[FiiO KA17] Mini desktop-class amp, flagship dongle is officially released!
Mar 1, 2024 at 9:41 PM Post #286 of 653
I mostly used KA17 to drive my Moondrop Para (planar 8 ohm, desktop mode + external power) and I can confirm it doesn't get anywhere that I'll describe as hot. Luke warm maybe,

Also, my measurement suggests 4.4mm's output impedance is around 2.7 ohm or so while 3.5 mm's output impedance is indeed 1 ohm.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 9:20 AM Post #287 of 653

Hai un misuratore di potenza USB?

Prova prima a collegare il KA17 all'alimentazione e guarda se il display si accende. Se il display non si accende quando colleghi qualcosa alla porta USBC rossa, c'è qualcosa che non va.
Scusate il ritardo, finalmente ho risolto i problemi di durata della batteria e di brutta equalizzazione. Per inesperienza ho utilizzato un'app (lettore audio PRO USB, sviluppo software eXtreme). Non so perché ma il consumo era triplicato, degradando la qualità e impedendo l'utilizzo dell'USB aggiuntiva. Grazie Patrick per il tuo interesse, ho acquistato un misuratore USB, davvero utile, uno strumento carino da avere. strumento carino da avere.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 9:26 AM Post #288 of 653
Sorry for the delay, I finally solved the battery life and bad equalization problems. Due to inexperience I used an app (PRO USB audio player, eXtreme software development). I don't know why but the consumption had tripled, degrading the quality and preventing the use of the additional USB. Thanks Patrick for your interest, I purchased a USB meter, really useful, a nice tool to have.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 11:35 AM Post #290 of 653
i am using uapp for years with many devices without any problems. so i wonder what went wrong with Macheses installation and device. i wanted to buy a ka17 myself and now i get a little afraid of running into problems with uapp. the only alternative android player that can do what uapp does is the hiby player, but i dont want to switch at all.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 12:00 PM Post #291 of 653
Review and Disassembly of the KA17: Dual Type-C Port USB Dongle/Desktop Headphone Amplifier

Upon seeing the KA17, my first question was: which model of the FIIO USB dongle is it upgraded?
asynccode


Based on FIIO's naming convention, the predecessor of KA17 should be the KA7. However, there seems to be no such model in FIIO's product lineup.
asynccode


The KA17 and KA13, both belonging to the "KA" series, share a similar appearance, but the KA17 appears to be of a higher level because it has a display screen, while the pentagonal window on the KA13 is just an LED transmission window. Additionally, the KA17 is larger compared to the KA13.
asynccode


The KA17 is one of the only two models in FIIO's USB dongle series with a screen, the other being the KA5. Furthermore, the KA17 not only has a screen but also features a D.MODE switch for desktop mode.
asynccode


Moreover, the KA17 boasts a more explosive configuration with two Type-C ports on its body. The last time I saw a similar configuration was on FIIO's brick-shaped DAC and headphone amplifier, the Q15.

In addition, the UI of KA17 is not only rich in options but also offers a unique feature of a language option among USB dongles.

After this comparison and analysis, a general impression can be drawn: the KA17 excels in both high output power and rich UI control options.
asynccode


Audio testing: Previously, on the KA13, I experienced the power of the D.MODE switch, which allowed the maximum output of the balanced port to reach 567mW (tested by AudioTOP). This time, under the collaboration of D.MODE and dual Type-C ports, the KA17's maximum output for the balanced port has surged to 649mW, once again breaking records.

According to our observations, the D.MODE switch has an immediate effect on the maximum output of both the single-ended and balanced ports.

When turned off: single-ended output power goes up to 148mW; balanced up to 261mW; When turned on: single-ended output power goes up to 289mW; balanced up to 649mW.

In other words, when the desktop mode is activated, the power of the single-ended port increases by 95%, almost doubling it, while the power of the balanced port increases significantly by 149%.

With robust power output, the suppression of THD+N distortion and background noise is quite good instead of losing one thing or the other.
asynccode


Furthermore, we noticed that after enabling the desktop mode, the static power consumption of the KA17 increased from 0.78W to 1.14W. In comparison, the KA13's power consumption remained around 0.72W with little variation, regardless of whether the D.Mode switch was on or off. Therefore, the headphone amplifier circuit structures of the two USB dongles must be different.

More details and reasons about this will be further analyzed during the disassembly process. Anyways, the KA17's unique characteristics necessitate a second Type-C port, allowing third-party power sources beyond just mobile phones.

Based on past usage experiences, USB dongles tend to draw a significant amount of power from the phone's built-in battery. Unknowingly, this could deplete the phone's battery to a large extent, causing battery anxiety.

However, during the use of the KA17 this time, with the assistance of the unlimited power supply from the second Type-C port, the battery icon on the phone remained unchanged regardless of how long I listened to music. Hence, the manufacturer's designation of it as a "mini desktop DAC/Amp" comes with a reason.
asynccode


The disassembly of the KA17 this time was quite unusual. After several unsuccessful attempts using the traditional method of heating and suction cups, as you can see, I used a Zippo lighter with strong double-sided tape to open the cover.
asynccode


The back panel departed from the usual glass material and instead adopted a metal plate. Coupled with a thermal conductive pad, it facilitates faster heat dissipation for the internal circuitry, primarily the headphone amplifier chips.
asynccode


Removing the first circuit board, we can see a smaller thermal pad sandwiched between two headphone amplifier chips.
asynccode

asynccode


This board contains all the audio circuits, with the core components including two DACs and four headphone amplifiers, distributed on both sides of the board.
asynccode


The DACs are ES9069Q, one for each channel. The ES9069Q incorporates ESS's latest fourth-generation Hyperstream modulation engine, with a channel count of 2ch.
asynccode


The headphone amplifier chips are the SGM8261-5. This is a dual-channel chip, so the KA17's headphone amplifier channels can reach up to 2x4=8.

How do so many channels coordinate? According to the datasheet, the typical power consumption of each SGM8261-5 is 0.2W. It can be inferred that when the D.MODE is off, only two SGM8261-5 chips are involved in amplification; when the D.MODE is on, all four SGM8261-5 chips are working.
asynccode

asynccode


Continuing with the disassembly, remove the metal piece sandwiched between the two circuit boards.
asynccode

asynccode

asynccode

asynccode


The lower-level circuit board is collectively referred to as the main control board, containing multiple functional sections, such as display, control, input, USB bridge, and audio data processing. You can see a 16-core XMOS chip and two Type-C ports on it. The red interface on the side is dedicated to power input, but not data transfer.
asynccode


All buttons and switches are mounted on a small metal bracket, which absorbs and isolates all operation pressure, ensuring durability for long-term use.
asynccode


The OLED screen closely fits the panel glass.
asynccode


The KA17 is FIIO's most component-rich and structurally complex USB dongle to date. The disassembly process was relatively difficult, and users are not advised to disassemble it themselves because the probability of non-destructive reassembly is very low.

Despite its complexity, the structure remains orderly. Within the compact layers, both digital/analog isolation and circuit cooling are well maintained.
asynccode


The KA17 adopts a new DAC chip from ESS, and the configuration of the headphone amplifier section not only features a large number of chips but also exhibits a unique mode of operation among headphone amplifier chips, unseen before. With the hardware architecture described above and the assistance of D.MODE and dual Type-C ports, the KA17 vigorously raises the ceiling.

At the same time, it breaks down the boundary between USB dongle and desktop headphone amplifiers. While the inherent label of USB dongles is portable and easy to carry around, now with an additional power input port, its application value in desktop scenarios will also be explored by users. Moreover, the bilingual display interface unique to FIIO further reduces usage barriers.

Author: AudioTOP Edited on 19/02/2024
Original text: https://weibo.com/ttarticle/p/show?id=2309405003262897291672
Excellent post and confirms to me that the KA17 is a piece of crap and a titanic step back in every single aspect compared to both the ka13 and ka5 in every area except pure power output. That the ka13 has better hardware controls, app support and outputs only 80mw less at 60% of the power consumption, as well as being much lighter and smaller shows how bad this device is.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 5:48 PM Post #292 of 653
i am using uapp for years with many devices without any problems. so i wonder what went wrong with Macheses installation and device. i wanted to buy a ka17 myself and now i get a little afraid of running into problems with uapp. the only alternative android player that can do what uapp does is the hiby player, but i dont want to switch at all.

I don't use UAPP much these days as Sony recent Android 14 update has enabled bit-perfect output on the firmware level. However, UAPP does seem to run just fine on my Sony Xperia IV -> KA17. Tested with MQA, DSD, PCM 192kHz, and 44.1kHz files and I didn't detect any issues, at least with UAPP's bit-perfect output + no EQ.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 6:50 PM Post #293 of 653
@FiiO I just noticed that the KA17 uses the DSD mode while the iPhone 15 Pro only has the DoP mode. I think the KA17 has problems to recognize the right mode that’s coming from the iPhone and that‘s the reason for the noise.
The noise gets louder when I raise the volume.
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 7:09 PM Post #294 of 653
I don't use UAPP much these days as Sony recent Android 14 update has enabled bit-perfect output on the firmware level. However, UAPP does seem to run just fine on my Sony Xperia IV -> KA17. Tested with MQA, DSD, PCM 192kHz, and 44.1kHz files and I didn't detect any issues, at least with UAPP's bit-perfect output + no EQ.
Is there anything you had to do for your Android phone to enable the new native bit perfect mode, or is that now the case by default?
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 7:34 PM Post #295 of 653
Is there anything you had to do for your Android phone to enable the new native bit perfect mode, or is that now the case by default?
Didn't do anything with my Xperia IV, it just did its thing and switches between different sampling frequency with different apps / files instead of resampling to 48kHz like older Android. For example, now Spotify outputs 44.1kHz while YouTube outputs 48kHz, all on their own. The only exception is MQA playback, which requires MQA enabled app like UAPP. Otherwise it will still output as normal 44.1kHz.
 
Last edited:
Mar 3, 2024 at 7:45 PM Post #296 of 653
Didn't do anything with my Xperia IV, it just did its thing and switches between different sampling frequency with different apps / files instead of resampling to 48kHz like older Android. For example, now Spotify outputs 44.1kHz while YouTube outputs 48kHz, all on their own. The only exception is MQA playback, which requires MQA enabled app like UAPP. Otherwise it will still output as normal 44.1kHz.
Thanks!!!
 
Mar 3, 2024 at 9:40 PM Post #297 of 653
Excellent post and confirms to me that the KA17 is a piece of crap and a titanic step back in every single aspect compared to both the ka13 and ka5 in every area except pure power output. That the ka13 has better hardware controls, app support and outputs only 80mw less at 60% of the power consumption, as well as being much lighter and smaller shows how bad this device is.
where in the review did you read anything that confirms you claims?
 
Mar 4, 2024 at 12:27 AM Post #298 of 653
where in the review did you read anything that confirms you claims?
Don't pay attention, a person just loves paper specifications and doesn't understand that there is a big difference in sound quality between CS43131 and ES9069Q chips
No matter how small and powerful the ka13 is, the sound from the CS43131 chip is not what I would like to listen to.
 
Mar 4, 2024 at 3:04 AM Post #299 of 653
Dear freinds,

1. FIIO Control APP only supports EQ adjustment:

The KA17 comes with a display, most of the functions can be set up through the display without going through the APP, which is more convenient. So our APP only reserves the EQ adjustment function that can't be realized by the small display. Other settings are not added yet.
Besides, we use XMOS to realize the algorithm of USB AUDIO and PEQ. Its USB HID communication command is limited so we can't realize many function definitions for KA17 like Bluetooth devices. However, please inform us the additional functions you need in the APP, and we will try to add them gradually after integrating most of the users' requirements.

2. The KA17 is getting hot when D. mode is on:

When D.MODE is on, the amplifier parallel mode will be turned on in for greater output capability. In our tests, power consumption increases by about 40% when D.MODE is on, but not so hot as to cause a safety incident.
As mentioned in our product introduction page, the KA17 has a built-in temperature detection function, which automatically reduces or turn off the output when the temperature of the machine exceeds the set range. Please feel free to use it. If you want to dissipate heat faster, please try to remove the leather case. If you feel that the product is heating up very much, even the risk of burns, please contact the seller or support@fiio.com for check.

Best regards

Please look into the custom PEQ volume issue, the volume is noticeably reduced even without any adjustment..
 
Mar 4, 2024 at 5:48 AM Post #300 of 653
Don't pay attention, a person just loves paper specifications and doesn't understand that there is a big difference in sound quality between CS43131 and ES9069Q chips
No matter how small and powerful the ka13 is, the sound from the CS43131 chip is not what I would like to listen to.
the cirrus logic isnt a bad chip per se, as it is used in many midtier dongles but companys often use 2 of them in a dual dac configuration these days. andysaudiovault tested many of them and as i said, there not generally bed, its also a question of how they are implented, the amp stage etc. Out of curiosity i really would like to do an A/B comparison with those little powerhouses. But still the KA17 is not available in Germany. Its like with every new Fiio product, Germany is the last country to get it, months after everyone already has the new products in hand. :sob:
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top