.

 

[AustinValentine]

  Ironic that after posting that I had no problem paying them up front, when inquiring about I found out that one can only use their proprietary cable which is a micro to micro usg OTG cable (and one terminal has the sense pin grounded so a plain micro to micro cable will not work. Apparently ONLY LH makes such a cable. $99. There is no other way to get a digital signal into the V2+. It can only be used with an OTG enabled Android (Lollipop and above only please,which nothing I own is) and their bespoke cable. I assume it can be used with an ios cck kit as well (don't know- don't do ios). Since my plan was to use my x5 as transport using the v2+ as DAC/amp, It is totally worthless to me. As far as portability goes, for me, it's as portable as my pulse sitting on my desk. Which was not clearly disclosed before I had to pony up. Manny at LH Labs has assured me that I will be refunded my $ as soon as they can get " all the data" from IGG. In the meantime, They have $286 of mine that they can't refund, while I wait for a device I can't use. We'll see. Oh, and as an aside, their ticket system for customer support is, bar none, the absolute worst model I've ever seen. LH could learn from Comcast when it comes to customer support. More fool me, I guess. Hoist on my own petard.

 
All Micro-to-Micro USB-OTG cables have the sense (or ID) pin grounded. That's actually what differentiates an OTG cable from a non-OTG cable. See DanBa's post here that shows the pin configuration for normal vs OTG. 
 
Plenty of manufacturers make these - you can find dozens on Amazon. 
 
That being said, it would be helpful if you could reproduce the email from LH or other source that told you that only their proprietary cable would work with the device. If they (LH) were the ones told you that you can only use their $99 cable with the V2+ specifically via email, then that's another matter entirely. I'm interested in what source you have for this information.

 

[Dithyrambes]

I am just concerned they will ship the V2+ without the necessary cables for operation. All they include is a charging cable...but they say you need to use their lightspeed 1g cable and their otg cable to get the best out of their device. I find it annoying how we have to purchase more to use the product out of the box, yet alone the level of performance a device is made to give. I opened a ticket at LH labs, but they still have not yet addressed it....its been over 12 hours.

 

[AustinValentine]

  I am just concerned they will ship the V2+ without the necessary cables for operation. All they include is a charging cable...but they say you need to use their lightspeed 1g cable and their otg cable to get the best out of their device. I find it annoying how we have to purchase more to use the product out of the box, yet alone the level of performance a device is made to give. I opened a ticket at LH labs, but they still have not yet addressed it....its been over 12 hours.

 
If it's only been 12 hours it means that you sent the message on a Sunday night on a 4th of July Holiday weekend. There's also a three hour time difference between you and LH; from NY to California. It's probably going to take a bit more time to get a response. 
 
There's a wide difference between "only works with" and "get the best out of". I personally wouldn't trust that their USB OTG cables are any better/different from a stock OTG cable produced by a third party. For example: In the case of the short usb cable in the case of short USB extension cable that came with the GO450/720/1000, a number of people (myself included) had the extender cable break after very little use. I'm my case, it was in less than 10 hours of use. My el cheapo replacement that I bought off of Amazon for $7 kept going like a workhorse and didn't sound any different. 
 
With a lot of high end audio products, manufacturers don't provide cables. For example, the Cavalli Liquid Carbon - a boutique amplifier - doesn't even come with a power cable. It's a pretty annoying practice but at this point the hobby only has itself to blame. As a hobby, we're pretty obsessed with boutique or individualized cabling. Manufacturers know this.

 

[Dithyrambes]

   
If it's only been 12 hours it means that you sent the message on a Sunday night on a 4th of July Holiday weekend. There's also a three hour time difference between you and LH; from NY to California. It's probably going to take a bit more time to get a response. 
 
There's a wide difference between "only works with" and "get the best out of". I personally wouldn't trust that their USB OTG cables are any better/different from a stock OTG cable produced by a third party. For example: In the case of the short usb cable in the case of short USB extension cable that came with the GO450/720/1000, a number of people (myself included) had the extender cable break after very little use. I'm my case, it was in less than 10 hours of use. My el cheapo replacement that I bought off of Amazon for $7 kept going like a workhorse and didn't sound any different. 
 
With a lot of high end audio products, manufacturers don't provide cables. For example, the Cavalli Liquid Carbon - a boutique amplifier - doesn't even come with a power cable. It's a pretty annoying practice but at this point the hobby only has itself to blame. As a hobby, we're pretty obsessed with boutique or individualized cabling. Manufacturers know this.

I just hope it sounds good. I already have an ifi Micro iDSD, which can do everything. If it doesn't sound as good or surpass it, I will sell it and get a project Polaris for my he-560s

 

[senorx12562]

   
All Micro-to-Micro USB-OTG cables have the sense (or ID) pin grounded. That's actually what differentiates an OTG cable from a non-OTG cable. See DanBa's post here that shows the pin configuration for normal vs OTG. 
 
Plenty of manufacturers make these - you can find dozens on Amazon. 
 
That being said, it would be helpful if you could reproduce the email from LH or other source that told you that only their proprietary cable would work with the device. If they (LH) were the ones told you that you can only use their $99 cable with the V2+ specifically via email, then that's another matter entirely. I'm interested in what source you have for this information.

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824   I see Kurt, well i have the V2+ prototype and use the Tidal app for all my hifi music since they have a huge library of audio, pretty much anything i can think of they had. it can also be use for a Apple computer or PC if you have a just a Micro to USB A male.    Best regards Manny,  On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:52 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote: Can you guys make a trs (mono) 3.5 mm to micro usb digital cable. That would do the trick.   On Jun 19, 2015 5:47 PM, "Kurt Hertel" <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote: Thanks for your time Manny. My phone is a motog, but that's irrelevant, as it only has 8gb of storage and no expansion. My plan all along was to use my fiio x5 as transport only and use the v2+ as dac and amp, as I do with my ifi micro idsd, but apparently i can't use it that way. I also have a Samsung galaxy tab s8.4 which after checking, I see is running android 5.0.2, which I think is lollipop, (they must've updated it while I was asleep, cause it came with 4.4.? In the end, it will be of limited to no utility to me if this will be the only non pc device I can use it with, especially as I can't afford $50 for a bespoke cable. I spent everything I had for the device. Hope it gets good reviews, as I'm apparently gonna have to sell it off as soon as I get it.   Hi Kurt Hertel, Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824   This is new to Lollipop for Android as it was the biggest requested feature for Android operating systems to support audio out as well as Audio in via USB.   At this moment only Lollipop and IOS 6 support this functionality. (without having to do major tweaks to the software of previous versions)    I would like to ask which mobile device you do have and see if anything is available.    Best regards Manny,  On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:28 PM , LH Labs <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:   Hi Kurt Hertel, Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824     On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:27 PM , LH Labs <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:   Hi Kurt Hertel, Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824   The tips are pretty much interchangeable but the most common OTG sold is a USB-A female to Micro male B because there are not many devices that would need both ends to be Micro male B on both ends of the cable.    That is why we have to make our own for our own device. the only thing that actually makes an OTG is grounding one of the pins, check out the diagram. But instead of a USB-A female we just solder a Micro male B on both ends.    Let me know if this helps at all i should have been more clear about this in your previous ticket.    11824         Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> Jun 19 ​  ​ [td=rowspan:2] ​

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So for me, it's not really a mobile device. I already have 4 DACs for pcs including a pulse, so I hardly hardly need another. Can you at least find me some direction as to how to rig a 3.5mm mono plug to a cable with a Micro usb plug? Otherwise, you're basically telling me " Tough ****, can't help you dude," correct?

 

 


 

Manny Torres	Jun 19 ​	​

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Hi Kurt Hertel,

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824

That would be a very hard cable to find. I wouldn't leave you with a device you couldn't use. The only issue is that i am unable to refund for this until the campaign is over. ( all the data is on Indiegogo's database till we get it at the end of the campaign). 

Best regards Manny,   

On Fri, 19 Jun at 4:50 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote: So for me, it's not really a mobile device. I already have 4 DACs for pcs including a pulse, so I hardly hardly need another. Can you at least find me some direction as to how to rig a 3.5mm mono plug to a cable with a Micro usb plug? Otherwise, you're basically telling me " Tough ****, can't help you dude," correct?

On Jun 19, 2015 6:41 PM, "Manny Torres" <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:

 
Hi Kurt Hertel,

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
  I see Kurt, well i have the V2+ prototype and use the Tidal app for all my hifi music since they have a huge library of audio, pretty much anything i can think of they had. it can also be use for a Apple computer or PC if you have a just a Micro to USB A male. 
 
Best regards Manny, 

On Fri, 19 Jun at 3:52 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote: Can you guys make a trs (mono) 3.5 mm to micro usb digital cable. That would do the trick.
 

On Jun 19, 2015 5:47 PM, "Kurt Hertel" <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks for your time Manny. My phone is a motog, but that's irrelevant, as it only has 8gb of storage and no expansion. My plan all along was to use my fiio x5 as transport only and use the v2+ as dac and amp, as I do with my ifi micro idsd, but apparently i can't use it that way. I also have a Samsung galaxy tab s8.4 which after checking, I see is running android 5.0.2, which I think is lollipop, (they must've updated it while I was asleep, cause it came with 4.4.? In the end, it will be of limited to no utility to me if this will be the only non pc device I can use it with, especially as I can't afford $50 for a bespoke cable. I spent everything I had for the device. Hope it gets good reviews, as I'm apparently gonna have to sell it off as soon as I get it.
 
Hi Kurt Hertel,

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
  This is new to Lollipop for Android as it was the biggest requested feature for Android operating systems to support audio out as well as Audio in via USB.
 
At this moment only Lollipop and IOS 6 support this functionality. (without having to do major tweaks to the software of previous versions) 
 
I would like to ask which mobile device you do have and see if anything is available. 
 
Best regards Manny, 


 

11824  




 

 


 

Kurt Hertel	When is the campaign over?	Jun 19

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Stephanie Rodriguez	This is Stephanie at LH labs, thank you for your time. Manny is out for the d...	Jun 22

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Manny Torres	Thank you for your time Kurt, So i will put this ticket on freeze, ( it will ...	Jun 24 (12 days ago)

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Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com>	Jun 24 (12 days ago) ​	​

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Thank you Manny

 

On Jun 24, 2015 11:36 AM, "Manny Torres" <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:

 
Hi Kurt Hertel,

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
  Thank you for your time Kurt, 
 
So i will put this ticket on freeze, ( it will show as closed on your end) once the campaign is over we can open it up again and get you that refund once we get the data from Indiegogo. I am glad i was able to help with your questions. Again thank you for your time and support. 
 
Best regards Manny, 

On Mon, 22 Jun at 10:23 AM , LH Labs <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:  
Hi Kurt Hertel,

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824
 
This is Stephanie at LH labs, thank you for your time. Manny is out for the day so I will be helping out with his ticket. The campaign is over on June 28th. It will take a few days to get all the data from Indiegogo and sort it out. Let us know if you have any further questions.
  Best Wishes,
Stephanie
Customer Happiness Agent
 

920 Reserve Drive,Suite 160
Roseville, CA 95747
http://www.lhlabs.com

On Fri, 19 Jun at 5:06 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote: When is the campaign over?

On Jun 19, 2015 7:04 PM, "Manny Torres" <support@lhlabs.freshdesk.com> wrote:

 
Hi Kurt Hertel,

Ticket: https://support.lhlabs.com/helpdesk/tickets/11824

That would be a very hard cable to find. I wouldn't leave you with a device you couldn't use. The only issue is that i am unable to refund for this until the campaign is over. ( all the data is on Indiegogo's database till we get it at the end of the campaign). 

Best regards Manny,   

On Fri, 19 Jun at 4:50 PM , Kurt Hertel <senorx12562@gmail.com> wrote: So for me, it's not really a mobile device. I already have 4 DACs for pcs including a pulse, so I hardly hardly need another. Can you at least find me some direction as to how to rig a 3.5mm mono plug to a cable with a Micro usb plug? Otherwise, you're basically telling me " Tough ****, can't help you dude," correct?
 

11824

 

 

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[senorx12562]

   
All Micro-to-Micro USB-OTG cables have the sense (or ID) pin grounded. That's actually what differentiates an OTG cable from a non-OTG cable. See DanBa's post here that shows the pin configuration for normal vs OTG. 
 
Plenty of manufacturers make these - you can find dozens on Amazon. 
 
That being said, it would be helpful if you could reproduce the email from LH or other source that told you that only their proprietary cable would work with the device. If they (LH) were the ones told you that you can only use their $99 cable with the V2+ specifically via email, then that's another matter entirely. I'm interested in what source you have for this information.

Please provide a link for a USB Micro Male to USB Micro Male OTG cable, if you would be so kind. It's something of a moot point for my intended use however, since it has to be an Android/lollipop device.