[baka1969]

@electropop

Hi,


While I won't argue your points, the Denon has it's merits. I'm not sure the OP needs pitch perfection. The Denon offers a fun presentation while filling the criteria of being closed and allowing enough ambient sound in to hear the phone ringing. I don't use the D1001 for critical listening. I use them for a purpose. Mostly for chores around the house or waiting at the doctor's office for example. The D1001 isn't a monitor headphone but offer nice enough playback for what they are. I've heard much worse. For the street prices they typically run, it's a good deal to boot.

 

[nullstring]

 
Quote:

@electropop

Hi,


While I won't argue your points, the Denon has it's merits. I'm not sure the OP needs pitch perfection. The Denon offers a fun presentation while filling the criteria of being closed and allowing enough ambient sound in to hear the phone ringing. I don't use the D1001 for critical listening. I use them for a purpose. Mostly for chores around the house or waiting at the doctor's office for example. The D1001 isn't a monitor headphone but offer nice enough playback for what they are. I've heard much worse. For the street prices they typically run, it's a good deal to boot.

 
Couldn't've said it better.
 
You're not suppose to sit there and concentrate on the music at work.
It's suppose to be decent sounding background music.
 

 

[electropop]

But music is not music if you can't hear the notes. Listening to music, for me, is anything but critical listening. I want to be able to whistle along, if I can..

 

[baka1969]

Quote: Originally Posted by electropop   " But music is not music if you can't hear the notes. Listening to music, for me, is anything but critical listening. I want to be able to whistle along, if I can.."



Now you're making it seem as if the D1001 is little better than iBuds or worse. That, to me, just isn't the case. Are closed headphones such as the SRH840 better? Yes? Do they fill the OP's criteria? No.


I'm listening to the D1001 now out of my iPod. I'm listening to Nirvana's "Dumb" off MTV Unplugged and I can tell you there's enough good sound to tap my toes. I just switched to The Moody Blues "The Night: Nights in White Satin" off Days of Future Passed and again I' m not getting an ear full of cotton. Do they sound like the HD800 out of my Gilmore Lite using my CD player and DAC? No that's ridiculous. But for what they're intended for and what the OP needs it's a good can.


EDIT:

Miles Davis - All Blues (Kind of Blue)

Sorry I whistled.

I had to say it.

 

[electropop]

Quote:

Quote: Originally Posted by electropop   " But music is not music if you can't hear the notes. Listening to music, for me, is anything but critical listening. I want to be able to whistle along, if I can.."



Now you're making it seem as if the D1001 is little better than iBuds or worse. That, to me, just isn't the case. Are closed headphones such as the SRH840 better? Yes? Do they fill the OP's criteria? No.


I'm listening to the D1001 now out of my iPod. I'm listening to Nirvana's "Dumb" off MTV Unplugged and I can tell you there's enough good sound to tap my toes. I just switched to The Moody Blues "The Night: Nights in White Satin" off Days of Future Passed and again I' m not getting an ear full of cotton. Do they sound like the HD800 out of my Gilmore Lite using my CD player and DAC? No that's ridiculous. But for what they're intended for and what the OP needs it's a good can.


EDIT:

Miles Davis - All Blues (Kind of Blue)

Sorry I whistled.

I had to say it.

 
I only said the 840s are the closest thing to a HD650 in sound signature, but yeah, they don't fit his criteria as you said.
 
"Good sound" can make you tap your toes, sure, but what couldn't? I've seen many heads-a-noggin with iPoodles. "Good sound" is subjective, playing notes properly isn't. I'd be amazed if you were able to tab notes with the 1001s properly. Even with Kind of Blue, which everyone probably knows inside out, I can't distinct bass-notes with the 1001s. I'd be hard-pressed to say anything about Chamber's playing. Pure guessing, my girlfriend said...
 
I'm not saying everything should be analytical, this all just transfers to more effortless music listening. Forget FR, forget impact, forget audiophoolery and just listen what the musician/s has/have to say

 

[electropop]

Oh, it's a good price, but I'd put a little extra for the ESW9s and they're quite on the same level isolation-wise, no?

 

[High_Q]

Is the wood on ESW9 for show or sound?  How does the wood effect the sound quality?

 

[Ham Sandwich]

Quote:

I'm sorry. Let me explicit.
 
Of course it does matter what kind of "sound" you prefer (I prefer the term "music reproduction", since too many here just listen to "audiophoolery", FR, soundstage etc. which don't have necessarily anything to do with music). To me the backbone is always (pitch accurate) notes. And that's the very essence of music. This of course is obvious to anybody, except maybe hip hop listeners/artists.
I've come to learn in the past two years that every headphone does not do this well, play notes that is. If you're listening to music rich with melody, some make it darn difficult to discern pitches. I like the term "one note samba".
With Denons I've found it pretty hard to tab notes from songs. If it's a song you know and the melody is quite simple, no problem, but when listening to jazz, prog or other music with lots of playfulness with notes, it becomes painstaking.
So, for the music to flow through effortlessly and flawlessly, the Denons, any model, would be a bad choice. FR and all aside, many AKG's or Audio Technica's do this so many times better. The message of the musician becomes more clear and everything is easier to listen to. From closed headphones the AKG K272HD's are pretty good, and W5000 while good, have some extra euphoric sweetness to them..
So I would say: If you like monotonic and overly powerful and unnatural bass, go for the Denons. But that's all that they'll give.

Most people do not listen to music the way you are.  Your needs are for an analytical headphone with clear (to the point of unnatural) separation of notes and sounds.  That's the territory of studio monitoring style of headphones.  That's all well and good if that's what you need.  But some of us don't like that style of sound for pleasurable music listening.  I find headphones that exaggerate the separation of notes and that exaggerate the separation of tones and that exaggerate the effect of soundstage to be unnatural.  Those headphones have a real and valid purpose for analytical work, but damn do they suck for enjoying what you are listening to.  Those kinds of headphones lack soul.
 
So don't knock headphones just because they don't fit your restricted needs.  Your needs aren't my needs.  And preferring something that isn't artificially analytical is not audiophoolery.  You can have detail without that artificial analytical sound, and some headphones manage to achieve that in varying degrees.
 
The D2000 does have a bass that is a little slow on the attack and a little slow on the decay.  That causes a blurring of the notes.  It is definitely not a one note bass or a one note samba bass.  It plays the notes.  If you want the Denon sound with a slightly tighter bass get the D7000.  If you're whole requirement is for transcribing the bass parts in jazz fusion buy something else.  If you want to enjoy the bass parts in jazz fusion the Denon is very nice (I listen to jazz fusion and love the Denon bass for that).
 
And yes, the OP should consider a Denon of some flavor.  It possibly meets his needs.  You can still hear the phone ringing or someone opening the door.  The concern would be whether they leak too much sound out.

 

[nullstring]

Quote:

 The concern would be whether they leak too much sound out.

1) I don't think you can have a headphone that allows you to hear background noises without having leakage at (excessively) high volumes
 
2) At any of those volumes you won't be able to hear the phone ring. I speak from experience. This defeats the point of using them.
 
3) This response seems kind of hostile, I think, but it's not intended to be. It's just the type of mood I am in right now. Concise, to the point.

 

[baka1969]

Quote:
Originally Posted by electropop  
" Oh, it's a good price, but I'd put a little extra for the ESW9s and they're quite on the same level isolation- wise, no?"


I don't have any experience with the ESW9 so I can't give an answer.

As for everyone's perennial favorite Kind of Blue, I couldn't agree more about listening to all the subtleties within the notes. My setup allows me to either concentrate on all the intricate textures or lay back and let the music just awash over me.

In a work environment I'm not sure how much of that can be done.

 

[chnsawBrutality]

How would you guys rank the Koss UR-55 in the criteria the OP is looking for?  I made a similar post with similar criteria and this pair was recommended.

 

[BlackSushi222]

Give the HA-S650 a go.

 

[eucariote]

Quote:

Since this thread is already derailed-
840>Sr-60i for rock-metal-techno?

 
Rock: SR60 > 840
Metal: SR60 > 840
Techno: SR60 < 840
 
Quote:

And yes, the OP should consider a Denon of some flavor.  It possibly meets his needs.  You can still hear the phone ringing or someone opening the door.  The concern would be whether they leak too much sound out.

Somewhat paradoxically I find that my Denons (D5000/D7000) let more sound in than they let out.  I can hear things pretty clearly (and can have a conversation with my wife) but the sound leaks out less than I expected given that lack of isolation.  I also like the Denons more than any other closed headphone but that is only relative to other close headphones I've owned (DT250-250, DT770-80, D5000, D7000, SRH840, K271).  I also don't like wearing huge headphones at work and use SE530 iems, but you couldn't hear a chainsaw with those.

 

[NapalmK]

Quote:

Somewhat paradoxically I find that my Denons (D5000/D7000) let more sound in than they let out.  I can hear things pretty clearly (and can have a conversation with my wife) but the sound leaks out less than I expected given that lack of isolation.

Know exactly what you mean. So far the only can I've heard that's managed to best my modded D2000s (personal preference of course) have been my AD2000s (and W1000s though only with some genres for those).

 

[electropop]

Quote:

Most people do not listen to music the way you are.  Your needs are for an analytical headphone with clear (to the point of unnatural) separation of notes and sounds.  That's the territory of studio monitoring style of headphones.  That's all well and good if that's what you need.  But some of us don't like that style of sound for pleasurable music listening.  I find headphones that exaggerate the separation of notes and that exaggerate the separation of tones and that exaggerate the effect of soundstage to be unnatural.  Those headphones have a real and valid purpose for analytical work, but damn do they suck for enjoying what you are listening to.  Those kinds of headphones lack soul.
 
So don't knock headphones just because they don't fit your restricted needs.  Your needs aren't my needs.  And preferring something that isn't artificially analytical is not audiophoolery.  You can have detail without that artificial analytical sound, and some headphones manage to achieve that in varying degrees.
 
The D2000 does have a bass that is a little slow on the attack and a little slow on the decay.  That causes a blurring of the notes.  It is definitely not a one note bass or a one note samba bass.  It plays the notes.  If you want the Denon sound with a slightly tighter bass get the D7000.  If you're whole requirement is for transcribing the bass parts in jazz fusion buy something else.  If you want to enjoy the bass parts in jazz fusion the Denon is very nice (I listen to jazz fusion and love the Denon bass for that).
 
And yes, the OP should consider a Denon of some flavor.  It possibly meets his needs.  You can still hear the phone ringing or someone opening the door.  The concern would be whether they leak too much sound out.

Hmm, I really don't know what you mean by "soul". If you mean coloration and the ability to highlight some areas (possibly the most integral ones..), I don't think I agree. Would you say the W5000s lack soul? They're quite nice...
 
I also think AKG 701s have got lots of soul! Jazz fusion never sounded so good Put in a Linn source, a Naim Headline 2 and they're pure bliss, in every area. Even my HE5s can't touch them. I think they're far from being artificially analytical. If a headphone can play notes right, it can do lots of other things pretty good as well.
 
And no, coloration doesn't mean bad necessarily. Grados for instance play notes far better than Denons. I think the Denons (1001/5000/7000s, which I've tried) actually lack "soul", because I'm not able to hear the melodies.
 
Hmmm, I think we need to separate "good sound", which is purely subjective from "musically accurate".
 
To OP about the ESW9s. I really don't know about the wood housing... I think they're good but not as good as AKG272s, but let more sound in and are more fragile. Wood does resonate less than most cheap metal housings, but needs a different implementation. The ESW10JPNs weren't bad but too expensive and from what people say, the ESW9s are 90-95% of what they are, so the price isn't too bad I think. Transients are better, notes can be heard... They have some of that euphoric sweetness to them which many like. I'd take them over the Denon 1001s anytime.