[jesse_w]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Hi boodi, I'm curious in the sound of the HD580, they goes for about 100 eur, if it's, say, 85% of HD600, it's a real bargain for sure.

99% of the same sound. Same drivers, only differences are (possible) driver matching, the grills, and the housing is not quite as sturdy. With the HD600 you're paying for a more expensive feel, not a different sound.

jesse

 

[Glod]

Thanks Andrew for taking the time to offer us your story about the "two brothers". I found it to be one of the clearest written impressions on the two and I enjoyed the way you write. Unfortunately, I have not had the pleasure listening to the HD600. I am sure now I would like to.

Your impressions, however, also made me more confident that the HD650 is what I am looking for in a headphone. It has been said many times before, but I feel for saying it yet again: The HD650 was made for reproducing voices and perhaps classical ones in particular. It is also very well suited for chamber music and small ensemble music in general. It is also very good with symphonic music IMO, but then the quality of the source and amplifier are really critical.

There has been a lot written about an, allegedly, exaggerated bass of the HD650. I think I can understand those standpoints, but at the same time, I do not agree. Some music is obviously mixed and EQ'ed for higher bass levels and even with an emphasis: we mustn't forget what most "popular" music will be listened to with nowadays.

With a high quality source and suitable amplification the HD650 excels is with acoustic music, voices and "neutrally" mixed recordings.

 

[mulveling]

Great review! I agree completely with your analysis on the sonic differences between the hd600 and hd650. However, I myself prefer the darker balance of the hd650

It wasn't always that way - for a while I preferred the airy sound of the hd600, then when I began experimenting with cable replacements I started coming around to the hd650. There was a month or two where I went back and forth between the two headphones, unable to decide and settle down. Eventually my preferences changed towards the darker sound of the hd650. The more grain-free, refined sound of the hd650 was also a big factor for me (this aspect of sound quality is of immense importance to me). Cable swaps and plenty of burn-in helped the hd650 gain back some of the "air" of the hd600 (the Clou Red and Zu Mobius did the most for this IMO).

Wouldn't you know it, soon as I thought I would settle down, I became less satisfied with the hd650 over time. They're still not completely grain free and that bothered me. Sometimes I also wished for more powerful bass and better microdynamics

That's what led me to the L3000. Take the move from the hd600 to hd650, then continue moving a few steps further in that direction, add in AT's signature woody intimacy, treble sparkle, and better microdynamics - that's the L3000 in a nutshell

 

[boodi]

don't know if the grills but the hd600 seem to be that 1% more clear? resolved? refined? placebo?
I prefer hd580 though .. hd580 jubilee + hd600 grills and dyi aftermarket cable is the top of the world bargain

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodi don't know if the grills but the hd600 seem to be that 1% more clear? resolved? refined? placebo? I prefer hd580 though .. hd580 jubilee + hd600 grills and dyi aftermarket cable is the top of the world bargain

Quote:

99% of the same sound. Same drivers, only differences are (possible) driver matching, the grills, and the housing is not quite as sturdy. With the HD600 you're paying for a more expensive feel, not a different sound. jesse

Ok... I've never listend to the HD580 so I can't really comment. But reading to this http://www.onhifi.com/product/sennheiser_hd600.htm and looking at freq response graphs (ok, I know they tell not much), I think that the difference between the HD580 and HD600 (or HD580 Jubille, name it as you want

), is a bit more than 1%...

Maybe I'm wrong... anyway I believe that the HD580 is one of the more "smart engineered" headphone Sennheiser ever made. But I think that the non-resonant housing make a difference...

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mulveling Great review! I agree completely with your analysis on the sonic differences between the hd600 and hd650. However, I myself prefer the darker balance of the hd650

I understand your preference, really, not joking, myself I'm thinking to ger another time (the third time

) the HD650, I'll see.


Quote:

Wouldn't you know it, soon as I thought I would settle down, I became less satisfied with the hd650 over time. They're still not completely grain free and that bothered me. Sometimes I also wished for more powerful bass and better microdynamics That's what led me to the L3000. Take the move from the hd600 to hd650, then continue moving a few steps further in that direction, add in AT's signature woody intimacy, treble sparkle, and better microdynamics - that's the L3000 in a nutshell

I've listened to the L3000: "colored", but marvellous headphones, made "for music pleasure".

So... happy listening!

Andrew

 

[socrates63]

Good write up. I also prefer the more balanced sound of the HD600 to the HD650, but unfortunately, I very reluctantly traded away my HD600. Hopefully, the Ety ER4 I traded for will help me forget.

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glod Thanks Andrew for taking the time to offer us your story about the "two brothers". I found it to be one of the clearest written impressions on the two and I enjoyed the way you write.

Thanks... you're welcome

You don't know how I am surprised by my preference. Starting with the HD650 and not liking some of its features (note: features, not "defects"), I begun my trip in headphones: well, the last thing I was thinking it was to look at the cheaper sister. But they was really the right answer for dynamic headphones (electrostat are another planet imho, I'm not saying "better", but for sure "another"

)

Quote:

Your impressions, however, also made me more confident that the HD650 is what I am looking for in a headphone.

That's the good of hifi and headphones: many tastes and so many different high-quality interpretations of the reproduction of the sound. Funny, indeed!

Quote:

[650] It is also very good with symphonic music IMO, but then the quality of the source and amplifier are really critical.

Yes, true.

Quote:

There has been a lot written about an, allegedly, exaggerated bass of the HD650. I think I can understand those standpoints, but at the same time, I do not agree. Some music is obviously mixed and EQ'ed for higher bass levels and even with an emphasis: we mustn't forget what most "popular" music will be listened to with nowadays. With a high quality source and suitable amplification the HD650 excels is with acoustic music, voices and "neutrally" mixed recordings.

Here I "don't agree"... often I've found the HD650 a bit overwhelming in mid-bass... but I've to admit that in some recordings they were just perfect. So... it's really a matter of taste

 

[amartignano]

Sorry if I quote myself, but I don't have the HD650 so...

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano A question, as I don't have the HD650 now: seeing the HD600 "through light", you can see (also in my previous photo), that the back plate surrounding the driver is "open", or better said, there isn't this back plate. I don't remember, but it seems to me that the HD650 has this back plate, and so it's less open (although is open back the driver, of course, I'm speaking only about the surrounding). Can somebody confirm this?

Someone can help me?

Andrew

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Ok... I've never listend to the HD580 so I can't really comment. But reading to this http://www.onhifi.com/product/sennheiser_hd600.htm and looking at freq response graphs (ok, I know they tell not much), I think that the difference between the HD580 and HD600 (or HD580 Jubille, name it as you want ), is a bit more than 1%... Maybe I'm wrong... anyway I believe that the HD580 is one of the more "smart engineered" headphone Sennheiser ever made. But I think that the non-resonant housing make a difference...

Unlike most people, I owned both HD580 and HD600 at the same time. IMO there's definitely more than a 1% difference, unless you consider *only* tonal balance. HD600 is more dynamic, grain-free and less 'warm' sounding overall than the HD580. Small differences are probably adding up, I.E. more open grilles, better driver mounting materials, etc. To my ears, the differences were obvious even with lower end supporting gear.

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fewtch Unlike most people, I owned both HD580 and HD600 at the same time. IMO there's definitely more than a 1% difference, unless you consider *only* tonal balance. HD600 is more dynamic, grain-free and less 'warm' sounding overall than the HD580. Small differences are probably adding up, I.E. more open grilles, better driver mounting materials, etc. To my ears, the differences were obvious even with lower end supporting gear.

This confirm the impressions that I've received from the reading of the review I've linked and from some lectures of past italian hi-fi magazine, that speak about the HD580 Jubille as a "very different headphones" from the normal HD580. Anyway, maybe a day I will get an HD580 ans listen with my ears...

Andrew

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodi I prefer hd580 though .. hd580 jubilee + hd600 grills and dyi aftermarket cable is the top of the world bargain

Hi boodi... I've re-read this: I don't understand... I mean, the HD580 Jubilee is very very close to the HD600 (maybe it is the HD600, the grills seems the same, they have the carbon fibre housing, the matched drivers etc.), it's the difference between the HD580 and HD580 Jubilee the real "big step", from what I've read at the time of the launch of the HD580 Jubilee (1995).

Andrew

 

[philodox]

Not all HD580's are 'Jubilee'... it was a limited edition anniversary headphone. The Jubilee was basically a HD600 before there were HD600's and as such would be *quite* close. The HD600 has better matched drivers, better cable and slightly different housing material and grills when compared to the 'normal' HD580. It sounds different, but with some mods I would imagine that the HD580 would sound identical if the drivers were decently matched.

That said, I don't like Sennheiser headphones.

I just spend too much damn time on this message board.

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by philodox Not all HD580's are 'Jubilee'... it was a limited edition anniversary headphone. The Jubilee was basically a HD600 before there were HD600's and as such would be *quite* close.

Exactly... the HD600 was introduced to reiterate the HD580 Jubilee, special version of the HD580 for the fifty years of Sennheiser, which sounded too good to be a limited edition...

Andrew

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by philodox I just spend too much damn time on this message board.

x2