[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif ms1. lifeless and boring IMO

Is it supposed to have a "neutral" sound or something like that?

 

[MaZa]

I dont know about lifeless, but soundstage is too small to be very realistic classical can. Otherwise it would fit to classical music sonically.

 

[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaZa /img/forum/go_quote.gif I dont know about lifeless, but soundstage is too small to be very realistic classical can. Otherwise it would fit to classical music sonically.

So what about the Audio Technica Ad700, ES7 or the Denon D1001?

 

[MaZa]

Havent heard them, but what I have read about AD700, it might make a good classical headphone.

 

[wae5]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif ms1. lifeless and boring IMO

...if you have the the wrong amps. With my music and amps it's a $99 wunderkind though it would never replace my HD600, SR325i and DT880.

 

[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wae5 /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...if you have the the wrong amps. With my music and amps it's a $99 wunderkind though it would never replace my HD600, SR325i and DT880.

Are amps needed? the MS1 is listed as a category 1 headphone on the guide thread. And I'm going to be plugging them into the computer's sound card, not a mini device.

 

[donunus]

The ms1 is a good can but the flat soundstage is a big minus for me. That is why they sound lifeless. But if I go on and on and compare them to the hd600s, listen to realism of cymbals on the hd600 for example then go back to ms1s.

They sound like plastic! We have fake cymbals

 

[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif The ms1 is a good can but the flat soundstage is a big minus for me. That is why they sound lifeless. But if I go on and on and compare them to the hd600s, listen to realism of cymbals on the hd600 for example then go back to ms1s. They sound like plastic! We have fake cymbals

What is "soundstage"? The glossary thread is too brief. Is it just clarity, or something to do with the positing of the sound sources?

 

[donunus]

there are detailed explanations for soundstage on this forum somewhere but for now, for the purpose of comparing the ms1 with cans like the hd600 for example... Soundstage is like the stage where all the musicians are playing on. With a Can like the hd600s, there is a space for every instrument playing around that stage which results in less congestion of the resulting sound. It sounds as if there is air around the instruments. On the ms1, Everyone seems to be playing their instruments on a flat plane without a 3d space around the sounds which is not a good thing for classical music with many real instruments playing all at the same time. For studio recordings like rock, soundstage is not as important because the acoustics on these recordings are usually artificially made anyway.

Besides the soundstage issue though, The ms1s are decent, semi-accurate sounding cans with good timbral qualities (like most grados) and are great for their price point. For me though, I still like hearing all the artificial reverb made in rock recordings hence even prefer senns for rock

 

[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif there are detailed explanations for soundstage on this forum somewhere but for now, for the purpose of comparing the ms1 with cans like the hd600 for example... Soundstage is like the stage where all the musicians are playing on. With a Can like the hd600s, there is a space for every instrument playing around that stage which results in less congestion of the resulting sound. It sounds as if there is air around the instruments. On the ms1, Everyone seems to be playing their instruments on a flat plane without a 3d space around the sounds which is not a good thing for classical music with many real instruments playing all at the same time. For studio recordings like rock, soundstage is not as important because the acoustics on these recordings are usually artificially made anyway. Besides the soundstage issue though, The ms1s are decent, semi-accurate sounding cans with good timbral qualities (like most grados) and are great for their price point. For me though, I still like hearing all the artificial reverb made in rock recordings hence even prefer senns for rock

So is sound stage "voice separation"?

 

[donunus]

soundstage is the believability that musicians are playing on a stage and not on a flat space. I'm not very good at explaining it more than that. There is also headstage. I think the headstage is how wide the soundstage is within your head. Not very sure but there is a very detailed thread on this somewhere in headfi.

Voice separation is just one aspect of the sound that contributes to a great soundstage

 

[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif soundstage is the believability that musicians are playing on a stage and not on a flat space. I'm not very good at explaining it more than that. There is also headstage. I think the headstage is how wide the soundstage is within your head. Not very sure but there is a very detailed thread on this somewhere in headfi. Voice separation is just one aspect of the sound that contributes to a great soundstage

Do you have a sub 150 headphone to recommend for classical music?

 

[scompton]

An easier to understand illustration of sound stage is just that the music sounds like it's coming from outside your head. With Grados, the music tends to sound like it's right in your head. Some people can place instruments with headphones that provide good sound stage, some can't. I'm in the second camp, but my favorite headphones all have good sound stage.

As for sub $150 headphones for classical. You might be able to get an AKG K501 for around that, maybe a little more. You may also be able to get a K400/K401/K500, but they're harder to find. You might also be able to find a Sennheiser HD580 for under $150. All of these need an amp. I use the headphone jack of a vintage speaker amp, which is more than adequate.

If you have a speaker amp, you might look for non Stax electrets, like Audio Technica ATH-7, ATH-8, AT-705, or AT-706, or Signet TK33 or TK44. If you go this way, make sure you buy a headphone an transformer box. You connect the transformer box to the speaker terminals and then plug the headphones into the box.

I know people recommend the current lineup of AT phones as well, but I've never heard them.

As the OP recently stated, the Yamaha HP-1/YH-1 sound very good with some very easy, reversible mods. They have very little sound stage and are hard to drive, but can usually be had for under $100. Head over to http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/ort...oundup-111193/ for more information.

 

[Goit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scompton /img/forum/go_quote.gif An easier to understand illustration of sound stage is just that the music sounds like it's coming from outside your head. With Grados, the music tends to sound like it's right in your head. Some people can place instruments with headphones that provide good sound stage, some can't. I'm in the second camp, but my favorite headphones all have good sound stage. As for sub $150 headphones for classical. You might be able to get an AKG K501 for around that, maybe a little more. You may also be able to get a K400/K401/K500, but they're harder to find. You might also be able to find a Sennheiser HD580 for under $150. All of these need an amp. I use the headphone jack of a vintage speaker amp, which is more than adequate. If you have a speaker amp, you might look for non Stax electrets, like Audio Technica ATH-7, ATH-8, AT-705, or AT-706, or Signet TK33 or TK44. If you go this way, make sure you buy a headphone an transformer box. You connect the transformer box to the speaker terminals and then plug the headphones into the box. I know people recommend the current lineup of AT phones as well, but I've never heard them. As the OP recently stated, the Yamaha HP-1/YH-1 sound very good with some very easy, reversible mods. They have very little sound stage and are hard to drive, but can usually be had for under $100. Head over to http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/ort...oundup-111193/ for more information.

I only buy new headphones. How is the audio technica AD700 or the A700? I have a pair of 15 dollar plantronics and I like it's sound. Does plantronics have a house color that I can compare to the models here?

Thanks.

 

[MaZa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goit /img/forum/go_quote.gif So is sound stage "voice separation"?

A headphone with good soundstage and headstage make a sort of small space around your head where the sounds are coming, and instruments are placed in different lengths and heights. A headphone with small soundstage/headstage plays everything in-your-face and has very little space around the instruments and very little area where the sounds are coming from.