[hypnos1]

Hi C...Well yes, Chinese tubes had that fame of “low quality” (for their mass produced tubes) but in recent years things have improved a lot with their “special” series like Psvane T-II, Shuguang “Treasures”, Fullmusic, not to mention expensive beauties like the Sophia Electric KT88-ST blue bottles ($175 each) that are custom made by Shuguang for the said U.S. company, and reviewers are bowled over... they say the tubes belong to the very top of the KT88s universe (including NOS tubes) and some say a sonic level comparable with the revered (and uber expensive) Czech KR tubes. So, the Chinese definitely can make excellent and reliable tubes...for a price.



I was looking for a neutral, lively, “not dark” KT88 set for my power amp, (avoiding “dry” sounding tubes) that must have taut and controlled bass, along with a “liquid” sound and wide soundstage, and yes, the Sophias seemed just the ticket...but not at that price. After closely examining tube construction details watching many pics of the Sophias (a trick learned in this very forum) I discovered that (apart from bulb shape) the latest “super tube” Shuguang WEKT88s were the very same tube internally, up to the smallest details. This is quite common in China: they will “custom build”your “brand name” premium tube, but they own the tech behind, so they have the rights to build a similar tube under their own brand...and they will surely do it. As an example, the famed Penta Labs KT88 was produced by Shuguang, also as their own GEKT88...a true copy of the GEC beam tetrode, and some experts (as JAC Music in Germany) say that the Russian GLKT88s, (while sounding great) are not true “KT” tetrodes as the originals, but this is another discussion. I found this new tube to be exactly the same as the Sophias (save for bulb shape) and reviews are just glowing ones:



Well, we are all “music fanatics” and love “super tubes” don’t we ? Those premium tubes are expensive at around $85 each (plus shipping) from China, (and I needed a quad) but found an U.S. seller involved on the “Black Friday” madness, so we arranged a sweet deal ! Let’s see what happens...I certainly will try the quad in Euforia, first...

Hi J...those Chinese 'super' tubes certainly do look the business...especially that lovely looking blue Sophia Princess! But at those prices, I'm afraid I'll pass on them given the magnificent sound that's coming from my 3x Russian GL KT88/ 1x KT66 (at the moment!) setup lol .

And as for different folks' opinions on all these different iterations of the KT88, I'm afraid it would seem that as usual, one needs to take many of them with a very large pinch of salt indeed! For example, I've read very unfavourable experiences with Penta Labs tubes, and even sometimes questioning re. the value for money of the Sophia Princesses...???. As for the Russian Genalex reissues, I personally like their use of gold signal grid wire; carbonised screen grids and triple alloy coated anodes!! . But I'm certainly looking forward to how you find the Shu WEKT88s in your Euforia, J...(sure wish you had the Empyreans though lol ).

 

[hypnos1]

Now then guys, I've simply got to make another addendum to my previous notes on the use of even just 1x KT88 as driver partner to a KT66, both driving KT88 powers.

And this is because of something that has struck me more ever since hearing Phil Collins's voice once again in Genesis' 'Duke' album...ie. a new appreciation of the myriad different ways the letter 's' can sound when sung. Throughout Duke, Collins especially has a range of 's' pronunciation to rival any, short of the full 'th' lisp lol!! ...from z/sz; sh; ssch, thru ss to almost sibilant ssss! These differences were never quite so noticeable before the KT88 driver was in situ....now I look for such things in all my recordings!! .
OK, so this is bordering on (or even full blown!) obsessive/compulsive behaviour, but what it highlights is this KT88 tube's mastery of clarity; detail retrieval; accuracy; precision and delicious presentation within a 3 dimensional stage...the exact level depending on the resolving ability of the rest of one's system, especially DAC and headphones of course. What is also clear though is that with the wrong partnering gear, these 88s could begin to sound rather 'clinical', approaching an extremely good SS amp...they cut through the music like a surgeon's scalpel and take no prisoners lol!

That they don't seem to 'colour' the delivery to any great degree some may not fully appreciate, but for me at least a more accurate presentation is no bad thing...now I've heard this more 'pure' sound from my own setup, I've no desire whatsoever for any more 'warmth' (ie. distortion!!). But having said that, I'm still getting a certain 'magic' that comes from an all tube (OTL) design, as opposed to the use of an output transformer (unless, perhaps an extremely good - and accordingly expensive! - one!!)...CHEERS!...CJ

ps. To round off our journey into alternative amps, may I just say I firmly I believe we've no need to stray from F-A's offerings anyway, given how they are (miraculously!) able to make these KT tubes shine so brightly. Put the money instead towards an upgraded DAC, if necessary, and certainly towards a pair of Meze Empyrean headphones...it's as though they were made just for this Euforia setup lol!! ...

 

[connieflyer]

Hello CJ, my other pair of 88Will be here tomorrow and really looking forward to it. One thing that was very clear, to me,I use the Sennheizer 800 headphone, and with the KT series of tubes the bass line has increased and the warmth of the presentation has also increased. Yet no longer sounds clinical or harsh in any way shape or form. I am quite happy with the results.

 

[mordy]

Just a little something to get you moving this morning, the genius of this playing looks almost like a video game, talent is not something I possess after looking at this, I am going to avoid going near a piano top 10most difficult piano pieces

Hi cf,
Let's throw in an American hard to play piano piece - The Fingerbreaker:

 

[hypnos1]

Hello CJ, my other pair of 88Will be here tomorrow and really looking forward to it. One thing that was very clear, to me,I use the Sun heizer 800 headphone, and with the KT series of tubes the bass line has increased and the warmth of the presentation has also increased. Yet no longer sounds clinical or harsh in any way shape or form. I am quite happy with the results.

Hey cf...that means you'll have a KT88 quartet even before I do...not allowed lol! However, as your Senns are obviously liking these KTs as much as my Empys do, I look forward to hearing how they respond to the 2x 88s as drivers and your own findings. Hopefully my fourth 88 will arrive on Tues. and can't wait, given what just one as driver is doing for me at least! ...CJ

 

[connieflyer]

I'm going to try just 1 88 as a driver with 1 66 as a driver just took see what the difference will be once a pair is in place , of course if you like I can wait until Wednesday so you will have your quad in place before me! After all I defer to the king!

 

[hypnos1]

I'm going to try just 1 88 as a driver with 1 66 as a driver just took see what the difference will be once a pair is in place , of course if you like I can wait until Wednesday so you will have your quad in place before me! After all I defer to the king!

Heck no, cf...get those babies in without delay lol! I'm as curious as you to see how they fare in your own setup ...

 

[connieflyer]

I hear and obey!

 

[connieflyer]

Tubes arrived, installed both KT88's . Big benefit for buying tubes with 72 hour burn in, is don't have to wait to hear tubes settling in. Initial views, sound stage is larger, instrument placement more defined. Clarity of music about the same, perhaps a little better, volume knob increased more per less power. Big deal, now, like CJ was saying, hearing things that were not apparent in musical scores. Bass is about the same, but mid's and high's are better, especially mid's. More accentuated, sound stage more defined and vocals much better. Did not think there would be this much difference, but glad I made the investment. Have not received the new adapters from C J yet, so there may be a little more to come. I have now stopped looking at new headphone amps. This is it for me. No need to look any further, would have to spend a lot more money to get anything better, if possible.

 

[hypnos1]

Tubes arrived, installed both KT88's . Big benefit for buying tubes with 72 hour burn in, is don't have to wait to hear tubes settling in. Initial views, sound stage is larger, instrument placement more defined. Clarity of music about the same, perhaps a little better, volume knob increased more per less power. Big deal, now, like CJ was saying, hearing things that were not apparent in musical scores. Bass is about the same, but mid's and high's are better, especially mid's. More accentuated, sound stage more defined and vocals much better. Did not think there would be this much difference, but glad I made the investment. Have not received the new adapters from C J yet, so there may be a little more to come. I have now stopped looking at new headphone amps. This is it for me. No need to look any further, would have to spend a lot more money to get anything better, if possible.

Hi cf...glad those beauties arrived safe and sound. And that extra burn in period sure is a bonus for initial impressions lol! But I can assure you all those points you mentioned - and more - will continue to improve over the coming days...(these giant plates/anodes need plenty of time to mature, especially when only just ticking over in our amps ).

Glad also you don't regret the extra investment, and are enjoying the 88's qualities as drivers, not just powers lol. Interesting you also notice the improved vocals, knowing how you have a keen ear for exceptionally trained singers as opposed to so many modern so-called singers (a statement for which I make no apology!! ). What struck me especially today was how much clearer vocal pronunciation sounds...both with solo and multiple/backing voices...nice......

Looking forward to how things develop with further burn in...CHEERS...CJ

 

[connieflyer]

Listening to Clannad and Loreena McKennit were a real treat. Blackmores Nights were really eerie. So much material that was there, that I did not hear before. Have put on Duex Ex Human Revolution just now and the sound effects are surreal. The biggest change for me on the sound stage, was before you would have right and left and the top of your head,but with this quad of KT88's, it is more of an arc from ear to ear, instrument placement is much more precise.

 

[Johnnysound]

*

 

[hypnos1]

Listening to Clannad and Loreena McKennit were a real treat. Blackmores Nights were really eerie. So much material that was there, that I did not hear before. Have put on Duex Ex Human Revolution just now and the sound effects are surreal. The biggest change for me on the sound stage, was before you would have right and left and the top of your head,but with this quad of KT88's, it is more of an arc from ear to ear, instrument placement is much more precise.

Aha cf...you now have me chafing at the bit even more, waiting for my fourth KT88 to arrive...(it better had today, or else lol!! ). Especially given how good just the one as driver partner to a 66 sounds . It's uncanny how alike our systems are in responding to different tubes...I can only hope that others experience results that match or at least come close to ours - these truly are wonderful tubes. And that soundstage is unlike any I've ever heard before - Andreas Wollenveider's 'Caverna Magica' has to be heard to be believed with these tubes!

ps. Hopefully my Neotech UP-OCC wire-clad adapters might just bring out a little more...I only wish I could manage to make them on a larger scale for folks ...CJ

Edit...RATS!!!...Royal Mail have just told me my KT88 won't be here 'til tomorrow...not a happy bunny lol!! ...Ah well, will try to grin and bear it...

 

[hypnos1]

Hi CJ...please note that I am NOT criticizing the GLs in any way...those are great tubes and I know very well Russian “new production” tubes, having myself a good collection of “New Sensor” power tubes (from the same Saratov factory): 4 x Tung-Sol KT150s, 4 x EH EL34s, 4 x EH 6CA7s, 4 x GL KT77s, 2 x TS 5881As, not to mention pairs of TS 12AX7s and EH 12AT7s. As you can imagine, going for some premium Chinese tubes (instead of the proven Gold Lions) is like exploring new, unknown territory, taking the risks...and you my dear CJ, as “discoverer” of many great tubes know exactly what I mean...

Hi J...you do indeed have quite a collection there lol! And yes, as a fellow 'explorer', I do understand your desire to try different, and possibly even better tubes! Trouble is, of course, there are so many out there, and one can never really know just how they'll perform until tried in one's own system...and there's the rub - no guarantees alas!! I myself quite like the look also of those Shuguang 'Premium' Nature Sound 'T' internally coated, gold plated base KT88s. But by the time our Customs vampires - not to mention our shippers' 'handling charge' - hit, the price is more than I think worth it, given I doubt very much indeed whether their performance would be significantly better than the Gold Lions. And so, J, lucky you for being able to get a 'deal' on those WEKT88s!! However, you know it's those gorgeous looking blue Sophie Princess tubes you really want to try lol!

But whatever, good luck with those premium tubes, and HAPPY LISTENING!...CJ

 

[connieflyer]

Reviews on amazon on those tubes CJ were positive.
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Matched Quad Shuguang Kt88-t Premium Vacuum Tube Nature Sound High-end Gift Box
Matched Quad Shuguang Kt88-t Premium Vacuum Tube Nature Sound High-end Gift Box
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Add to Wish List at the price they were, $215 a pair not cheap, but they certainly have the look. Beautiful tube. By the way CJ, I got tracking from the post office, adapters will be delivered today. So keeping my fingers crossed.