[chawya22]

Please let me know what they say.

I thought the deal was: HM-650 = HM-802 minus casework quality, scroll wheel, USB DAC capability.

Nowhere does it say that it also excludes any form of ongoing support....

Lack of gapless is not the only FW issue (random clicks and pops, the occasional BANG between tracks, laggy key responses and a heroically slow boot-up time also feature).

 
 

I did find it strange when you posted their reply above:
"This one is noted bug to us, that is under the same artist if you search albums, and albums are more than 3, it tends to crash and reboot. We will improve on this aspect for future design."

It seems they agree a bug has been found, but no support will be given.
As you said, I hope most of this is just lost in translation!

Aren't they a sponsor over here? Shouldn't they, as a sponsor, pay attention and participate?

The CSR in China is incredibly prompt in replying. Give credit where credit is due. Anyway, here is the reply:
 
"I do not mean it, we will improve our firmware continuously, just at present we do not have any plan for the update of HM650 firmware.
 
If you are interested, please try our HM901S which will be available in MAY, please pay attention to our website."
 
Well at least the HM-650 isn't dead but that still doesn't tell us when the existing bugs and missing features will be corrected. I find it amusing that the CSR would end his reply with a commercial for the new HM-901S which will probably cost at least 2 or 3 times the price of the HM-650. Given my experience with the 650, how could the CSR possibly think I would want to spend even more money for another HiFiMAN DAP?
 
HiFiMAN does have a Head-Direct / HIFIMAN Customer Service TEAM thread but I think it's in the US, not China and I don't know if they monitor any other threads. Head-Direct did replace 2 HM-650's for me but recommended I direct my tech questions to China: customerservice@hifiman.com.

 

[miguelpp]

I heard that one over a month ago:

"We will do our best to recover the bugs. Maybe you could try our HM901S, please wait for a while, it will be released some time later, not sure yet."

For me, I guess this is the end on what hifiman is concerned. I guess Facebook might be the preferred place to talk about this, so that possible future owners make better decisions than us

 

[dbatti]

Hi!
 
I have the oppurtunity to purchase an HM650 at a relatively good price (~430 USD).
My question is about the balanced output, I'm confused. Is it capable of balanced line out (passing by the standard single ended amplifier card)?
It would be a nice option to hook it on a balanced input of a HiFi-Amp at home. If it does that, I'll definitely buy it. If not... well, I'm still hesitating.
(It would be an upgrade to an iAudio X5L + Focal Spirit Classic combo, and I also could use my old Sennhesier HD250 Linear II-s on the streets and at work)
 
...Or anyway, is it even possible to use it via line out, without any amplifier cards?

 

[chawya22]

  Hi!
 
I have the oppurtunity to purchase an HM650 at a relatively good price (~430 USD).
My question is about the balanced output, I'm confused. Is it capable of balanced line out (passing by the standard single ended amplifier card)?
It would be a nice option to hook it on a balanced input of a HiFi-Amp at home. If it does that, I'll definitely buy it. If not... well, I'm still hesitating.
(It would be an upgrade to an iAudio X5L + Focal Spirit Classic combo, and I also could use my old Sennhesier HD250 Linear II-s on the streets and at work)
 
...Or anyway, is it even possible to use it via line out, without any amplifier cards?

I had a similar question before I purchased mine. The short answer is that the HM-650 does not have a balanced output unless you have a balanced card. It is compatible with the RE-600 balanced TRRS plug but still not technically balanced. Also TRRS plugs can be wired differently so there is no universal standard. I hope that helps. BTW, I hope you read thru the thread as their are a number of compromises to be considered when you buy a HM-650.

 

[dbatti]

First of all thank you for the answer on the balanced output topic!
I've read some of the thread, but I couldn't find an answer to this with a search... or I might have typed the wrong words. And yes, I've also read about its flaws, that's why i'm not sure about buying it. I'll continue reading the thread.

 

[miguelpp]

Do you feel confident enough to buy this DAP after you read that their CSR recommends buying a new player when you report issues for the one you own?  

 

[chawya22]

  Do you feel confident enough to buy this DAP after you read that their CSR recommends buying a new player when you report issues for the one you own?  

Absolutely not! I already have buyers remorse at $450.00, I would be suicidal at $1000.00 or more. 

 

 

[CJG888]

Once again, I am wondering about using the DX50 in my portable system again, this time as a digital transport, feeding an iBasso DB2 DAC, this in turn feeding either a P4 or my trusty Tube Amp BL-2. This should yield a similar SQ to the HM-650 (or better), only with gapless....

The DX50 is a fantastic transport for my desktop system (Audio-gd NFB-1P and SA-31SE).

This will save me buying yet another DAP.

 

[mrmoto050]

Well, I was considering this DAP, but after going through the whole thread I will save my money. It's too bad because I really like the SQ of the Dual Wolfsons. Soory to read about all of your issues.

 

[dbatti]

Well, now I've ended reading the thread from the beginning, and I'm still not sure...
I mean, with this pricetag, it clearly beats its competitors in SounQuality and amplifier section.
I've only heard Astell&Kern AK100 I; iBasso DX90; and for a brief moment even an AK240. The last one isn't rational for me, way out of budget. Compared to the iAudio X5L, I found that the AK100 does everything a bit better, but I won't give out that much for a little improvement.
As I remember, I did not like the DX90-s character, I found it more harsh and uneven, thus disturbing for longterm listenings. I really like the Astell&Kern sound signature, but their DAPs are being sold in a much higher pricerange.
So here I am. Are these software bugs really that annoying? I'm not very picky, just want to listen to my music in shuffle/ normal mode. I don't even do searches most of the time
 
The missing gapeless playback option, and random cracking noises do not sound very good, and what drives me mad, that there is no carrying case included... XD
Seriously, I hate when I must buy immediately some other stuff in order to use a product as it is intended to. (like a USB printer without a USB (A-B) cable.. very useful - been there, done that)

 

[chawya22]

  Well, now I've ended reading the thread from the beginning, and I'm still not sure...
I mean, with this pricetag, it clearly beats its competitors in SounQuality and amplifier section.
I've only heard Astell&Kern AK100 I; iBasso DX90; and for a brief moment even an AK240. The last one isn't rational for me, way out of budget. Compared to the iAudio X5L, I found that the AK100 does everything a bit better, but I won't give out that much for a little improvement.
As I remember, I did not like the DX90-s character, I found it more harsh and uneven, thus disturbing for longterm listenings. I really like the Astell&Kern sound signature, but their DAPs are being sold in a much higher pricerange.
So here I am. Are these software bugs really that annoying? I'm not very picky, just want to listen to my music in shuffle/ normal mode. I don't even do searches most of the time
 
The missing gapeless playback option, and random cracking noises do not sound very good, and what drives me mad, that there is no carrying case included... XD
Seriously, I hate when I must buy immediately some other stuff in order to use a product as it is intended to. (like a USB printer without a USB (A-B) cable.. very useful - been there, done that)

I own the AK240 and the DX90. The AK240, when compared to the DX90 and the HM-650, is in a whole other league. I can't justify the price but when you try to compare it to the other two, there is no comparison. It's a total package. UI, sound, ease of use, etc. IMO, the DX90 is definitely miles beyond the HM-650, not so much in sound, but in UI execution. It does gapless, makes no unexpected noises and has never crashed on me. Sound quality is totally subjective but iBasso does recommend a burn-in period and supplies a cable specifically for that purpose.. The HM-650 definitely has it's own sound signature and that's why it's not on eBay right now. If only they could get rid of all the warts, it would be a strong contender. As for a case for the HM-650 here is one that is listed on eBay. I don't own one but if I decide to keep my HM-650, I may pull the trigger. Good Luck!    

 

[CJG888]

I have this case, and can heartily recommend it!

I'm not sure if I will sell my HM-650. The UI sucks like an Electrolux, and I really miss gapless. However, this morning on the flight from SH to BJ, I found myself listening to a HDTT 192/24 transfer of Tchaikovsky's Manfred Symphony with the VPO (Minibox card into T51p). The SQ was very, very good. Desktop rig good.

I'll probably keep it after all, and get a DB2 for the DX50...

 

[dbatti]

 
I own the AK240 and the DX90. The AK240, when compared to the DX90 and the HM-650, is in a whole other league. I can't justify the price but when you try to compare it to the other two, there is no comparison. It's a total package. UI, sound, ease of use, etc. IMO, the DX90 is definitely miles beyond the HM-650, not so much in sound, but in UI execution. It does gapless, makes no unexpected noises and has never crashed on me. Sound quality is totally subjective but iBasso does recommend a burn-in period and supplies a cable specifically for that purpose.. The HM-650 definitely has it's own sound signature and that's why it's not on eBay right now. If only they could get rid of all the warts, it would be a strong contender. As for a case for the HM-650 here is one that is listed on eBay. I don't own one but if I decide to keep my HM-650, I may pull the trigger. Good Luck!    

 
It was nice to finally read some positive comments too, like "it's not on e-Bay right now", or "I'm not sure if I will sell my HM-650"
How relieving is that. D
 
About the Ak240, what I really wanted to say is that I don't have that amount of money, I should have written "it's not really an option for me".
But now I'm curious, why did you buy the HM650-s, despite having already the best(?) DAP on Earth?
 
The case would be nice, if it had the option of using it on a belt. I always carry my DAPs in belt cases.

 

[chawya22]

   
It was nice to finally read some positive comments too, like "it's not on e-Bay right now", or "I'm not sure if I will sell my HM-650"
How relieving is that. D
 
About the Ak240, what I really wanted to say is that I don't have that amount of money, I should have written "it's not really an option for me".
But now I'm curious, why did you buy the HM650-s, despite having already the best(?) DAP on Earth?
 
The case would be nice, if it had the option of using it on a belt. I always carry my DAPs in belt cases.

Well I could tell you a partial truth and say I wanted a back-up for my year old AK-240, just in case I have to send it in for repair or battery replacement. I also wanted a taste of the HiFiMAN sound. But really, like most hobbies, excess is the norm. I wonder what ______ might sound like? It can sneak up on you.

 

[fkeufss]

does it have digital output？