[vc1187]

Every tube lover eventually gets drawn to the ZD at some point in time .

Jeb Listens
Your exceptionally detailed review almost got me to recently purchase a WA7 + WA7TP even though I already own the ZD, so I can't imagine how tempting for others your review will be on the ZD if you decide to get it.

 

[cladane]

Dear Jeb,
 
I can tell you that from my own experience the LCD-X pairs really really well with the Zana Deux. Since I own also an HD800, I think that your HD650 should be very well driven also.
With the HD800 no sibilance with this amp.
 
Consider that the Zana Deux sings better and better with time. More euphonic than Woo amps. No question.
 
About shipping, taxes, ecc I had a problem with USPS (package arriving with amp damaged I had to return to EC for repair). Spend more but choose UPS (250€). I also asked Craig to declare a lower amount (for customs.... 30% in France).
 
This amp is damned good. Then add a nice DAC.

 

[Jeb Listens]

vc1187 - thanks! I appreciate that !  the WA7 is wonderful and I really don't have a bad word to say about it  - which is why I think I might need to go to Zana Deux level to really step things up or at least offer a different experience
 
cladane - thank you for the information about shipping etc - I guess it's about what I would expect, and just something that needs to be budgeted for during the inevitable saving process of course!  Shame about the damage to your amp..but very glad you're all sorted now. 
 
I was initially not sure about the limited tube rolling options in the ZD, but now I'm thinking it might just be simpler and nice to be able to just roll driver tubes rather than looking for endless combinations....  Maybe time to stop the endless tube search  - and just enjoy the music!
 
Thanks guys
 
Jeb.

 

[cladane]

I was initially not sure about the limited tube rolling options in the ZD, but now I'm thinking it might just be simpler and nice to be able to just roll driver tubes rather than looking for endless combinations....  Maybe time to stop the endless tube search  - and just enjoy the music!

Agree. Exactly the ZD route. All music.

 

[atomicbob]

The Zana Deux with a yggdrasil and HD650/HD800/TH900 is my end point OTL for the foreseeable future. Sophia Electric and 1952 vintage Sylvania 6SL7 are the two I listen through most. As @cladane said, all music. However, I still enjoy listening to my BH Crack as well.

 

[Jeb Listens]

  The Zana Deux with a yggdrasil and HD650/HD800/TH900 is my end point OTL for the foreseeable future. Sophia Electric and 1952 vintage Sylvania 6SL7 are the two I listen through most. As @cladane said, all music. However, I still enjoy listening to my BH Crack as well.

 
 
Brilliant stuff.  I'm quite new to the HD-650s and they have totally surprised me by how excellent they are.  
 
Since a Zana audition would be difficult or impossible do you think you would be able to describe the sound of the Zana with the 650s compared to the BH-Crack -  I'm sure its technically a step-up in many ways , but would you describe it as warmer or brighter than the Crack ? or just totally different ?  Any comparisons would be great.
 
Thank you!
 
Jeb.

 

[atomicbob]

@Jeb Listens - I am not the best for flowery descriptions of audible attributes like others on the boards, but I will attempt an analogy.
 
Consider a family mini-van, an MGB and a Bugatti Veyron. All three will transport a person from point A to point B. Huge difference in the feel of that transport, the cost of ownership and maintenance between the three. Both sports cars are likely to provide a far more enjoyable drive over the mini-van. The Bugatti is capable of out performing the MGB in every way, though requires skill and good roads to do so. That doesn't stop the MGB from being a very fun ride.
 
When I want to be transported by the music as best as technically possible for my OTL preferences, I listen to the ygg->ZD->headphones. This is much like listening to a favorite group of musicians playing at a large venue performance hall with excellent acoustics. But then there are times I would like to go to the local pub (with excellent acoustics), have a beverage and forget about obsessing over every last acoustic detail. Enter the Mousai MSD192->BH Crack-> HD650/HD800. For a step up in that experience substitute a gungnir MB for the MSD192.
 
At this moment I am spending more time listening to the gumby->ZD than ygg->ZD. They are slightly different but the gumby should be scaring the bejeezus out of most DAC mfgs. It is a remarkable DAC, nearly so as the ygg.

 

[Jeb Listens]

@atomicbob 
 
Thanks so much for the analogy - that gives me a great impression of where they stand in your listening experiences!  And I'm right with you, whichever direction I go in, the Crack will always have a place in my home. 
 
GMB sounds great have been interested in that one or a DAC-19 or something along those lines.  
 
Thanks again for your thoughts, bob. 

 

[atomicbob]

  @atomicbob 
 
Thanks so much for the analogy - that gives me a great impression of where they stand in your listening experiences!  And I'm right with you, whichever direction I go in, the Crack will always have a place in my home. 
 
GMB sounds great have been interested in that one or a DAC-19 or something along those lines.  
 
Thanks again for your thoughts, bob. 

The BH Crack will also always have a place in my acoustic lab. It is such a remarkable OTL amp for not much money. And a very fun listen. If you can find a meet where you could audition the GMB it will be worth your time to do so. I have developed a hot transport system to keep my DACs powered on during transport to a meet. See this post for a bit of insight:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/780799/super-secret-seattle-meet-9-12-2015#post_11915794

 

[Jeb Listens]

Thanks Bob - I will look out for a local UK meet.  I missed CanJam in London, unfortunately.   The secret Seattle meet looks like a lot of fun - the Yggdrassil looks like a serious beast. 
 
Cheers!

 

[vc1187]

   
 
Brilliant stuff.  I'm quite new to the HD-650s and they have totally surprised me by how excellent they are.  
 
Since a Zana audition would be difficult or impossible do you think you would be able to describe the sound of the Zana with the 650s compared to the BH-Crack -  I'm sure its technically a step-up in many ways , but would you describe it as warmer or brighter than the Crack ? or just totally different ?  Any comparisons would be great.
 
Thank you!
 
Jeb.

 
I own both of these OTLs as well and based on my experience, here are the pros and cons of the sound of each when paired with the HD650.
 
Zana Deux (w/Sophia 6SL7 driver tube)
 
Pros:
- Very euphonic
- Really opens up the HD650 to where the last word you'd describe it as is 'veiled'
- Large soundstage with excellent depth
- Due to bullets 2 and 3, it gives the headphones a sense of grandness.
- Vocals are given a sense of spine tingling realism
 
Cons:
- Lacks impact in comparison to the BHC
- Micro detail is always present but is occasionally too soft or blends in to the rest of the music so that it's hard to hear
- Less forgiving (may or may not be a con)
- While vocals are great, they have the tendency to be very forward.  This can cause a slight bit of 'shouty-ness' for lack of a better word
 
Crack w/speedball (Stock tubes)
 
Pros:
- Great impact and PRAT (pace, rhythm, and timing)
- Extremely forgiving, aka nothing sounds bad
- Zero listening fatigue
 
Cons:
- Less realistic sounding when compared to the ZD
- Smaller soundstage and 3 Dimensionality when compared to the ZD
- Good, but not as good as the ZD for selections that require a more delicate presentation (classical, jazz, acoustic, female vocals, etc.)
 
To sum it up, I enjoy both of these extraordinary amps with the HD650.  The presentation is pretty different, but each has their own strengths and weaknesses.  Do I think the ZD is a step up in terms of technicalities?  Yes, without a doubt.  Do I think the ZD is a step up in terms of enjoyment?  Well, that really depends on the mood I am in at the time of listening.  Hope this helps.

 

[Jeb Listens]

@vc1187   Yes that does help - it's incredibly helpful in fact!  Especially since you are also using the 650s.   I've taken it all on board and am building a good sense of the ZD, though of course nothing will compare with a listen.. 
 
What you describe of the Crack rings true with me.  What an amp!  
 
Thanks!

 

[doyouknowSBmean]

Hey Guys. I tried LCDX and TH900 and finally chosen the TH900.
I really like the new TH900 with the 3 ohm output on the new Zana Deux Super.

 

[songmic]

It's been a long time since I've returned to this thread.
 
For those who feel tl;dr, the short version of my story is that I had owned the ZDSE but sold it, and now I'm getting the latest iteration of Zana Deux, the ZDS (Super).
 
A few years ago I had owned the Zana Deux SE. I had bought it to drive my then reference headphone Fostex TH900. At first I didn't understand why so many people would recommend an OTL tube amp--generally known to have a high output impedance--to drive a 25-ohm pair of cans. Then I learned that despite being OTL, the ZDSE has a lot output impedance of 3 ohms at lo-Z setting, and that its warm, euphonic sound signature with rich pronounced mids is an excellent match for a V-shaped sounding headphone like TH900. Indeed, it was the best amp I've heard with the TH900 to date.
 
However, my preference shifted from the euphonic, fun and somewhat colored sound of the TH900 to a more technically capable headphone like HD800. I guess my tastes have somewhat matured. At nay rate, after spending a lot of time listening to so-called TOTL headphones on TOTL setups, I consider the HD800 the single best headphone ever made, and this is not an understatement. When driven properly, and by properly I mean drawing out as much potential from these headphones as possible using a select few amps capable of doing so, the HD800 scales to unprecedented heights that neither the LCD-3, HE-6 or even SR-009 could reach. And it is because of this reason that I had to let go of my ZDSE.
 
A lot of people here have praised the ZDSE for HD800. At first I agreed, it was truly an eye-opening revelation. However, while the ZDSE is known for being the most euphonic sounding amp of the Eddie Current lineup, it ironically has the sharpest, in other words the most sibilant treble presentation of the bunch. The ZDSE remedied the HD800's otherwise cold, analytic sound signature while a touch of warmth, but it did little favor to smooth its inherent treble issues. Amps like DNA Stratus or ecp L-2 were some of the few amps that actually made the HD800 listenable fatigue-free without being overly warm as to compromise its imaging/resolution.
 
Then a couple months ago, I got to listen to Eddie Current's new--and their very first--solid state amp Black Widow. At less than $1,300, this amp floored me. It was the best SS amp I've ever heard with the HD800 (previously it had been Bakoon HPA-21, which costs $3K). I've always felt that a high-end tube amp brings the best out of HD800, but the BW was a clear exception and undoubtedly far superior to the ZDSE. It also made tamed the HD800's treble issue quite well, which is the first aspect of any amp I look at when considering the HD800. I felt I could live with this amp over the likes of Stratus or L-2.
 
So I decided to order one myself, when I found out that the ZD was updated to the Super version. Apparently, the ZDSE was updated to ZDS because the BW was already too good and surpassed the ZDSE in many areas, so they had to upgrade the ZDSE significantly to justify its twice-as-expensive price tag. And thus the ZDS was born. While I have yet to listen to the ZDS, people whose ears I trust have said that the ZDS is a huge upgrade over the ZDSE and, while being slightly less euphonic than the ZDSE, its treble has now become the smoothest of the Eddie Current lineup, more easy on the ears then the BW (which I found to excel in this regard) and surely far less fatiguing than the ZDSE. One famous guy whom I won't reveal used to openly hate the ZDSE with a passion, but now says he loves the ZDS and that it has become his default tube amp to recommend for HD800 owners.
 
And that's how I came back to the Zana Deux, albeit with a complete revamp.

 

[Afghan Vet]

Very cool write up - thanks for sharing your journey. I look forward to reading your conclusions once you receive the amp.