Eddie Current Zana Deux owners
Oct 29, 2015 at 7:05 PM Post #1,906 of 2,605
MB Gungnir and Yggdrasil are superb DACs which I don't think you can beat for the price with either.

You can use a SE to balanced transformer if you really want, but they cost around $300 or so, and may slightly improve on the SE sound. I personally just use the Gumby to feed the ZD unbalanced and it sounds very good.

I wouldn't recommend the original ZD with low impedance cans, but the ZDS would probably work better with the LCD's. From what I have heard, they crave current whereas high Z cans crave voltage.
 
Oct 29, 2015 at 8:27 PM Post #1,907 of 2,605
MB Gungnir and Yggdrasil are superb DACs which I don't think you can beat for the price with either.

You can use a SE to balanced transformer if you really want, but they cost around $300 or so, and may slightly improve on the SE sound. I personally just use the Gumby to feed the ZD unbalanced and it sounds very good.

I wouldn't recommend the original ZD with low impedance cans, but the ZDS would probably work better with the LCD's. From what I have heard, they crave current whereas high Z cans crave voltage.


Perfect! Thanks. I'd likely be buying new so I'd get the ZDS. Do you think the ZDs ability makes an Yggy worth the price premium or is "settling" for the Gumby an option that doesn't leave you wanting? If I went with the Gumby I'd likely get a set of HD800s as well since they're usually the combo that people rave about with the ZD. I think if someone has LCD-2 impressions this might wind up being the summit-fi amp for me.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 11:22 AM Post #1,908 of 2,605
 
MB Gungnir and Yggdrasil are superb DACs which I don't think you can beat for the price with either.

You can use a SE to balanced transformer if you really want, but they cost around $300 or so, and may slightly improve on the SE sound. I personally just use the Gumby to feed the ZD unbalanced and it sounds very good.

I wouldn't recommend the original ZD with low impedance cans, but the ZDS would probably work better with the LCD's. From what I have heard, they crave current whereas high Z cans crave voltage.


Perfect! Thanks. I'd likely be buying new so I'd get the ZDS. Do you think the ZDs ability makes an Yggy worth the price premium or is "settling" for the Gumby an option that doesn't leave you wanting? If I went with the Gumby I'd likely get a set of HD800s as well since they're usually the combo that people rave about with the ZD. I think if someone has LCD-2 impressions this might wind up being the summit-fi amp for me.

 
My ZDS just shipped, on its way in about a week or so.
 
My previous experience with ZDSE was that while it was great with the HD800, it wasn't mindblowing and I thought the HD600/650 were a better match with it. While the ZDS is said to be a better match for the HD800 than the ZDSE was, the HD600/650 is still considered the best match. That's why I won't be throwing away my HD650. If anything, I have a feeling the upcoming HD800S might be a better match with ZDS than the current HD800 is based on preliminary impressions.
 
I use a Yggy. Haven't heard the Gumby but I've read that the Gumby doesn't fall far behind and doesn't leave a lot to be desired. If so that is definitely the better value. Personally, I just want to settle with the best and not look back and hence my choice for Yggy.
 
I wouldn't concern over using either Yggy's or Gumby's SE outputs, since they are directly summed from the balanced outputs and are almost as good. You should know that EC's top-tier amps like Balancing Act do have balanced outputs that could be directly fed from Yggy's balanced outputs, but they too will be summed inside the amp to SE signal before amplification stage. It's just a matter of where this summing take place: inside the Yggy via transistors, or inside the amp via balanced input transformers. Some say the latter is better by a small margin, but if this difference bothers you with ZDS you can use that external $300-ish balanced to SE transformer mikoss mentioned. Doesn't really bother me, though.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 11:50 AM Post #1,909 of 2,605
   
My ZDS just shipped, on its way in about a week or so.
 

congrats on the ZDS 
beerchug.gif

many hours of musical entertainment await.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 12:19 PM Post #1,911 of 2,605
   
My ZDS just shipped, on its way in about a week or so.
 
My previous experience with ZDSE was that while it was great with the HD800, it wasn't mindblowing and I thought the HD600/650 were a better match with it. While the ZDS is said to be a better match for the HD800 than the ZDSE was, the HD600/650 is still considered the best match. That's why I won't be throwing away my HD650. If anything, I have a feeling the upcoming HD800S might be a better match with ZDS than the current HD800 is based on preliminary impressions.
 
I use a Yggy. Haven't heard the Gumby but I've read that the Gumby doesn't fall far behind and doesn't leave a lot to be desired. If so that is definitely the better value. Personally, I just want to settle with the best and not look back and hence my choice for Yggy.
 
I wouldn't concern over using either Yggy's or Gumby's SE outputs, since they are directly summed from the balanced outputs and are almost as good. You should know that EC's top-tier amps like Balancing Act do have balanced outputs that could be directly fed from Yggy's balanced outputs, but they too will be summed inside the amp to SE signal before amplification stage. It's just a matter of where this summing take place: inside the Yggy via transistors, or inside the amp via balanced input transformers. Some say the latter is better by a small margin, but if this difference bothers you with ZDS you can use that external $300-ish balanced to SE transformer mikoss mentioned. Doesn't really bother me, though.


Hey @songmic. I wonder if you can compare what you think of the ZDS/ZDSE to your memories of ECP L-2. I'd love to hear what you think and like/dislike about the amps.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 12:32 PM Post #1,912 of 2,605
 
   
My ZDS just shipped, on its way in about a week or so.
 
My previous experience with ZDSE was that while it was great with the HD800, it wasn't mindblowing and I thought the HD600/650 were a better match with it. While the ZDS is said to be a better match for the HD800 than the ZDSE was, the HD600/650 is still considered the best match. That's why I won't be throwing away my HD650. If anything, I have a feeling the upcoming HD800S might be a better match with ZDS than the current HD800 is based on preliminary impressions.
 
I use a Yggy. Haven't heard the Gumby but I've read that the Gumby doesn't fall far behind and doesn't leave a lot to be desired. If so that is definitely the better value. Personally, I just want to settle with the best and not look back and hence my choice for Yggy.
 
I wouldn't concern over using either Yggy's or Gumby's SE outputs, since they are directly summed from the balanced outputs and are almost as good. You should know that EC's top-tier amps like Balancing Act do have balanced outputs that could be directly fed from Yggy's balanced outputs, but they too will be summed inside the amp to SE signal before amplification stage. It's just a matter of where this summing take place: inside the Yggy via transistors, or inside the amp via balanced input transformers. Some say the latter is better by a small margin, but if this difference bothers you with ZDS you can use that external $300-ish balanced to SE transformer mikoss mentioned. Doesn't really bother me, though.


Hey @songmic. I wonder if you can compare what you think of the ZDS/ZDSE to your memories of ECP L-2. I'd love to hear what you think and like/dislike about the amps.

 
The ecp L-2 was much better than the ZDSE at driving the HD800, it is in fact the best single-ended headphone amp for the HD800 I've heard to date. However, EC's new Black Widow prototype amp I got to audition side was also very good at driving the HD800, I'd say the best SS amp that I've auditioned and undoubtedly better than the previous ZDSE. That is why the ZDSE got an upgrade, you can't really have a product that costs only half as much but sounds better. According to their MOT, the ZDS is supposedly better sounding than the BW.
 
To summarize (syngergy/performance with HD800) :
 
ZDSE < L-2
ZDSE < BW < (ZDS)
 
As a disclaimer, the BW < (ZDS) isn't my impression but what the MOT claimed.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 12:35 PM Post #1,913 of 2,605
IMO the ZDS wipes the floor with the BW. Both were present at the San Francisco Can-Jam meet (as well as the Studio) and I didn't think the BW was in the same league as ZDS.
 
In fact, I'm not much of a BW fan at all (which I realize isn't a popular opinion).
 
I really enjoyed the ZDS and I'll be looking forward to more impression on it from you once you've had a chance to properly evaluate it.
 
Oct 30, 2015 at 1:29 PM Post #1,914 of 2,605
  IMO the ZDS wipes the floor with the BW. Both were present at the San Francisco Can-Jam meet (as well as the Studio) and I didn't think the BW was in the same league as ZDS.
 
In fact, I'm not much of a BW fan at all (which I realize isn't a popular opinion).
 
I really enjoyed the ZDS and I'll be looking forward to more impression on it from you once you've had a chance to properly evaluate it.

 
Really, that means that the ZDS is indeed a significant upgrade from ZDSE, since I greatly preferred the BW to ZDSE. It's gonna feel strange, having the same looking amp (albeit twice as tall capacitors) but sounding completely different from what I remember 2 years ago.
 
I have a feeling the either the EC Studio/Studio Jr or DNA's upcoming Solaris/Silver Solaris driving HD800S would end up becoming my end-game amp. But until then, I hope the ZDS keeps me entertained enough.
 
Nov 8, 2015 at 8:32 PM Post #1,917 of 2,605
  Assuming what you have got a ZDS instead ZDSE, could you post some impressions soon, especially in comparison with other amps you have heard? How long did you have to wait from placing order to delivery?
 
Congratulations!

 
It took me roughly 6 weeks from placing order to delivery.
 
Yes, I received a ZDS. You can tell a ZDS from a ZDSE easily by checking the height of the two black capacitors (between the two 6C33C tubes). The ZDS's caps are nearly twice as tall as those of the ZDSE.
 
That being said, I think it's a little too early to post impressions as I'm burning in the unit, but here goes. Keep in mind that I also used to own the ZDSE, and while I don't have it now for direct A/B, I've lived with it long enough to know its sound sig and especially how it sounds with HD650/800.
 
Compared to the ZDSE, the ZDS definitely has a smoother, less fatiguing treble which becomes evident when using the HD800. The ZDSE was arguably the most euphonic sounding amp of the EC lineup but ironically it presented the sharpest treble. I still cringed a bit with the ZDSE/HD800 on certain recordings. While the ZDS doesn't entirely take away the sibilance associated with HD800, it does a better job than the ZDSE did.
 
Also, the ZDS is less euphonic than the ZDSE by comparison. I do enjoy a touch of warmth and euphony to my music but with the ZDSE I felt that it was a bit too much occasionally. While the ZDS still remains an euphonic, warm-sounding amp, not as much as the ZDS was. This could be a good thing or a bad thing depending on your musical tastes. Personally, with the HD650 I think it's definitely a good thing as the HD650 is already a bit warm/dark, and pairing with the ZDSE could result in an overly constipated sound.
 
As for the HD800 which is bright, people's opinions might differ, but do note what I said above: the ZDS may sound less warm and euphonic than the ZDSE but it actually presents a smoother, less fatiguing treble. Taking this into consideration, I feel the ZDS is actually a much better match with the HD800 as it tames its otherwise cringeworthy treble without compromising its ultra imaging/resolution/detail retrieval qualities with euphony galore.
 
And overall, the ZDS has a noticeably increased transparency/resolution compared to the ZDSE across the board. This might be attributable in part to what I said earlier about the ZDS being less euphonic, but nevertheless it is a significant improvement.
 
To sum things up, I don't regret selling the ZDSE and if I had known the ZDS was this much better for only $100 more I would've sold it and upgraded to ZDS without hesitation. The improvement from ZDSE to ZDS definitely isn't minor like what one would expect from HD600 to HD650, rather it feels like it's in one league above its predecessor, for instance going from HD650 to HD800. I would've guessed an amp sounding this good would cost over $3K, so it's definitely a great value buy for me.
 
Please take what I'm saying above with a grain of salt or two, since I haven't actually compared them directly and am using different DAC's (I had used Metrum Hex for ZDSE, currently I'm using Schiit Yggy for ZDS).
 
Nov 8, 2015 at 8:36 PM Post #1,918 of 2,605
It really is a ZDSE. Bought it used through a middle man, so I don't even know how old it is - just that it looks nearly spotless and that the previous owner didn't use it much. I don't even know how old it is.
 
Not that I'd be able to give any useful impressions yet anyway. It feels... "just right" for lack of better words. It's in control and effortless, with a tiny touch of that sweet single ended class A magic that my ears just love.
 
Nov 8, 2015 at 9:04 PM Post #1,919 of 2,605
  <edit)>
Compared to the ZDSE, the ZDS definitely has a smoother, less fatiguing treble which becomes evident when using the HD800. The ZDSE was arguably the most euphonic sounding amp of the EC lineup but ironically it presented the sharpest treble. I still cringed a bit with the ZDSE/HD800 on certain recordings. While the ZDS doesn't entirely take away the sibilance associated with HD800, it does a better job than the ZDSE did.
 
<edit>
Also, the ZDS is less euphonic than the ZDSE by comparison. I do enjoy a touch of warmth and euphony to my music but with the ZDSE I felt that it was a bit too much occasionally. While the ZDS still remains an euphonic, warm-sounding amp, not as much as the ZDS was. This could be a good thing or a bad thing depending on your musical tastes. Personally, with the HD650 I think it's definitely a good thing as the HD650 is already a bit warm/dark, and pairing with the ZDSE could result in an overly constipated sound.
 
<edit>
Please take what I'm saying above with a grain of salt or two, since I haven't actually compared them directly and am using different DAC's (I had used Metrum Hex for ZDSE, currently I'm using Schiit Yggy for ZDS).

Several key points:
1. which 6SL7 did you use with the ZDSE? That can have an effect on the ZDSE sound signature
2. which 6SL7 are you using with the ZDS?
3. Yggdrasil has a considerably different sound signature than the Metrum Hex which also may have contributed to system overall presentation 
 
I was able to hear the ZDS briefly under meet conditions (too noisy and distracted, not the same DAC) so I wish I could hear it again in comparison with my ZDSE. However, the ZDSE wtih a Sophia Electric 6SL7 and A/B/C listening with Yggdrasil, Gungnir MB and Vega on inputs 1, 2 and 3, only the Vega gives a little edginess. The GuMB is the DAC to which I spend most of my time listening these days. I tend to alternate between the Sophia 6SL7 and a Philips 1952.
 
Nov 8, 2015 at 9:07 PM Post #1,920 of 2,605
@jzono1: Thanks for sharing your impressions on the ZDSE.
 
@songmic
  
    Thanks for posting some detailed impressions. It sounds the ZDS is high-performance mid-hi amp with a sound signature matching well both HD650 and HD800. Hope you can add more details of your evaluation. One aspect I want to learn more is about precise imaging. Currently I use two vintage receivers to drive my phone through speaker taps. While they offer enough power and good tonality. I feel the imaging is not as good as today's best amps (like Taurus II I listened to at a couple of meetings). For me, "vivid" imaging is a must for truly hi-fi sound. I want to make sure I get very good imaging on my next amp to purchase. 
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top