[sampson_smith]

I have enjoyed the D10 with the D2000. They seem to be a good pairing. As far the D2000s use with the Pico Slim goes, has anyone even got one yet? It would be pretty hard to guess whether or not these would work well together based on this. You may want to search and see if the original Pico works well with the Denons to get at least a decent idea.

 

[klekk]

I have now been using hiflights topkit for the ibasso d10 almost a week and am ready to spread my initial thoughts. The d10 topkit consists of one LR Module TLH2141 opamp and a pair of EL8201s for buffers.

To start of I have little to no experience in op amp rolling. I have only tried the standard opamp and buffers that came with the D10 and now hiflights kit.

My initial experience is that the bass has been tightened, much so. For those having problems with a too bloaty and bassy d5000 this kit is to be recommended. Combined with the J$ pads I feel the d5000 are a completely different pair of headphones. It seems to me that the ibasso have become more sensitive to how much bass each record has been recorded with. For instance. when listening to Hercules and love affair with Blind there was much more bass when initially listening without the top kit, but when changed to the top kit there was noticeable less bass, but more controlled. When listening to Booka Shade - dusty boots the bass became much deeper and controlled with the topkit. Without the top kit the bass here is quieter and more bloaty.

The second thing i noticed when A/B ing was the opening of the soundstage. I listened to The Temper Trap with Sweet Disposition. There is "much" more room separating the instruments, which to me softens the sound signature and make them very comfortably listening to. This difference shines even more on my IE8 which benefitted more from the topkit, soundstage wise.

I have felt an overall improvement with the topkit and probably wont try amp rolling much more. I do not have all that much experience with headphones as the d5000 are my first "hi end" headphones. So these are the thoughts of an "ordinary" listener.

 

[darkhoek]

Hi,

I have modded a pair of D5000s according to Markl's decription, and I am absolutely delighted about the sound in them. I use them with a SOHA II SE head amp with Mundorf SIO coupling caps and Tesla E88CC Gold pin tubes, and the sound is out of this world. This combo gives the Stax a very good run for its money in the mids and highs, but in the low end, the MD5000/SOHA II beats the Stax hands down. Only in the very high end of the frequency range, the electrostats gives things a little bit more air and space, but this is marginal.

Attachment 28147

 

[NapalmK]

Quote:

Originally Posted by klekk /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have now been using hiflights topkit for the ibasso d10 almost a week and am ready to spread my initial thoughts. The d10 topkit consists of one LR Module TLH2141 opamp and a pair of EL8201s for buffers. To start of I have little to no experience in op amp rolling. I have only tried the standard opamp and buffers that came with the D10 and now hiflights kit. My initial experience is that the bass has been tightened, much so. For those having problems with a too bloaty and bassy d5000 this kit is to be recommended. Combined with the J$ pads I feel the d5000 are a completely different pair of headphones. It seems to me that the ibasso have become more sensitive to how much bass each record has been recorded with. For instance. when listening to Hercules and love affair with Blind there was much more bass when initially listening without the top kit, but when changed to the top kit there was noticeable less bass, but more controlled. When listening to Booka Shade - dusty boots the bass became much deeper and controlled with the topkit. Without the top kit the bass here is quieter and more bloaty. The second thing i noticed when A/B ing was the opening of the soundstage. I listened to The Temper Trap with Sweet Disposition. There is "much" more room separating the instruments, which to me softens the sound signature and make them very comfortably listening to. This difference shines even more on my IE8 which benefitted more from the topkit, soundstage wise. I have felt an overall improvement with the topkit and probably wont try amp rolling much more. I do not have all that much experience with headphones as the d5000 are my first "hi end" headphones. So these are the thoughts of an "ordinary" listener.

This is very helpful. I've been considering the same setup. I just can't seem to bring myself to pay another $200 or so for an amp which would end up being greater than or equal to the money I just spent on my D2000's. I really wish I could hear the differences myself.
Sorry for the stupid question but on a scale of 1 to 10 how much difference does an amp make compared to the stock Denon's? I consider myself an "ordinary" listener too so this would be incredibly helpful.

 

[Audio Jester]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NapalmK /img/forum/go_quote.gif scale of 1 to 10 how much difference does an amp make compared to the stock Denon's?

8.5/10
Just gave my D2000s a run from my Sansa Fuse and the sound is quite hollow and lacks the "full" sound that my relatively cheap amp adds to them. I found that as I increased the volume on the Sansa that the sound became difficult for me to enjoy as the trebles increased but there was little increase in the mids and almost none in the bass. Do your Denons justice, get an amp.

 

[Ham Sandwich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NapalmK /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sorry for the stupid question but on a scale of 1 to 10 how much difference does an amp make compared to the stock Denon's? I consider myself an "ordinary" listener too so this would be incredibly helpful.

It's very hard to quantify something like that. Best way is to demonstrate and experience.

I see you've got a Zune. I've not listened to the Denon from a Zune. I've got an iPod Classic. For this I'll just assume the Zune drives the Denon similarly as my iPod.

Take the iPod sound as a baseline. It will drive the Denon to a reasonable volume level. It will have a lack of control of the bass (bass will not be as deep, strong, and detailed). Dynamics will be somewhat muted (not as much snap or punch or crispness). Soundstage will seem to come from closer near the ears.

Now go around to various home stereo components like full size CD player, receivers, etc. Try the Denon in each of them. You should be able to find one that drives the Denon better than the iPod. The Denon isn't that hard to amp so many home CD players and receivers actually can do OK. Listen to improvements in bass control, dynamics and soundstage. For soundstage the source of the sound may move to a virtual space that is just a little bit farther from the ears (less inside or right on the ears). Be careful about maintaining the same volume between the iPod and the gear you're testing, a slight volume difference can come across as the louder one being better.

Note the difference between the iPod/Zune and the home stereo component sound. That's a similar magnitude of sound quality improvement that you can get by using a proper amp compared to the home stereo component. The magnitude or type of difference that you'll hear comparing the iPod/Zune to the home stereo gear will be similar to the jump you get comparing the home stereo gear to a proper dedicated headphone amp. Roughly. To a degree. Some people hear the differences more clearly than others. Some people consider such a difference night and day while others consider it subtle.

 

[NapalmK]

Wow. Thanks for taking the time to write that. That really helps alot.

BB King's "Three O'Clock Blues" playing from my computer sounds smoother, more lively and natural. There seems to be less bass presence than on the Zune but it's higher quality, "clean", and crisp. Whereas the bass was the main point and drowned out some aspects of the song when listening on my Zune. The soundstage seems better from my computer, everything is a little further apart and not cramped together as with my Zune. Overall the sound seems more distinct, while on my Zune it seemed thrown together. It wasn't a night and day difference but I'd much rather listen to them on my computer than on my Zune. It's honestly difficult to describe. Even though, the differences didn't seem great (except for the bass), they were there. At least for me it's hard to imagine anything sounding better than this.

I have another quick question. Sorry, I'm new to this whole amp stuff.
I'm currently running them through my desktop speakers/sub (Boston Acoustics MM226) which seem to do much better than simply using the headphone jack. Straight from the computer I have to crank the volume to around 80-85% or so to get a good level of sound. While running through my speakers/sub I only have to turn the volume up to around 25%. I feel that this would act as somewhat of an amp but I can't be sure. Can my speakers/sub act as an amp? If they can would a dedicated amp still be beneficial?

 

[parskey]

Yeah Ham is right on the dot.

I was in the exact same position as you Napalm. I bought my d2000's and played them out of my computer which was great for a while but, I started to get sick of the lack of sq and the fact they sounded way better out of my zune. After a while I tried playing them out of a yamaha receiver using my zune as the source and was blown away by the difference, it was then I knew the phones would really benefit from a dac and amp. I wanted to get into it without spending a ton so I went for the uDac which I think is a wonderful way for getting into amps and dac's. I was thinking about getting the d10 but the fact of the matter is I dont take my d2000's out of the house and not because I dont want to its just that they are really cumbersome to take around with you.

I hope that helps in your decision and if your thinking about the d10 because of its small footprint the ld I+ and y2 are pretty small themselves.

 

[midoo1990]

An amp made a huge difference for my d5000,if you have seen any of my posts in the last pages I was very dissatisfied with the sound and I even put them for sale but then my wa6 arrived.the d5000 to my ears are harder to drive than hd650 and they sound horrible out of any portable source,the 300 ohms hd650 sound better through iPod than d5000.an amp is a must for the denons IMO.

 

[Nachkebia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by midoo1990 /img/forum/go_quote.gif An amp made a huge difference for my d5000,if you have seen any of my posts in the last pages I was very dissatisfied with the sound and I even put them for sale but then my wa6 arrived.the d5000 to my ears are harder to drive than hd650 and they sound horrible out of any portable source,the 300 ohms hd650 sound better through iPod than d5000.an amp is a must for the denons IMO.

Totally not agreed

how about proper dac?

 

[Necrolic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nachkebia /img/forum/go_quote.gif Totally not agreed how about proper dac?

I agree that a good DAC is much more important to Denons than a good amp, but a good amp REALLY benefits them as well.

They scale much better than the low impedance would have you believe.

 

[parskey]

I agree on the dac point going from the uDac to the y2 was a huge leap forward of course it was almost four times the cost but worth it in my opinion. Although I havent tried running it off of usb and a/b ing wall wart with optical versus usb power which is so incredibly dirty and infested with snake oil

.

 

[jcoops16]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcoops16 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Last night the stud that attach's the earcup to the headband on my d2000's sheared in two, so I need a new stud and nut. I have sent an email to denon asking if they supply them or if I can buy then from some where. Does anyone know if they provide this service or where I can get them from. Sorry if this has been answered before in this thread but I havent got the time to read through it at the moment.

Over a week has past since I emailed Denon UK with no reply so in the end I went with a nut and bolt, alittle trickier than I thought it would be but satisfied with the end result.

 

[parskey]

well that's upsetting that they didn't reply I haven't had to deal with customer service at all so I cant comment on them. Glad your satisfied with your fix though so you cant get back to enjoying the phones

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcoops16 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Over a week has past since I emailed Denon UK with no reply so in the end I went with a nut and bolt, alittle trickier than I thought it would be but satisfied with the end result.

 

[alenofx]

New appreciator here! And new member of this great community.

I own the D2000s from 2 month, and really love them!
Connected to the ultramatch pro DAC, sounds good.