[SynFlood]

Ignore, they settled on a 900$ repair fee which I am OK with and is fair enough. Not expecting them to do it free nor did I act like it was not my fault.

 

[msing539]

This is appalling...

 

[Sebastien Chiu]

Say what?

Please take note @Jack Vang @JasonNYC.

 

[Leasahj]

Hey everyone,So I bought the A&K and Empire Ears Odyssey which ran me almost 3800 after tax. Still new to IEMs I was not expecting them to be so delicate but tried to be careful. I dropped one pretty lightly onto a granite countertop and it cracked open .Now I've had my EE Bravado MKII for a bit and never had a problem even placed it on the same counter so i suspect something may have been defective but they claim that not to be the case.


The unit never had any damage internally and didn't even split open fully so it still held the contents. It couldn't have damaged much falling from such a short distance. Maybe some wiring but nothing more.They want to charge me 1700 and told me to get it back they would keep the "broken "one





So what , they charge me for a replacement, keep the drivers and reuse the internals, resell it and give me a new one ?I don't mind paying for repair but this is like if my DAP had a broken screen, they take it and keep it and bill me for a new one ?

Little do they know I am affiliated with a popular hifi YouTube channel (met them at a convention years ago) who asked me to bring them over for a video review (we live next to each other ironically ) and they told me horror stories about their customer service and support. Turns out they were not lying.

Any legal recourse possible here? What should I do?

Shame because i liked that brand and almost bought their most expensive dap.

Hey @draknode

Hey everyone,So I bought the A&K and Empire Ears Odyssey which ran me almost 3800 after tax. Still new to IEMs I was not expecting them to be so delicate but tried to be careful. I dropped one pretty lightly onto a granite countertop and it cracked open .Now I've had my EE Bravado MKII for a bit and never had a problem even placed it on the same counter so i suspect something may have been defective but they claim that not to be the case.


The unit never had any damage internally and didn't even split open fully so it still held the contents. It couldn't have damaged much falling from such a short distance. Maybe some wiring but nothing more.They want to charge me 1700 and told me to get it back they would keep the "broken "one





So what , they charge me for a replacement, keep the drivers and reuse the internals, resell it and give me a new one ?I don't mind paying for repair but this is like if my DAP had a broken screen, they take it and keep it and bill me for a new one ?

Little do they know I am affiliated with a popular hifi YouTube channel (met them at a convention years ago) who asked me to bring them over for a video review (we live next to each other ironically ) and they told me horror stories about their customer service and support. Turns out they were not lying.

Any legal recourse possible here? What should I do?

Shame because i liked that brand and almost bought their most expensive dap.

Hey @draknode
Please check your PM

 

[JasonNYC]

Hey everyone,So I bought the A&K and Empire Ears Odyssey which ran me almost 3800 after tax. Still new to IEMs I was not expecting them to be so delicate but tried to be careful. I dropped one pretty lightly onto a granite countertop and it cracked open .Now I've had my EE Bravado MKII for a bit and never had a problem even placed it on the same counter so i suspect something may have been defective but they claim that not to be the case.


The unit never had any damage internally and didn't even split open fully so it still held the contents. It couldn't have damaged much falling from such a short distance. Maybe some wiring but nothing more.They want to charge me 1700 and told me to get it back they would keep the "broken "one





So what , they charge me for a replacement, keep the drivers and reuse the internals, resell it and give me a new one ?I don't mind paying for repair but this is like if my DAP had a broken screen, they take it and keep it and bill me for a new one ?

Little do they know I am affiliated with a popular hifi YouTube channel (met them at a convention years ago) who asked me to bring them over for a video review (we live next to each other ironically ) and they told me horror stories about their customer service and support. Turns out they were not lying.

Any legal recourse possible here? What should I do?

Shame because i liked that brand and almost bought their most expensive dap.

You only included a very small portion of the response from customer support. You should have included the full email chain as there is a lot more to this. I read the 15+ emails and saw the pics. You even stated in one of the emails that there is some wire damage. They definitely don't look like they were lightly dropped, there is some pretty significant damage in multiple places like something was dropped on them or they were stepped on.

I also liked the part of your email where you said you are well known and threatened to call us out if we didn't handle it exactly like you wanted us to.

 

[Sebastien Chiu]

You only included a very small portion of the response from customer support. You should have included the full email chain as there is a lot more to this. I read the 15+ emails and saw the pics. You even stated in one of the emails that there is some wire damage. They definitely don't look like they were lightly dropped, there is some pretty significant damage in multiple places like something was dropped on them or they were stepped on.

I also liked the part of your email where you said you are well known and threatened to call us out if we didn't handle it exactly like you wanted us to.

There is always more to the story.

Thanks for chiming in so fast @Leasahj @JasonNYC!

 

[SynFlood]

.

 

[SynFlood]

There is always more to the story.

Thanks for chiming in so fast @Leasahj @JasonNYC!

Edited, I was away on business and typed the last one on mobile I wasn't trying to critique their RMA process. I am speaking about repairs and lets assume for the sake of argument this was user error (my fault)

Regardless, regardless of warranty/RMA status lets say it is my fault so I am not covered warranty that is possible I am not trying to badmouth their warranty or inspection process that seems like a through process. I can own up to the fact that is could and is likely my fault maybe I dropped it harder then I thought,


I wouldn't mind paying less then MSRP and giving them the damaged one

I wouldn't mind paying MSRP and getting my damaged property back

I do mind them charging me MSRP, replacing the unit and confiscating what I paid a good bit of money for

"All A&K-released media units are fully enclosed and not self-serviceable; there is no reason to offer the opportunity for a future self-service attempt or resell of the hardware components) The original parts won't be returned; upon enrolling the damaged device through Astell&Kern's RMA Service Protocol, you offered your acknowledgment and confirmation of the terms and conditions"

Currently, the entire RMA case for RMA Number: XXXX is on hold and subject to be terminated with the unit returning to the customer in the current condition without repair.

Since the damage is severe on the Right Housing, the entire unit may need to be replaced, and the estimated replacement fee would be between $1,750.00 ~ 1,900.00

Should the customer like to proceed with the RMA service, all communication must remain in writing and a credit card authorization form with a signature will be required in advance.

No additional arrangement will be considered

This email will serve as a firm notification. No additional or special arrangement will be considered.

Without confirmation received, the RMA unit will be returned in the condition it was documented, without repair.

Thank you.

I have a masters in Electrical Engineering if I paid 3800 for a unit may as well take a look or try to fix it maybe even just learn or understand a bit more about the product

Sure that is a pretty broken shell but you mean to tell me that you cant do anything with all those electronics inside at all? I mean it wouldn't sell for so much if it was invaluable E-waste that was damaged beyond repair

but to pay for a replacement, give you that unit is just buying the same unit twice for the price of one

crap if I knew you'd keep it id have just asked you to bill me 1700$ for a left-ear unit, kept that for my own tinkering/learning/maybe a project


I honestly should have just done that if I am going to be paying MSRP and surrendering my expensive property I would have been thrilled to take a look inside and learn a little something or try to fix it, not sure I can solder that well but would be fun to try

 

[Sebastien Chiu]

Edited, I was away on business and typed the last one on mobile I wasn't trying to critique their RMA process. I am speaking about repairs and lets assume for the sake of argument this was user error (my fault)

Regardless, regardless of warranty/RMA status lets say it is my fault so I am not covered warranty that is possible I am not trying to badmouth their warranty or inspection process that seems like a through process. I can own up to the fact that is could and is likely my fault maybe I dropped it harder then I thought,


I wouldn't mind paying less then MSRP and giving them the damaged one

I wouldn't mind paying MSRP and getting my damaged property back

I do mind them charging me MSRP, replacing the unit and confiscating what I paid a good bit of money for






I have a masters in Electrical Engineering if I paid 3800 for a unit may as well take a look or try to fix it maybe even just learn or understand a bit more about the product

Sure that is a pretty broken shell but you mean to tell me that you cant do anything with all those electronics inside at all? I mean it wouldn't sell for so much if it was invaluable E-waste that was damaged beyond repair

but to pay for a replacement, give you that unit is just buying the same unit twice for the price of one

crap if I knew you'd keep it id have just asked you to bill me 1700$ for a left-ear unit, kept that for my own tinkering/learning/maybe a project


I honestly should have just done that if I am going to be paying MSRP and surrendering my expensive property I would have been thrilled to take a look inside and learn a little something or try to fix it, not sure I can solder that well but would be fun to try

Sorry, but I don't think this response will help you get any further. Jason already made his point.

Respectfully, a breather from this will do you better than continuing to go off.

It is industry standard for any manufacturer to keep a shell they are going to replace - we do this at DUNU too, this is nothing new.

 

[SynFlood]

Edit:

 

[SynFlood]

Really starting to wonder if this product was ever worth the money honestly. 2 Months, still without my IEMs or a resolution. Bought the U18T from Audio64 and saw their policy

In the case of a broken shell, we offer a remolding service which has a base price plus additional costs for customizations, replacement drivers, and shipping.


The following fees apply to minor physical damage, sound issues, or other problems with your IEMs.

• Repair Tier 1 - Duo, V2, A2, A2e, V3, A3, A3e, A3t, Qi, A4, A4t, A4s, A5, V6, V6-Stage A6, A6t, U6t, EPCs – $99
• Repair Tier 2 - V8, A8, N8, Nio, A10, A12, A12t, U12t, tia Trió™ – $199
• Repair Tier 3 - A18t, A18s, U18t, U18s, tia Fourté™, Fourté Noir™ – $299
  
  
• Total loss fees to remake your IEMs:
  
  A2e, A3e – 30% off current retail price (MSRP)
  
  A3t, A4t, A4s, A6t, N8, A12t, A18t – 50% off current retail price (MSRP)
  
  
• If only one unit is a total loss, the fees outlined above are halved.

By that logic 3500/2 = 1700

1700/2 = 850

Well that makes sense rather then paying for it, waiting for months, being told its beyond repair (but many other vendors remold/re-shell/repair their products) then paying 1700 to repair it + 3700 (after tax) so total $5400 while agreeing to surrender the cracked unit (technically my property but hey, take it and re-use the internals and charge me full MSRP. At this point its either repaired for a lesser price (obviously covering labor/costs/postage but at least you dont need to replace every driver (EST, DD, WeaponX and BA).

that's crazy, dropped it, it split, I held it together and packaged it so it would remain in tact and the internal contents would not get damaged) the 2-pin scratches I can own up to. But damn I really should have listened when I read about A&Ks customer service on here and avoided this whole ordeal

 

[SynFlood]

I gotta ask now that NYC passed the right to repair law, It is actually Illegal (and you can be reported and fined for violating it) to request your products/parts to be returned

Right to repair is a legal right for owners of devices and equipment to freely modify and repair products such as automobiles, electronics, and farm equipment

The law is enforced by the New York attorney general, who will give written notice to any manufacturers out of compliance. They will have five days after that notice to remedy the violation of the law, after which they’ll be subject to penalties. Any disagreements about definitions of covered products and whether given repair programs qualify will be up to the attorney general to address.

https://www.norwoodnews.org/ny-beco...-for-consumers-of-digital-electronic-devices/

"All A&K-released media units are fully enclosed and not self-serviceable; there is no reason to offer the opportunity for a future self-service attempt or resell of the hardware components) The original parts won't be returned; upon enrolling the damaged device through Astell&Kern's RMA Service Protocol, you offered your acknowledgment and confirmation of the terms and conditions"

 

[SynFlood]

Also i love how you claim you cant leave the damaged unit with the customer (dare they service it right ?) but would have to send me it back as is if i refuse to pay for warranty. So if you did so then wouldnt I be able to service/repair/find a third party? So now that I am paying All the same as if I got a replacement and my property back but they claim they cant return it to me because

"here is no reason to offer the opportunity for a future self-service attempt or resell of the hardware components"

So what the **** difference does it make if I refuse to pay, get that IEM in the mail and service it myself or ask craft/itsfitlab to re-shell it vs Pay the 1700 and get that and the damaged IEM?

Either way you were offering to send the unrepaired unit back but not with a replacement? Strange

It is true, unless you like spending thousands of dollars to have nothing in hand, be charged for all repairs (likely MSRP) and have 0 support and no guarantee that you will have your expensive product for too long. Any issues/repair/RMA will take 2-3 months, a lot of emails, and a large fee likely the same price as the product was when you first bought it. Just my .02c, stop funding companies who wont give you a guarantee , solutions and repair for any issues you may have and will not work with the customer at all.

"Astell & Kern controls the distribution of its parts (my apologies in advance if it turns out that was an egregiously misinformed presumption) and apparently refuses to sell them to custom cable manufacturers and DIY'ers for... reasons. "

"I tried several times to get a replacement from A&K, with no luck, so I tried the Q-Jays cable and it does work. Unfortunately, it looks like it's out of stock on the Jays website. I really like the AKR02, but I can't recommend it at $1,400."

Heard horror stories of companies like AK being notorious for not getting back to people or charging them exorberant fee’s for repair, and it possible taking months to get back if I’m lucky. (LINK)

After 5 hours of charging the unit was still not powering up. Disappointment started to sit in. Contact Invixion support, who represent Astell & Kern here in the US. Told me to send the unit back to them and they will replace a new unit. Last week, received a notice email from Invixion telling me that they will not be replacing my unit but instead giving me a full refund. This was an absolute let down. One would think that with a well reputable company like Astell&Kern, their QAQC department would check every unit before they ship it out to their customer. I guessed not, given what I had experienced. I will NEVER look at a DAP from this company ever again. Over price, bad QAQC and a whole chain of bad service. (LINK)

Astell&Kern customer service is non-responsive. Not sure they have any customer service -- phone calls are not picked up, messages are not returned. I would not recommend Astell&Kern.

After 4 and half months, the plastic back cover came off, exposing the inside workings of the unit. The cover seems to have been glued on but maybe snapped on, but in either case it will not go back on. Astell&Kern customer service is non-responsive. Not sure they have any customer service -- phone calls are not picked up, messages are not returned. I would not recommend Astell&Kern.

https://www.crutchfield.com/S-8hPTPvi3Apl/p_838SR25II/Reviews/Astell-Kern-A-norma-SR25-MKII.html

Imagine selling top tier/priced devices with almost no customer support, no repairs without getting exorbitant fees (because what are you going to do? Paid 4000 for those iems and no one else can fix them? Well I would suggest using an American Express CC to get their 2y Added warranty and easy disputes if you need to get your money back (they are super good about this and have been sent all this evidence and the full email convo)

Crazy, isnt spending that much money supposed to come with a bit of a guarantee or hope that my product isnt 1 drop or accident away from being forced to either have 1 IEM, dispute with the cc holder, have nothing or pay full price

This unit is repairable, if it wasnt they wouldnt be so eager to send me a new one and take the one I send back (actually forced and they refuse to negotiate and consider any other offer besides "you can only get it replaced if we keep this unit"

Why even repair it if you can charge that much and get a unit with most of the internal drivers/wiring still in tact or salvageable (as they claimed they want to do for me above lol they say they want to salvage it and then tell me theres no repair only replacement -_- )

Never once has anyone asked me to return my product for no refund then keeps it while billing me MSRP and salvaging/repairing and reselling my "broken" unit. Lets be real they wont throw it in the trash. They will get some return and profit off of that even if 75% of the unit is in tact that would be 1350$ in electronics they can re-use and double dip their customers.

Ya enjoy getting taken for a ride and paying 5700$ for a 3400$ IEM if you drop/damage or have some type of accident.

I love me some $4000 one time use IEMS. Hope I dont damage, drop, run into issues or experience a driver failure. Even if its not your fault the "investigation" they conduct will never admit to being defective or their fault trust me.

Ive had 3 EE iems, Noble Audio, Craft ears and 64Audio and placed all of them on the same surface (same amount of force) and never had one crack. I believed there was a defect that caused this (thought I saw a bubble in the paint/resin) but lets say I am wrong and 100% at fault, doesnt make it any better tbh

No additional arrangement will be considered

This email will serve as a firm notification. No additional or special arrangement will be considered. -A&K support

Pics below. Tell me does it look like all those internal components in the 2nd pic are dead/irreparable/unable to be re-used?

So how does cracking the shell and scratching the 2pin connector amount to 1700-1800?

oh and its 1800 + my old unit and all of those expensive drivers I paid for so its not even "just" 1800 they asking for the most


Lesson learned, listen to Head-Fi and take my money elsewhere. Bought two IEMs around the same price point in the last 2 months Ive been waiting to get this case resolved/furthered/even a response tbh, Empire Ears cant even get one

GG next time ill just burn my money.

 

[Griffith]

While I can understand the frustration of damaging a very valuable IEM, I would be upset as well, this thread is a feeble attempt at coercion and I have no sympathy for people that do that.

 

[goodvibes]

Really starting to wonder if this product was ever worth the money honestly. 2 Months, still without my IEMs or a resolution. Bought the U18T from Audio64 and saw their policy


By that logic 3500/2 = 1700

1700/2 = 850

Well that makes sense rather then paying for it, waiting for months, being told its beyond repair (but many other vendors remold/re-shell/repair their products) then paying 1700 to repair it + 3700 (after tax) so total $5400 while agreeing to surrender the cracked unit (technically my property but hey, take it and re-use the internals and charge me full MSRP. At this point its either repaired for a lesser price (obviously covering labor/costs/postage but at least you dont need to replace every driver (EST, DD, WeaponX and BA).

that's crazy, dropped it, it split, I held it together and packaged it so it would remain in tact and the internal contents would not get damaged) the 2-pin scratches I can own up to. But damn I really should have listened when I read about A&Ks customer service on here and avoided this whole ordeal

The odyssey is similar to Odin at $3400. That AK did a promotional package that you took advantage of is not the issue here. What they did was break up a fresh pair to send you one channel. To get their pricing, they had a large run made to achieve economy of scale and ordering a single replacement now would cost them as much as odin to acquire. Of course they won't return the defective one. Replacement discounts, and you got one, always means losing the broken device so that it can't be misrepresented later. Had you sent both, it's possible they would have sent you a fresh pair for the same amount but it was going to be $1700 either way. Of course they have no interest in broken, recobbled devices on the market, tampering with their stellar reputation.