[justrest]

Hey thanks man that is very helpful. I think I will skip on the Hugo 2, if you add in the fact that it apparently can sound harsh and I have a lot of badly recorded music. I have the Mojo which is fine as a USB DAC and maybe I grab the 380.

I am indeed selling a lot of stuff I bought to try and have now too much. I like to have a fairly focused set of gear or my OCD mind gets lost. The LPG I am only selling because I have a deal for a 2017 edition here.

If you heard LPG 2017, could you please compare with the LPG?

 

[Mimouille]

If you heard LPG 2017, could you please compare with the LPG?

No difference, just slightly less noise on SUPER sensitive IEMs.

 

[Mimouille]

 

[justrest]

No difference, just slightly less noise on SUPER sensitive IEMs.

Now I feel better.
Thank you

 

[junix]

Would you guys say fourte is best in resolution/clarity currently?

The following should have no influence whatsoever on your decision to spend 3k on a pair of IEMs.

..tried fourte and u18t a few times in different occasions.
I much preferred the u18t, waited for black friday and ordered it.

I mostly listen to jazz and I find the u18t ideal for me, and me only.

 

[Deezel177]

WooAudio WA8

I picked up a WA8 last week, to see if it could replace my Hugo 2, as I was starting to find my Hugo 2 a bit harsh with many of my albums. WA8's sound has a few strong characteristics. I am surprised that none of the reviews out there, have mentioned these aspects, and rather did the usual 'wonderful vacuum tube sound' dance. Actually, Currawong talked about the forward/engaging presentation and AnakChan mentioned the stage being narrow. But no review mentioned about the weirdness in the mid-range. Anyways, moving on..

The first aspect about WA8's sound that gets your attention is the strong bass. The bass is slightly enhanced resulting in a warm and slightly-thick bass presentation. But thats the not the whole story about its bass. This thing can slam like a s-o-b. Its an impact that you only come across in desktop amplifiers. And I am not surprised because, despite WA8's transportable form, its amp section is actually a fully discrete design, running class-A. What that means is, you can expect some of the benefits you get from a desktop class amp. And for the same reason, the unit runs quite hot and you only get around 4 hours of battery, as class-A designs are simply power hungry and dissipate a lot of heat. Another sound aspect you can expect from a good discrete amp is an open and airy soundstage, and the WA8 does have a spacious and an airy stage with excellent height and depth. But the width of the stage is quite narrow. So what you get is a high-ceiling-hallway shaped stage, that feels very spacious, even if its not monstrous in size. The presentation as a whole is placed slightly forward than neutral which gives a very engaging sound. I typically prefer a neutral placement but its not a big deal.

While these characteristics mentioned in the above paragraph can be desired or disliked, depending on one's preference, there is one more characteristic where the WA8 fails objectively, regardless of preferences. And that is the lack of body and dynamics in the mid-range. It's a shame because, the tone of the mid-range is very natural and realistic. With a forward presentation, the mid-range instruments feel right there and yet, it lacks the tangibility due to the lack of body. And to make it worse, the mid-range also lacks macro and micro-dynamics and thus coming across as soft. And when I try to crank the volume up to perceive the mid-range, the bass starts to overwhelm the sound. And when I do some EQ by adding some dBs to the center-midrange, there is a slight improvement in body, but the midrange still remains soft and intangible. So there really is no solution to this problem. The reviews talk about the tubey mid-range in the device. While the influence of WA8's tubes can be sensed in its tone and smoothness, you really don't get the full-bodied notes that most other tube amps typically offer.

Once you get past this mid-range issue, there is a lot to be admired and enjoyed about the WA8's sound. For example, the device just nails the tone. With a touch of warmth from the bass, a linear treble and a neutral-warm mid-range, the tone I hear on the WA8 is perhaps the best I've heard from a portable device in the sub-$2000 category. And I think we have to thank the tubes for that, because the tubes seem to remove any kind of edginess or hardness in the upper-midrange and treble, while retaining most details. And so, the amp has a very forgiving sound. The resolution and transparency are not WA8's strengths. Not that it lacks in those areas. It does have above average transparency and resolution, but devices like Hugo 2 and other TOTL DAPs outperform the WA8 in those regards and sound more precise. What it lacks in resolution and transparency it makes it up with its tone, stage and bass impact. Overall WA8 is a device geared for musical enjoyment.

Vs Hugo 2:
In comparison to the Hugo 2, WA8's bass slams harder and is overall warmer than H2's bass. H2's bass may be quick and clean, but it lacks the bass dynamics that the WA8 has. H2's midrange is more present and solid, and it also gets the cake for mid-range dynamics. Every little micro-dynamics is so easily laid out on the H2, while these micro-dynamics are soft sounding and are not quite easily perceived on the WA8. H2's lower mid-range isn't as thick as the WA8, but the overall body of the mid-range is better on the H2, due to the solidity and density reinforced by its centre-midrange presence.

While the WA8 goes for a smoother upper-midrange and treble, H2 is overall brighter, sharper and very detailed in that frequency range, supplemented with a better treble extension. Whether H2 is forgiving or not, will depend on the track and the headphones. But regardless of the headphones, WA8 is going to have an organic tone and a forgiving nature. H2 literally nails the presentation with a equally proportioned stage and a neutral placement. WA8 does sound a bit more spacious and airy, but the placement is a touch more forward. H2 does have better width, but the WA8 has better height. And both the devices have a similar depth. While layering is also similar on both devices, H2 gets the win for separation, resolution and transparency. Over all H2 sounds analytical due to its hyper-detailed neutral sound, that focusses on precision, while the WA8 goes for a musical presentation.

Conclusion:
In the end, WA8 is a really good AIO solution with a simple design, and a transportable form factor. It is not going to be as portable as a Mojo, nor is it feature-rich like a Hugo 2. But it does have a tubey character to its sound and certain qualities to replace your desktop DAC and Amp stack, provided you can overlook the mid-range issue. But for the asking price of $1800, the mid-range issue is something I can't go easy about. So if you know you will be using it mostly at your desk, I'd recommend looking into a different DAC+Amp stack. But if you are a frequent traveller or want a device with a smooth sound, that you could carry to your office and back, and can make peace with a soft mid-range, I can wholeheartedly recommend the WA8.

Excellent, excellent write-up, man! I tried the WA8 a year or two ago and had a similar experience. Through the HD800S, I loved the organic timbre that vocals and instruments took on, as well as the added low-end. But, a lack of stage openness (especially in width) and a wispy, un-authoritative quality to the midrange (I'd probably be able to describe this better had I had more experience back then) eventually put me off from dropping the cash. Like Mim, though, I very much look forward to what the WA11 has to offer.

A Flinkenick company ? https://flicker-ear.com/

Flicker Ear is a Filipino CIEM company that's been gaining some traction in the Asian market. Just as an interest check, would any of you guys be interested in a review/impressions post on any of their products?

 

[Wyville]

I would love to see all IEM makers use these outstanding DAC/AMPS with their gear at shows. It's so easy for them to just use the Sony's, but I can' tell you that my Phantom's scale like heck wiht my Ayre QX5/30 DAC and my high end server. That tells me that they are soundly voiced as my DAC/Server/Amp is a top reference 2 channel system. My ZMF Ori's running balanced out of the Ayre make them sound so much better than any headphone played off a Hugo 2 or any top DAP. That shows how important the DAC/Amp/Source is. too many folks don't pay enough attention on this part of the chain. They just keep buying more expensive IEM's and they play them off a DAP that just isn't up to the standard they should have.

I get what you are saying and I am very curious to try my Phantom with a (much) better source than my AK70. I hope I can do that in a few months time when I am back in the Netherlands and can swing by @Adventure's store to camp there for a day.

For me the main issue is one of portability (or at least transportability), which is why I gravitated towards IEMs rather than headphones. I use my IEMs on the go, while I'm cooking, behind my desk, on the sofa and in bed before I go to sleep. That is what I think makes IEMs so great, versatility, and I have always seen it as a compromise where sound quality is secondary to portability. I still expect that it is much less expensive to get the same sound quality from headphones than it is for IEMs. That is why I have recently developed a mild case of audiophile schizophrenia, where I want to try and scale up the Phantom, but constantly find myself looking at options that reduce portability and I start to question if that even makes sense.

I think that might well be the difference between someone coming from 2-channel compared to someone coming from an mp3 player and some cheap earbuds. I don't mean that in a critical sense, btw, just as an explanation why it might seem that some do not pay enough attention to the source. I think many people do, and the recent trend of different Amp modules for DAPs like the DX200 and X7mkII illustrates that quite well, but there are limitations when portability is a factor. Even DAPs like the WM1Z or AK380Cu + Amp are so heavy that the term "portable" means something different compared to DAPs like the ZX300 and AK70 that fit in a pocket.

So while I want to get the most out of my Phantom, of course I do, I still have no idea how I want to go about it. A great desktop stack is not even that expensive, especially compared to a TOTL DAP, but how much will I end up using it if I can't move it around? And if I do accept a desktop setup, why not go all the way and get some headphones (or dare I say, a complete 2 channel system)?

So yeah, I love reading about ways to push the Phantom to new heights and I am very curious about it, but I am still leaning more towards portability.

 

[Bina]

Flicker Ear is a Filipino CIEM company that's been gaining some traction in the Asian market. Just as an interest check, would any of you guys be interested in a review/impressions post on any of their products?

Here is my older write up about them: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/flicker-ear-ciems-in-collaboration-with-pw-audio.870915/

 

[Layman1]

If you ever need to get a hold of Sammy, message him on the Rhapsodio Facebook page and I can all but guarantee you'll get a response in 24 hours or less, weekend or not.

I use the Zombie with the brightest cable I have: the RSD Silver mk3 (balanced). The Dwarf is too warm for it and the Golden is a different sound entirely. Like another member mentioned, it's probably not night and day, but I love mine with the silver and neutral sources. I guess that's obvious by my review, haha.

You may like the Galaxy V2 as well. Where are you located? I may have to create a private review tour just for you!

-Collin-

Unfortunately I'm one of only 9 people left in the UK who don't use Facebook, so that option is out
Also, as I just mentioned, I'm in the UK. So whilst a private review tour sounds amazeballs, it's probably going to have a few logistical issues

And your cable comment is exactly what I was thinking. I guessed (based on my limited experience with cables) that a good silver one might provide a subtle but welcome shift to the sound signature.
And the rest, as both you and I also mentioned, is down to using a good neutral source

 

[Kerouac]

Nice!!! When I saw your LPG for sale I thought ''What is he doing? Making the same mistake (selling that wonderful dap) as I almost made?''
But then I saw there was a back-up plan and that you still have one

Please don't forget to try the Spiral Dot tips as well. I thought they did a pretty good job on the universal prototype when I had it over here.

I get what you are saying and I am very curious to try my Phantom with a (much) better source than my AK70. I hope I can do that in a few months time when I am back in the Netherlands and can swing by @Adventure's store to camp there for a day.

For me the main issue is one of portability (or at least transportability), which is why I gravitated towards IEMs rather than headphones. I use my IEMs on the go, while I'm cooking, behind my desk, on the sofa and in bed before I go to sleep. That is what I think makes IEMs so great, versatility, and I have always seen it as a compromise where sound quality is secondary to portability. I still expect that it is much less expensive to get the same sound quality from headphones than it is for IEMs. That is why I have recently developed a mild case of audiophile schizophrenia, where I want to try and scale up the Phantom, but constantly find myself looking at options that reduce portability and I start to question if that even makes sense.

I think that might well be the difference between someone coming from 2-channel compared to someone coming from an mp3 player and some cheap earbuds. I don't mean that in a critical sense, btw, just as an explanation why it might seem that some do not pay enough attention to the source. I think many people do, and the recent trend of different Amp modules for DAPs like the DX200 and X7mkII illustrates that quite well, but there are limitations when portability is a factor. Even DAPs like the WM1Z or AK380Cu + Amp are so heavy that the term "portable" means something different compared to DAPs like the ZX300 and AK70 that fit in a pocket.

So while I want to get the most out of my Phantom, of course I do, I still have no idea how I want to go about it. A great desktop stack is not even that expensive, especially compared to a TOTL DAP, but how much will I end up using it if I can't move it around? And if I do accept a desktop setup, why not go all the way and get some headphones (or dare I say, a complete 2 channel system)?

So yeah, I love reading about ways to push the Phantom to new heights and I am very curious about it, but I am still leaning more towards portability.

Haha, that's exactly how I've lived my 'portable life' over the past years and why I went from full size headphones to (c)iems

I'm not sure how much there is to gain in sq compared to the AK70 as I've never tried that one myself. But with the prices for a used LPG (look at Mims for example) I would also seriously consider that one. Great synergy with the Phantom imo and it drives DD and hybrid iems also very well, because of it's power.

I must also say that I never had the idea that the AK380Cu (RedWine modded) lacked any power/authority driving the iems that I've got here. Volume needed for my ears is usually inbetween 60 and 90 (where it can go up to 150) and without amp it's certainly very pocket friendly imo.
AK380Cu (RW modded) + Zeus XR (mainly R) + 1960 2-wire certainly hits the sweet spot (synergy wise) for me these days.

Btw, this weekend I tried my Norne cable (which is usually 'married to' my Rhapsodio Solar) on the Phantom and I was very pleased with what I heard. More clarity / details compared to the Ares II, without making concessions on that fabulous timbre / natural signature.
This is a 23awg silver (some kinda prototype, which retailed at $380) cable inbetween the Therium and Silvergarde. It sounds so damn sweet that I'm seriously considering to get me a Silvergarde S for the Phantom later on this year

 

[klyzon]

I get what you are saying and I am very curious to try my Phantom with a (much) better source than my AK70. I hope I can do that in a few months time when I am back in the Netherlands and can swing by @Adventure's store to camp there for a day.

For me the main issue is one of portability (or at least transportability), which is why I gravitated towards IEMs rather than headphones. I use my IEMs on the go, while I'm cooking, behind my desk, on the sofa and in bed before I go to sleep. That is what I think makes IEMs so great, versatility, and I have always seen it as a compromise where sound quality is secondary to portability. I still expect that it is much less expensive to get the same sound quality from headphones than it is for IEMs. That is why I have recently developed a mild case of audiophile schizophrenia, where I want to try and scale up the Phantom, but constantly find myself looking at options that reduce portability and I start to question if that even makes sense.

I think that might well be the difference between someone coming from 2-channel compared to someone coming from an mp3 player and some cheap earbuds. I don't mean that in a critical sense, btw, just as an explanation why it might seem that some do not pay enough attention to the source. I think many people do, and the recent trend of different Amp modules for DAPs like the DX200 and X7mkII illustrates that quite well, but there are limitations when portability is a factor. Even DAPs like the WM1Z or AK380Cu + Amp are so heavy that the term "portable" means something different compared to DAPs like the ZX300 and AK70 that fit in a pocket.

So while I want to get the most out of my Phantom, of course I do, I still have no idea how I want to go about it. A great desktop stack is not even that expensive, especially compared to a TOTL DAP, but how much will I end up using it if I can't move it around? And if I do accept a desktop setup, why not go all the way and get some headphones (or dare I say, a complete 2 channel system)?

So yeah, I love reading about ways to push the Phantom to new heights and I am very curious about it, but I am still leaning more towards portability.

Also the primary reason i'm sticking to my zx300. The portability factor is a huge plus. In a pinch, i can actually stuff the zx300 and iems into my backpocket (just need to remember to not seat on them)

 

[flinkenick]

Unfortunately I'm one of only 9 people left in the UK who don't use Facebook, so that option is out
Also, as I just mentioned, I'm in the UK. So whilst a private review tour sounds amazeballs, it's probably going to have a few logistical issues

And your cable comment is exactly what I was thinking. I guessed (based on my limited experience with cables) that a good silver one might provide a subtle but welcome shift to the sound signature.
And the rest, as both you and I also mentioned, is down to using a good neutral source

I can send the Galaxy and Dream if you like, think UK still falls under European borders for now hehe.

 

[Wyville]

Haha, that's exactly how I've lived my 'portable life' over the past years and why I went from full size headphones to (c)iems

I'm not sure how much there is to gain in sq compared to the AK70 as I've never tried that one myself. But with the prices for a used LPG (look at Mims for example) I would also seriously consider that one. Great synergy with the Phantom imo and it drives DD and hybrid iems also very well, because of it's power.

I must also say that I never had the idea that the AK380Cu (RedWine modded) lacked any power/authority driving the iems that I've got here. Volume needed for my ears is usually inbetween 60 and 90 (where it can go up to 150) and without amp it's certainly very pocket friendly imo.
AK380Cu (RW modded) + Zeus XR (mainly R) + 1960 2-wire certainly hits the sweet spot (synergy wise) for me these days.

Btw, this weekend I tried my Norne cable (which is usually 'married to' my Rhapsodio Solar) on the Phantom and I was very pleased with what I heard. More clarity / details compared to the Ares II, without making concessions on that fabulous timbre / natural signature.
This is a 23awg silver (some kinda prototype, which retailed at $380) cable inbetween the Therium and Silvergarde. It sounds so damn sweet that I'm seriously considering to get me a Silvergarde S for the Phantom later on this year

Yes, the LPG really appeals to me as well. It actually looks like just the type of DAP I like, rugged, sensible buttons and functions, and lots of power. Just don't know about the battery life. Is that any good, or about average (10hrs)? Then again, Sony always keeps calling me as well and since most of my cables are 2.5mm also keep thinking about the convenience of sticking to A&K. This hobby man...

When I have moved back to the Netherlands I will come visit and we can do some cable swapping! I think you will like the Ares II 8-wire as well and I am quite curious about Norne.

Also the primary reason i'm sticking to my zx300. The portability factor is a huge plus. In a pinch, i can actually stuff the zx300 and iems into my backpocket (just need to remember to not seat on them)

I gave my A15 to my wife and bought her some Final E2000 to go with it. I can say that it sounds amazing for the price and it is incredibly portable. Plus, she keeps laughing at me every time I need to charge my AK70... "Is the battery dead again? Should have kept the Sony! "

 

[flinkenick]

Oh just some final thoughts on different daps. With the new models (coming) out, second hand LPG's and AK380's are offering great value. If you are in the market for a new midtier dap, I would def consider paying a few hundred extra for a second hand one of these. In fact, I might get an LPG again myself, so dibs on the first one that is offered below $900. LPG has some distinct advantages over other daps. Besides the energetic signature, it pairs especially well with iems that have a lean or neutral midrange, or are warmer in tone. For instance, NT6pro, H8.2, and Aether to me all sound better on the LPG than the 1Z or AK's. Phantom and 5-Way are also very good pairings. But keep in mind that the treble can be hot for sensitive listeners, especially with brighter pairings. So iems like Samba, Katana, or the Dream were a no-go for me.

For all the DX200 owners, I hope I didn't offend with the SP1000 comparisons. My intention was not to point out it has shortcomings. When I tried the DX200 at CJ London, I found it the best of all midtier daps. Besides, it offers extraordinary value and flexibility. With the 4s amp, I would also describe it as a proper execution of 'neutral': a neutral tonality, yet smooth and musical with nice upper mids. Versatile over genres. But sometimes when I read all those posts/reviews I think why can't that just be good enough, without having to say it is as good as the AK's and Sony at 1/3 of the price

 

[klyzon]

Extremely tempting to get wm1z at a good price but after being poisoned by empire, would probably have to save for ages now that I’ve gotten 2 phantoms and a legend x along with cables for em