[Ikarios]

As my Head-Fi journey continues, I've gone through more and more headphones, each time finding something "just wrong enough" that I still want to try other stuff. The closest I think I've come to perfection is the K701, but the two biggest issues, with comfort and bass, are enough for me to keep going.
 
Anyway, I was thinking the other day why I liked the K701 so much. I didn't like the HD650s because the treble had a little bit of splash (but the mids were gorgeous), I don't particularly like Grados because the combination of aggression and in-your-face soundstage meant that they were fatiguing after a while, I didn't like the MS1000s because they sounded too similar to the K701 while sounding just a little bit "off". My friend finally brought back his AD700s, which I'd been itching to try again, and after a few songs I realized - I love the mids and presentation of the AD700, but the treble has the same "splash" and "shimmer" I saw in the HD650, but much more pronounced. From the description of the AD700 and from what I remembered I thought I would instantly love these things.
 
So, the common denominator with everything that I dislike - is it the detail that the K701 has in the treble that has me wanting more? Every time I go to another headphone I find that I hear the same shimmer and splash, especially on cymbal hits, consonant sounds ("t" and "sssss"), higher overdriven guitar notes (generally on solos, up near the top of the fret range of the top three strings) basically anything in the high frequency range. When I first read about the K701 I thought the "clinical"ness and analytical sound would drive me away, given my penchant for Grado tone, but I was quite surprised that this was not the case. Actually I found that the AKG did guitars fairly well, while doing away with the shimmer that I so hated.
 
I guess the real question is - where do I go from here? Do I try Beyer? Higher end Audio-Technicas? The description of Beyer mids has me worried but the description of the high end sounds similar to what I like in the K701. Higher-end Audio-Technicas hit the nail on the head as far as the mids go... I'm not sure about the highs, given what I'm hearing in the AD700s, not to mention the price of the higher-end AT models... maybe I should try some of the vintage AKGs? There's so many models of those I have on idea where to start, though... how can I find a more comfortable K701 with more bass? Is there a secret monster lurking out there, just waiting for me to snatch it up so I can fall in love with it and eschew all other temptations?
 
Thanks for reading.

 

[Satellite_6]

Aren't cymbals supposed to sound shimmery? Can't this be solved with an EQ anyway? I don't like the upper mids/highs on the HD 650s until I turn them down a bit, then they sound great.

 
Sorry for not answering your question. . . 

 

[Riku540]

I understand what you're saying with cymbal hits. One thing I wanted to point out; it may not be entirely the fault of your headphones. Many rock songs, especially hard rock seem to be recorded in a congested manner, so even with the most revealing headphones you may have trouble getting the separation and clarity on the high end that you will often hear in other music. The fact of the matter is, your headphones may actually be doing the recording justice to the point of "revealing" poorly recorded or mastered music, which is a common problem audiophiles will have along the way.
 
The search never ends though. I greatly enjoy my DT 880's as the most "revealing" headphone I have. I can't say that they will "fix" your problem though.

 

[Dibster]

EQ:ing doesn't much much anything in my opinion. You hear the same sound, it's just louder or quieter. You're adjusting volume, not improving quality. There may be subjective improvements to be had, but they're quite limited and you're often doing damage in addition to fixing things.
 
I agree that the K701 excels in treble. What it doesn't excel in is midrange and bass. I also agree that the HD650 midrange is beautiful, bass is adequate, but trebles have that sizzle and hiss. I wouldn't know what to recommend you, I haven't found the perfect phones either.

 

[Riku540]

I don't think anyone here has. Just look at the picture threads lol...

 

[TheGhostWhoWalks]

If you're wanting detail in the treble you might try the Sony SA5Ks. I wrote a somewhat-detailed (no pun intended) review of them on Amazon (the first spotlight review). To my ears, they're the most revealing headphones out there and they have a very pronounced top-end with tremendous clarity. They can sound a bit metallic/bright, though, and I recommend combining them with a warm source and amp if possible. I'm curious as to why you found the K701s lacking in comfort and bass, as I really think they excel in the former and are quite good in the latter. Though I've recently come to think that bass is as much an amp/power problem as a headphone problem.

 

[Deep Funk]

You can also try the more studio oriented headphones. My Pioneer Monitor 10, oldie I know but the clarity and detail are outstanding but the lower bass extension sounds subtle. Recently I received a Sony MDR CD900 ST and the Sony clarity was there in abundance, bright abundance if I may say so. 
 
A capable DAC can also help. Combine parts like equalizers, amplifiers and DACs if possible. On some intergraded amplifiers(/receivers) you can find filters for the high and low range which work with the push of a button. 
 
I feel I am almost done with headphones so I am looking for better audio gear to complement my listening set up.
 
P.S. I was not very taken with the K701 for the drums/highs were lacking a certain immediacy. 

 

[Uncle Erik]

Maybe transparency is what you're after.

 

[joelpearce]

Your other option is to try some orthos or electrostatics.
 
If it is transparency you are after, properly damped orthos are unmatched, and I have several pairs that also have nice, rich bass as well.  They have mids that are truly stunning, and tend to have nice treble detail without getting that splashy sound.  You won't quite get the sound stage you're used to with the K701, but I think it's a worthwhile sacrifice.

 

[Satellite_6]

Quote:

EQ:ing doesn't much much anything in my opinion. You hear the same sound, it's just louder or quieter. You're adjusting volume, not improving quality. There may be subjective improvements to be had, but they're quite limited and you're often doing damage in addition to fixing things.
 
I agree that the K701 excels in treble. What it doesn't excel in is midrange and bass. I also agree that the HD650 midrange is beautiful, bass is adequate, but trebles have that sizzle and hiss. I wouldn't know what to recommend you, I haven't found the perfect phones either.

Oh I think EQing can do wonders clearing up the sound but thats just IMO. . . 

 

[paconavarro]

Give a try to the beyers, I recently changed from sennheiser to beyer and I found they are more fond to my musical taste.

 

[lejaz]

I also find drums lacking with the k702(snares especially don't have the proper midrange fullness that they have with most other phones...can be very thin sounding with the 702). This is from a former drummer BTW. Curious myself it the beyer 880 would have better mids... as well as the highs the OP likes.
 
Quote:

You can also try the more studio oriented headphones. My Pioneer Monitor 10, oldie I know but the clarity and detail are outstanding but the lower bass extension sounds subtle. Recently I received a Sony MDR CD900 ST and the Sony clarity was there in abundance, bright abundance if I may say so. 
 
A capable DAC can also help. Combine parts like equalizers, amplifiers and DACs if possible. On some intergraded amplifiers(/receivers) you can find filters for the high and low range which work with the push of a button. 
 
I feel I am almost done with headphones so I am looking for better audio gear to complement my listening set up.
 
P.S. I was not very taken with the K701 for the drums/highs were lacking a certain immediacy. 

 

[Deep Funk]

Quote:

I also find drums lacking with the k702(snares especially don't have the proper midrange fullness that they have with most other phones...can be very thin sounding with the 702). This is from a former drummer BTW. Curious myself it the beyer 880 would have better mids... as well as the highs the OP likes.

Thanks, now I know the K702 is not for me. For your information: I compared the AKG with my 'new' Pioneer at the time and I preferred the Pioneer.
 

 

[Ikarios]

Quote:

Aren't cymbals supposed to sound shimmery? Can't this be solved with an EQ anyway? I don't like the upper mids/highs on the HD 650s until I turn them down a bit, then they sound great.

 
Sorry for not answering your question. . . 

Yes, cymbals do have the natural "shimmer" - which is why I have such a hard time describing what I hear. It's almost as if the AKGs have just the right "edge" on cymbals and higher-frequency notes, where most of the other headphones I've tried tend to "smear" that shimmer so a "sss" sounds more like a "sshhhh". I used to describe it as sibilance, but that term seems to be used so vaguely that I stopped using it.
Quote:

Maybe transparency is what you're after.

 
I think you're on to something... and with this, my wallet cries anew...

 

[Deep Funk]

AKG K240 DF? JVC HA DX3, very transparent and in my opinion very AKG-like in sound with amazing musicality. That JVC gave a new dimension to Black Sabbath...