[jsplice]

The loaner pair only came with the pleather pads, which is a bit disappointing, as I've read that the velour pads sound better.  But man I need to unhook this Cardas Clear, because if I have any hope of being able to even afford a pair of HE-6 when the loaner period is up, I will certainly not be able to afford a $700 cable on top of the $1300 HE-6.

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

The loaner pair only came with the pleather pads, which is a bit disappointing, as I've read that the velour pads sound better.  But man I need to unhook this Cardas Clear, because if I have any hope of being able to even afford a pair of HE-6 when the loaner period is up, I will certainly not be able to afford a $700 cable on top of the $1300 HE-6.

The pleathers are a mistake.  I really don't know why HFM even makes them.  I've seen a small handful of people that prefer them for one reason or another, but as far as I can tell, they're universally hated by most across the entire HFM headphone line.  The "sucked out mids effect" is awful, unless you really like that kind of sound (but if you really like that kind of sound, HFM headphones probably are the wrong direction!.)
 
I don't think selling pleather pads is a mistake, but I think selling those pleather pads, as designed is a mistake.   They need to make them thicker and take them back to the drawing board a bit.  Knowing HFM, they'll do so within a year.  But those are just awful as-is.  The velours are barely thick enough (too thin for me, IMO, but that quarter-foam on the HE-6 makes them fully workable unlike on the HE-400.)
 
In terms of comfort, the pleathers, to me, under the relatively heavy weight of planars they tend to stick to the skin and then PULL at the skin.  The velours don't.  I'm not a fan of any of the HFM pads, but the pleathers are just awful for comfort.  Still, there are a few people that prefer them.
 
Cardas....I'm not anti-cable, in fact I have upgraded cables on most of my headphones (Blue Dragon on HE-400, Silver Dragon on HD650 (formerly a Cardas Gray), and an incoming Q for my HE-6), so I probably don't have room to talk, but $700 is just absurd for a cable.  George must be sitting near open paint cans for too many hours or something...

 

[drez]

I wouldn't mind $700 if it was hand made and required a lot of time and skill to make, but its just machine produced cables that don't even look great

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

I wouldn't mind $700 if it was hand made and required a lot of time and skill to make, but its just machine produced cables that don't even look great

And the handmade ones that require a lot of time and skill to make cost a third or less

 

[jsplice]

Actually, I looked, and it's closer to lower $600s for 1 meter, Hifiman connectors and 1/4" plug.  Still too expensive for the improvement it provides.
 
Now I really wish I had the velour because it feels like I'm not getting a true evaluation of the HE-500s and HE-6s.  I might send an email to my audio guy and see if he has any to ship out to me.

 

[elwappo99]

Quote:

Actually, I looked, and it's closer to lower $600s for 1 meter, Hifiman connectors and 1/4" plug.  Still too expensive for the improvement it provides.
 
Now I really wish I had the velour because it feels like I'm not getting a true evaluation of the HE-500s and HE-6s.  I might send an email to my audio guy and see if he has any to ship out to me.

 
That's very expensive for that cable. I think you could get a good quality cable for far less than that. 

 

[jsplice]

Yes it is, and I'm sure you're right.  I'd consider one from Moon Audio first, as they are priced very reasonably.
 
So the consensus for the HE-6 is that they really need a speaker amp, but even with my Lyr, I can hear the benefits of the HE-6 over the HE-500.  Not sure with this amp that it's a $500 increase in sound quality, unless you drive it with a speaker amp.  I'm trying to familiarize myself with the ortho sound, because this is my first extended experience with them.  The presentation is definitely different and takes some time to get to know it.

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

Actually, I looked, and it's closer to lower $600s for 1 meter, Hifiman connectors and 1/4" plug.  Still too expensive for the improvement it provides.
 
Now I really wish I had the velour because it feels like I'm not getting a true evaluation of the HE-500s and HE-6s.  I might send an email to my audio guy and see if he has any to ship out to me.

$600+ for 1 meter

  What the heck can anyone do with ~3ft of cable?  The HE-6 is too heavy to strap the amp to your head too! At 16lbs my integrated would be a bit heavy on the head even without HE-6, and with the HE-6 even the Lyr might be a bit much without shoulder straps.  That cable would look like a big Y-split with a 1/4" pigtail coming out the back

  There's lots of nice cables out there, nearly all of them costing a third or less of that.  I thought ALO was a rip-off until I saw the Cardas Clear pricing.  Ouch. The stock cable is nice enough, for free, with the headphones and you get three whole meters of cable!  It sells for $150 on its own as an upgrade for other HFM cans.  Beyond that there's plenty of stuff from Moon, Q, Toxic, DH, and virtually whoever else you can think of, believe it or not, including ALO for way less money than that!

  Also if getting a custom cable for it, I'd really suggest sticking with an XLR-terminator rather than 1/4 so you can get the 1/4 adapter like how the stock cable is, but also keep your cable and use it with a banana/spade split if you decide to go the speaker amp route later.  It's a good setup.  Balanced, 1/4" and speaker taps all with one main cable. 
 
Those pads are way more important than the cable.  Definitely see if you can get the velours.  If you can't, if you happen to have any compatible pads sitting around from Beyer or the like floating around, they'll work too.  I haven't tried my leather/pleather options on the HE-6 yet, but from HE-400 experience, it's a huge difference. I can see how some may like the leather/pleather sound, but IMO that's just not the sound any of the HFM cans are about. I suspect for demos they're sending the pleathers because they're easy to sterilize on return, and used velours can get pretty yucky pretty fast.  But it's just not a good display of the tonal balance
 
At least it's less icky than used chin cushions on violin demos....eew.

 

[elwappo99]

Quote:

Yes it is, and I'm sure you're right.  I'd consider one from Moon Audio first, as they are priced very reasonably.
 
So the consensus for the HE-6 is that they really need a speaker amp, but even with my Lyr, I can hear the benefits of the HE-6 over the HE-500.  Not sure with this amp that it's a $500 increase in sound quality, unless you drive it with a speaker amp.  I'm trying to familiarize myself with the ortho sound, because this is my first extended experience with them.  The presentation is definitely different and takes some time to get to know it.

 
A new upcomer is BTG audio. You could get a decked out cable for under $150. Moon audio is also decent. There's a lot of options. As for amps, this is a whole different story. Speaker amps really bring out the quality and open sound of the HE-6 IMHO. I tried a lot of speaker amps in the sub $800 range (vintage, modern, monos), and the best bang I found was with the emotiva A-100 mini. Many people at the meet over the weekend agreed when they heard it as well. 
 
Also, I agree with the sentiments below. You really want a cable that terminates into a 4 pin XLR. From there you can have an adapter that will go to 1/4" and another one for speaker taps. Very versatile. 
 
 
 
Quote:

$600+ for 1 meter

  What the heck can anyone do with ~3ft of cable?  The HE-6 is too heavy to strap the amp to your head too! At 16lbs my integrated would be a bit heavy on the head even without HE-6, and with the HE-6 even the Lyr might be a bit much without shoulder straps.  That cable would look like a big Y-split with a 1/4" pigtail coming out the back

  There's lots of nice cables out there, nearly all of them costing a third or less of that.  I thought ALO was a rip-off until I saw the Cardas Clear pricing.  Ouch. The stock cable is nice enough, for free, with the headphones and you get three whole meters of cable!  It sells for $150 on its own as an upgrade for other HFM cans.  Beyond that there's plenty of stuff from Moon, Q, Toxic, DH, and virtually whoever else you can think of, believe it or not, including ALO for way less money than that!

  Also if getting a custom cable for it, I'd really suggest sticking with an XLR-terminator rather than 1/4 so you can get the 1/4 adapter like how the stock cable is, but also keep your cable and use it with a banana/spade split if you decide to go the speaker amp route later.  It's a good setup.  Balanced, 1/4" and speaker taps all with one main cable. 
 
Those pads are way more important than the cable.  Definitely see if you can get the velours.  If you can't, if you happen to have any compatible pads sitting around from Beyer or the like floating around, they'll work too.  I haven't tried my leather/pleather options on the HE-6 yet, but from HE-400 experience, it's a huge difference. I can see how some may like the leather/pleather sound, but IMO that's just not the sound any of the HFM cans are about. I suspect for demos they're sending the pleathers because they're easy to sterilize on return, and used velours can get pretty yucky pretty fast.  But it's just not a good display of the tonal balance
 
At least it's less icky than used chin cushions on violin demos....eew.

 
I thought they were kidding about your page long posts 

  I should take advantage of this. I just heard the HE-400 over the weekend for the first time and was floored at their quality. I didn't have time to side by side them with the HE-6. Any comments on the differences?

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

Yes it is, and I'm sure you're right.  I'd consider one from Moon Audio first, as they are priced very reasonably.
 
So the consensus for the HE-6 is that they really need a speaker amp, but even with my Lyr, I can hear the benefits of the HE-6 over the HE-500.  Not sure with this amp that it's a $500 increase in sound quality, unless you drive it with a speaker amp.  I'm trying to familiarize myself with the ortho sound, because this is my first extended experience with them.  The presentation is definitely different and takes some time to get to know it.

 
Keep in mind that speaker taps on a cable are relatively more expensive from any vendor (assuming you're getting bananas and not bare wire.) It's a 4-plug termination after all.
 
I was kind of shocked at how well Lyr holds its own with HE-6.  Yeah, the speaker amp resolves more detail, but Lyr didn't sound like it was straining, even for bass response it remained solid, at least if being fed a strong input signal.  It just isn't as resolving as something bigger & better can deliver.  I'd heard all the nay-sayers, but it's really quite good.  Where the nay-sayers are right, though is that HE-6 is a unique proposition in which it can take advantage of some really nice speaker gear that can be had relatively cheaply.  It's not purely about power so much as finesse, and a speaker amp with finesse can be had more cheaply than a headphone amp with that kind of finesse. That, and there's little point in buying a top tier can if you're not going to utilize it's abilities to the fullest.
 
If I were planning to drive them ONLY with Lyr, I'd say there's little point to HE-6 when you can get HE-500/HE-400 for a lot less and it works so well with that amp.  But to have Lyr as a stopgap before deciding/budgeting what big amp one would go with, it'll do, IMO,  the HE-6 enough justice to still enjoy them over HE-400/500 before letting them loose on something bigger; or to have Lyr among various options to sometimes play with tubes when your main HE-6 amp is SS, it's a good amp for it. The classic "He-6 sounds thin and bright and bassless" doesn't apply to Lyr, so it's not really underpowering at all IMO, it's just that it's not as fast and nuianced as HE-6 can take advantage of.  I tested them only on my Tungsram tubes, but I'm curious how the very warm Matsus would sound.
 
I ordered an XLR->1/4" adapter with my Q cable so I can play on Lyr periodically and try out my various tubes with HE-6. 

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

I thought they were kidding about your page long posts 

  I should take advantage of this. I just heard the HE-400 over the weekend for the first time and was floored at their quality. I didn't have time to side by side them with the HE-6. Any comments on the differences?

 
LOL, this is nothing...you should see some other threads

  I've joked that by word-count instead of post-count I'm probably well past "headphonius supremus" and well into "contributor"

 
You can find some physical and sonic comparisons to HE-400 in my day-1 impressions: http://www.head-fi.org/t/493214/hifiman-he-6-planar-magnetic-headphone/5820
 
More specifically (and with a little more experience) I'd say they're voiced very differently but share a lot of performance.   HE-400 is darned good for the money,..and can be powered well by anything half decent.  They really sing on something like Lyr.  In terms of the voicing, HE-6 is very neutral, studio flat, easy to EQ, but with very wide treble extension.   HE-400 is definitively darker, with an ever so slightly exaggerated bass presence, but not enough to make it "bassy." It doesn't extend as far into the treble as HE-6, but has a rather unusual peaky treble range that maintains the dark signature but keeps it sparkly enough to remain exciting instead of sounding laid back.  They're definitely different enough to no be redundant owning both.
 
In terms of performance, HE-6 has more detail, by far, much bigger soundstage (though equally unfocused to center thanks to the pads and lack of driver angle), a lot more "air" in the treble, and the bass is a bit tighter (and more textured but that goes along with "more detail".)  It also has a blacker background thanks to lower distortion, though the HE-400 distortion is overstated IMO, I wouldn't notice it were I not comparing them side by side.  Un-EQ'd HE-400 is more "fun", HE-6 is more "accurate".  But of course HE-6 can be EQ'd very easily to any signature, and HE-400 isn't a slouch at that either, but obviously you don't get as much flexibility in EQ'ing bass upward thanks to the smaller diaphragm, and you have to be careful how high you tweak the upper mids & low treble with those spikes.
 
It would be very easy to be happy with a Lyr and an HE-400.  Adding HE-6 was sort of a "because I can" type of over-the-top indulgence for me.  Technically speaking in terms of "lifelike presentation" HE-400 + Lyr + some natural sounding tubes is much more like sitting for a real live performance than HE-6 and other top-tier cans which tend to present much more detail than real seating would provide unless you're sitting at stage level. So when I want it to be "just like being there" HE-400 is the winner.  When I want "better than life as though I'm sitting with the musicians" HE-6 gets to play

 

[sridhar3]

We need to get a Mod/Admin to give IEMCrazy custom title of "Longwindeus Supremus".

 

[sphinxvc]

I have already tried I think.  Lol.  Or did I end up not sending that PM?  Can't remember.  If you need me to sign a petition, I'm up for it.

 

[jsplice]

I wonder if my DT770 pads would work.  I think the diameter on them is too small.

 

[IEMCrazy]

Quote:

We need to get a Mod/Admin to give IEMCrazy custom title of "Longwindeus Supremus".

Quote:

I have already tried I think.  Lol.  Or did I end up not sending that PM?  Can't remember.  If you need me to sign a petition, I'm up for it.

 
LOL, both of you

 
 
Quote:

I wonder if my DT770 pads would work.  I think the diameter on them is too small.

 
I think I remember seeing that DT770/880/990 pads would fit just fine, assuming you can get them over the plastic ring (once removed from the pleather pad.)  I'd certainly check around with anyone trying it in the following thread before pulling the rings out of your demo pads (yes, the rings DO go back in, it's not irreversible...)
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/572327/mission-replace-the-hifiman-ear-pads-with-other-brand-ear-pads/75
 
Velour pads are $10, you'd think the shop would have sent you a pair if they wanted to convince you to buy their $1300 headphone