HiFiMan Susvara
Mar 5, 2022 at 12:52 PM Post #14,731 of 26,732
Kind of a weird analogy exacerbated by the fact of not every perceived sonic difference can be measured (at least not yet): try to measure PrAT 😂 So big engine vs acceleration doesn’t really make sense for me.

If you must use engine as an analogy I would say using a speaker amp to drive something that requires a few mw nominal power is like strapping a 5.6L V8 to a motorcycle (assuming hypothetically possible) Yes you will have limitless acceleration and power reserve but wouldn’t a properly designed motorcycle engine be a better solution?

:scream:
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 12:57 PM Post #14,732 of 26,732
You do not know what you are talking about Hegel is a Norwegian HIFI company that makes quality amplifiers.
Open one up and you will see.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:10 PM Post #14,733 of 26,732
How does it sound? Any concerns around speaker tap connection?
I'm using lqi adapter.
Sounds very, VERY clean. You know that sound you get when an amplifier has a low distortion? That real clean sound? Everything still has beautiful warmth and lightning fast speed. Very detailed. No complaints. Definitely has more oomph then the Luxman did, even at lower volumes.
This is my third Hegel over the years but first using the binding posts for headphones.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:12 PM Post #14,734 of 26,732
Everything is getting balanced power from The Core Power Technologies 1200. Very low nose floor. Minute, subtle detail way off in the background comes through so clearly.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:12 PM Post #14,735 of 26,732
I am arguing for using a properly designed amp without current limitation (within reason so no need to double down to drive 2ohm) for driving headphones.

For one, speaker amps tend to have higher dc offset than properly designed headphone amp. A few mv may be no big deal for speakers but it’s a big deal for headphones. Putting aside potential stress on thin diaphragm even a few mv may restrict dynamics.

So the DC offset presents an advantage for a harder to drive load like susvara?
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:13 PM Post #14,736 of 26,732
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:19 PM Post #14,737 of 26,732
So the DC offset presents an advantage for a harder to drive load like susvara?
You are joking right? Dc offset can result in reduced dynamic range, shortened driver life and in the worst case destroy your cans over short to medium time.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:20 PM Post #14,738 of 26,732
But that still means that Susvara is benefiting from a more powerful PSU. Bigger psu tends to be more powerful... more wattage potentially more current. Not ONLY 'better quality circuit' as Loquan says.
I am not an electrical engineer, but I wonder if the simple formulas for power and dB levels apply to complex waveforms like music. It also seems that there are a lot of unknowns in the data like sensitivity (what frequency, is dB unweighted or is it dBA). Since our ear is less sensitive at frequency below 1000 Hz, is the perceived volume less than what it would seem from the numbers.
I tried the Susvara with my Tor balanced tube amp, which puts out 450mW (not sure how that is measured ) and when I turn the volume to full, it plays at a decently loud level and does not seem anemic in the least. On My solid state amp which puts out 10W I have the volume at 40% maximum to get the same volume level. How much are the amplifiers delivering with these volume settings? I have no idea.
I suspect that there are a lot more variables and unknowns that make it hard to boil down to a simple formula.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:36 PM Post #14,739 of 26,732
You are joking right? Dc offset can result in reduced dynamic range, shortened driver life and in the worst case destroy your cans over short to medium time.
For real, if you ask this question do not drive your headphones with a speaker amp.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 1:42 PM Post #14,740 of 26,732
This is the H120.

There are many people who drive and have driven their Susvara and HE-6 off of a speaker amplifier. This is nothing new.
 

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Mar 5, 2022 at 2:28 PM Post #14,741 of 26,732
This is the H120.

There are many people who drive and have driven their Susvara and HE-6 off of a speaker amplifier. This is nothing new.
To be completely honest, I would not buy this level of build quality from a DIYer let alone an actual amp manufacturer. You should measure the dc offset for real, these integrated all have very high gain compared to the power amplifiers, and high gain makes dc offset worse. It's more for safety than anything else.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 2:38 PM Post #14,742 of 26,732
To be completely honest, I would not buy this level of build quality from a DIYer let alone an actual amp manufacturer. You should measure the dc offset for real, these integrated all have very high gain compared to the power amplifiers, and high gain makes dc offset worse. It's more for safety than anything else.
Gotcha.
 
Mar 5, 2022 at 2:49 PM Post #14,743 of 26,732
General rule of thumb is 10mv or less is considered safe for dynamics with voice coil - I would imagine nano meter level diaphragm may dictate a lower safety threshold. However, many would consider 5mv or less to be safe and less than 1mv for ideal headphone performance. Given dc offset may drift if there is no active dc offset compensation circuit, you should measure it during a period of 30min-1hr.

Forgot to add, if your dc offset is 0, that means you have a capacitor at the output and that's just bad circuit design.
 
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Mar 5, 2022 at 3:02 PM Post #14,744 of 26,732
General rule of thumb is 10mv or less is considered safe for dynamics with voice coil - I would imagine nano meter level diaphragm may dictate a lower safety threshold. However, many would consider 5mv or less to be safe and less than 1mv for ideal headphone performance. Given dc offset may drift if there is no active dc offset compensation circuit, you should measure it during a period of 30min-1hr.

Forgot to add, if your dc offset is 0, that means you have a capacitor at the output and that's just bad circuit design.
Bad circuit design... But safe?
 

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