If you still love Etymotic ER4, this is the thread for you...
Aug 20, 2016 at 3:08 PM Post #9,166 of 19,246
 
   

 

Thanks very much for the reply, sorry for my grammar mistakes, English is not my mother language.
the peaks were shown in the official FR graphs too.
 
I play guitars, when I listening to ER4S, because the 6khz-10khz roll-off, the dynamic is compressed, timbre is losing power, music isn't involving,
from an instrument player's perspective, this sound is unrealistic. from a music lover's perspecive, the music is not fun, not moving me.
 
I think the ultimate goal of a transducer, is it  "sounds like a real thing", "reflected the recording" ,
not: "sounds like a hi-fi speaker" or "a compensation to the commercal recording".
the difference here is huge.
a flat response transducer without the peaks & roll offs will be well appreciated

 
Your reply was quite clear.  Please do not worry about your grammar.  You write very well, especially considering English isn't your mother language.
 
Just curious, are you live monitoring your guitar or listening to recordings of guitars?  If you are live monitoring your guitar, are you using a direct out or are you using some sort of cabinet simulator? (I also play guitar).  If you are primarily listening to non-mastered recordings of instruments, I can see why you might prefer an ER-4B response.  Especially, if the recordings are binaural, uncompressed recordings.  The first ER4 we ever released was the ER4B and is most accurate to the raw frequency response of the human ear.  The ER4S (and the adjusted target curve) came later in response to significant market pressure from our users who liked the ER4B but simply felt it was too bright.  The ER4P then came to pass because the sensitivity of the ER4S was too low for most portable users (back then portable media players and CD players had lower output levels).  At the time, we had to compromise on the high frequencies with the ER4P because we ultimately needed enough sensitivity that people could use them.
 
As far as tweaking the peaks and roll-offs, it's can be done acoustically if you have unlimited space in the earphone, but it's far more difficult to do in the small space of an ER4.  There are often trade-offs.  If we can find a way to get rid of the ultra-high frequency peaks without causing problems in the lower (and much more audible) frequencies, we will do that.  The ER4B in that graph does have more of a high frequency peak than I remember, so I'll have to revisit that.
 
In the end, the majority of our customers prefer the high frequency performance of the ER4S/SR/XR.  There is a customer base that does prefer the ER4B (sometimes very strongly prefer) so we make that earphone for them.  We appreciate all of our customers, no matter which version they prefer; we're just happy they chose something we made.  My hope is that there is enough demand for a new ER4B version that we can come out with that, too.


assuming the high frequency response could be smoothed a bit like the sr did from the s, an er4bxr sounds like it would be awesome...
 
Aug 20, 2016 at 3:26 PM Post #9,167 of 19,246
  Hmmm....I'm one of those rare ones who loves the ER4B 
wink.gif

 
And we absolutely appreciate it. 

I'm not make a qualitative judgement between the models, just commenting on which ones sell better than others.
 
Aug 20, 2016 at 3:39 PM Post #9,168 of 19,246
  any comments from users paring the FiiO X1 with ER4SR??
 
I'm currently using the X1 with UERM's but want something smaller and more pliable for a cycle touring trip!


works fine, no weird signature, no audible background hiss. the er4sr works fine on all the sources I've tried TBH.
 
Aug 20, 2016 at 4:02 PM Post #9,169 of 19,246
 
works fine, no weird signature, no audible background hiss. the er4sr works fine on all the sources I've tried TBH.

Thank you for the reply.
 
Aug 20, 2016 at 5:21 PM Post #9,170 of 19,246
Been looking for some IEMs in the price range of the ER4SR/XR, unsure whether i would like them. My current headphones are the HD650 and i love them, though i do wish the sound was slightly less muddled together. I was leaning towards ER4XR because i do love bass (but not at the detriment of the mids/highs) and the isolation seems fantastic. 
 
Are the ER4XR for me?
 
Aug 20, 2016 at 7:22 PM Post #9,171 of 19,246
Been looking for some IEMs in the price range of the ER4SR/XR, unsure whether i would like them. My current headphones are the HD650 and i love them, though i do wish the sound was slightly less muddled together. I was leaning towards ER4XR because i do love bass (but not at the detriment of the mids/highs) and the isolation seems fantastic. 

Are the ER4XR for me?

I believe while they are different in some regards, the xr is an excellent alternative to the hd650 and it sounds less muddled in the highs...
 
Aug 20, 2016 at 9:23 PM Post #9,172 of 19,246
I believe while they are different in some regards, the xr is an excellent alternative to the hd650 and it sounds less muddled in the highs...

Great. How are the mids? One of the things i loved most about the HD 650 was definitely the mids
 
Aug 21, 2016 at 3:45 AM Post #9,173 of 19,246
Hi, i'm interested in the 4XR earphones. I'm mostly listening to Jazz, Singer/Songwriter, Country, Classic and some Pop. Will the 4XR work with the Ipod Touche or do i need an extra DAC like Fiio E17? How deep can the subbase go? I like the AKG q701 with +2db more base. Are the XR an option for me?
 
THX
 
Aug 21, 2016 at 3:48 AM Post #9,174 of 19,246
  Hi, i'm interested in the 4XR earphones. I'm mostly listening to Jazz, Singer/Songwriter, Country, Classic and some Pop. Will the 4XR work with the Ipod Touche or do i need an extra DAC like Fiio E17? How deep can the subbase go? I like the AKG q701 with +2db more base. Are the XR an option for me?
 
THX


External DAC/AMP is always better, but ER4 series is one of the ones I know of that is less picky about DAC/AMP than others.
 
So yes you would find a benefit upgrading the sources too but you won't be at all let down even if you just use your phone or latptop.
 
Aug 21, 2016 at 5:14 AM Post #9,175 of 19,246
  Hi, i'm interested in the 4XR earphones. I'm mostly listening to Jazz, Singer/Songwriter, Country, Classic and some Pop. Will the 4XR work with the Ipod Touche or do i need an extra DAC like Fiio E17? How deep can the subbase go? I like the AKG q701 with +2db more base. Are the XR an option for me?
 
THX

 
The new ER-4 series work just fine unamped. I mean, they are 45ohm, so unless louder is better for you I don't believe there is a substantial upgrade in SQ by using an amplifier. 
 
About the DAC, why not, although the iPod's dac already delivers a pretty flat/uncolored sound (I know it's infamous to say that on here).
 
Aug 21, 2016 at 5:45 AM Post #9,176 of 19,246
   
Your reply was quite clear.  Please do not worry about your grammar.  You write very well, especially considering English isn't your mother language.
 
Just curious, are you live monitoring your guitar or listening to recordings of guitars?  If you are live monitoring your guitar, are you using a direct out or are you using some sort of cabinet simulator? (I also play guitar).  If you are primarily listening to non-mastered recordings of instruments, I can see why you might prefer an ER-4B response.  Especially, if the recordings are binaural, uncompressed recordings.  The first ER4 we ever released was the ER4B and is most accurate to the raw frequency response of the human ear.  The ER4S (and the adjusted target curve) came later in response to significant market pressure from our users who liked the ER4B but simply felt it was too bright.  The ER4P then came to pass because the sensitivity of the ER4S was too low for most portable users (back then portable media players and CD players had lower output levels).  At the time, we had to compromise on the high frequencies with the ER4P because we ultimately needed enough sensitivity that people could use them.
 
As far as tweaking the peaks and roll-offs, it's can be done acoustically if you have unlimited space in the earphone, but it's far more difficult to do in the small space of an ER4.  There are often trade-offs.  If we can find a way to get rid of the ultra-high frequency peaks without causing problems in the lower (and much more audible) frequencies, we will do that.  The ER4B in that graph does have more of a high frequency peak than I remember, so I'll have to revisit that.
 
In the end, the majority of our customers prefer the high frequency performance of the ER4S/SR/XR.  There is a customer base that does prefer the ER4B (sometimes very strongly prefer) so we make that earphone for them.  We appreciate all of our customers, no matter which version they prefer; we're just happy they chose something we made.  My hope is that there is enough demand for a new ER4B version that we can come out with that, too.

 
 
 
I did a listening test on ER4B, using some sine waves,
to my ears, the 3khz & 14-16khz  regions are significantly louder than other frequency too.
Because these peaks, cymbals sound too forward, timbre is too bright & thin.
With some EQs fixes ,the ER4B sounds like a live performance!
 
Mixing engineers will use both headphones & speakers to monitor their tracks.
and most headphones on the market don't have the 6-10khz roll-off.
so the 6khz-10khz is really not the issue....  If I'm not mistaken, it's the limitations of the​ transducers (as you mentioned)
 
I am very happy with the ER4SR purchase, it's not perfect, but it's the best I've heard. (I've heard many headphones, speakers, electrostatics)
thank for the reply
 
Aug 21, 2016 at 6:36 AM Post #9,178 of 19,246
Just received ER4 SR, open the box and tried to pair with iPhone 6S use 3 flange transparent tips.
Player ;FLAC Player+, file Flac.
 
I know need burned in  to reach the "real sound", but direct from the box ER4SR sound is promising at volume level 60-80%.
Initially I skeptic about bass area from SR series, but SR delivered very good and well defined bass.
Mid and high are perfect
 
So far, I'm happy....I will update my impression later.
 
~ron~
 
Aug 21, 2016 at 6:59 AM Post #9,179 of 19,246
   
My hope is that there is enough demand for a new ER4B version that we can come out with that, too.

 
Oh you...lol.... you know why there aren't many people buying ER4B?......
It's because your website is telling people, "The ER4B has a diffuse field curve, it's for binaural recording"
 
 
But we know that, most(>90%) headphones have a diffuse field curve,
included studio monitor headphones: K240DF, HD540, HD800, R10, K1000 , all electrostatic headphones, and many.
Please stop saying binaural this binaural that, fix the peaks, and many people will buy them.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top