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Originally Posted by JaZZ /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Yeah, sure. I see you questioning if I know what clipping sound like. Do you know how it sounds like?
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Yes, very much so. I used to power some very inductive speakers with a home theater receiver starting out. Won't ever make that mistake again - it sounded like some frequencies had the life sucked out of them among other things.
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| If you look back you may notice that I have explicitly excluded portable amps, because they'e special cases (due to limited voltage, thus limited output power at high impedances). |
No you didn't actually::
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Originally Posted by Jazz
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Originally Posted by Shike
Probably. If I had a set of HD650s and tried them with a portable Headroom amp than no, it probably wouldn't sound the same (almost guaranteed clipping just considering design limitations)
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You're assuming something? And I disagree: I think as long as you avoid exessive volume levels, the amp with battery drive will sound about the same as with external power supply.
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So you just argued a battery amp would drive just as well as one with an external supply (which is a misnomer since not all desktops have external, but nonetheless).
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| Why don't you consider them a rip-off? I think you should. If their chapest desktop amp measures and sounds the same as their flagship (which you consider likely yourself), where's the justification for the higher-priced amps? Even the lower models offer crossfeed. |
Which ones are you saying I should think are a rip-off? They're generally sometimes a bit more or a bit less than others, but tend to be in-line with the market (which is unfortunate that the market has gotten in such a shape, but I digress).
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| No, not at all. With well-made amps clipping has no meaning in practice. I wonder how you come to this conclusion. From own experience with your amps? |
Okay, let's question the terminology of a well made amp. Many would argue the Grado RA1 is "well made" in terms of build quality. Yet in reality it's a desktop amp with a portable core stuck in it. It would clip easily given a demanding pair of cans, yet has a cost of $400 or so and is a "desktop" amp.
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| And I guess you haven't heard complaints about clipping, but it's still not safe. |
Actually I have on certain amp - albeit portable. Still, the RA1 shows for example why it isn't safe to assume.
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| That's accepted. But you keep on beating a dead horse with your clipping theory, which is so far from reality. |
See above.
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| I wonder what this amp excursion is worth for if we keep on debating about HeadRoom amps and their hypothetical measuring and sonic differences without realizing the clue of the matter: harmonic distortion in solid-state amps is very low, and other measuring criteria such as frequency response are also close to perfection. So perfect that according to conservative standards the differences between them are inaudible. That makes them sort of comparable to cables. As you would say yourself: well-made cables and well-made amps all sound the same. (Well, that's not exactly my own attitude.) |
I'm just not going to assume an amp is capable because it should be, because unfortunately that sort of mentality just leads to getting burned. I'd say there's tons of headphone amps that measure practically identical, and if tested properly would sound the same. I sure as heck though wouldn't make such a claim for an RA1 and say an M^3 with a pair of HD800 cans.
Given, if both amps are close enough there shouldn't be a difference. That means they have roughly the same measurements including ability to drive certain loads, etc. When one is severely deficient in comparison to one it's being compared against it will sound different - and by deficient I mean measurable issues obviously.
Yeah: low batteries and high listening levels can make a battery-driven HeadRoom amp clip.
