[GeneralSensible]

Immensely helpful info about the "old" remote, and it explains why I couldn't access the menu in DAC mode. I don't remember seeing that info in the manual, but I might have missed it.

Not just the "old" remote. I actually own the new one. The commands are locked out in the DAVE. This has nothing to do with the remote control units.

 

[EVOLVIST]

Unfair comparison of the day? I've auditioning the Mojo. People say that the Mojo is 80% of the DAVE. More like 60%.

I'm not sure if that's an indictment on the Mojo or if the DAVE is just that good.

Of course a huge price difference.

 

[Beolab]

60% could be 10% in another mans world

The most huge diffrence is the lower noise floor that gives better separation and clarity who draws you further into the recording. Then it got better more detailed lower end, but i would not say 40% better, more like it is better in many aspects, if it where 40% better, then the DAVE should reconstruct a new song that was unrecognisable from the "original" played from a normal DAC.

 

[EVOLVIST]

60% could be 10% in another mans world

The most huge diffrence is the lower noise floor and that gives better separation and clarity who draws you further into the recording. Then it got better more detailed lower end, but i would not say 40% better, more like 20% and that is huge if 20% represent total silents of the information vs DAVE.

Yeah, I can dig it, but with the Mojo I thought it sounded very etched compared to the DAVE. But, I mean, isn't that usually the experience when one goes from one of the best in a category to something less?

 

[romaz]

Unfair comparison of the day? I've auditioning the Mojo. People say that the Mojo is 80% of the DAVE. More like 60%.

I'm not sure if that's an indictment on the Mojo or if the DAVE is just that good.

Of course a huge price difference.

 
DAVE's noise floor is identical to Mojo (-180dB) and both have no measurable noise floor modulation according to Rob and so this is not how DAVE is better than Mojo.  In this regard, both of these DACs are better than any non-Chord DAC currently in production.
 
DAVE has a better power supply with lower impedance than Mojo.  This results in better dynamic contrasts, bass, definition and all the other things that go along with a better power supply.  
 
DAVE also has lower distortion.  At RMAF, I witnessed Audio Precision measure both a Mojo and then a DAVE and this was very evident.  No DAC, according to AP, has ever measured as low as the DAVE.
 
Obviously, DAVE has many more TAPS = more detail.  This is simply a fact.  A system that cannot reveal much difference between the DAVE and other DACs, Mojo included, is simply not resolving enough (at least, that is what I am finding in my own system).  As I have upgraded my source, the power supply to my source, my cabling, my speakers/headphones, my amp, etc., the DAVE has scaled with all of my upgrades.  I don't believe I have yet tapped what the DAVE can do.  When Blu2, DAVINA and Chord's digital amps come out next year, the truer difference between DAVE and Mojo (and any other DAC), I think, will become very evident because only DAVE will be able to fully take advantage of these technologies.

 

[AndrewOld]

Since matching up Dave with the exceptionally fast, accurate and detailed ribbon tweeter of my Piega Coax I have been looking for a recording to showcase Dave's ability to cast a deep believable sound stage and have now found something which I believe does this Dac justice in this aspect of its impressive abilities. The recording took place in 1980 at Merton College Chapel Oxford and was performed by The Tallis Scholars under the direction of Peter Phillips. It is a Gimmel recording of 'Allegri Miserere'. The recording engineer Bob Auger must have gotten the phase of this recording bang on because it is spookilly believable (as a sound space) particularly when the near field choir go silent and the choir at the back of the chapel sings. You are left in no doubt that Dave really can reproduce authentic sound spaces. I have the 2005 mastering and, as I say, it is a real show stopper for Dave.

That was a famous recording, but it will have been analogue in 1980 .. the same choir re-recorded the same piece (actually two versions of the same piece) digitally in 2005 in the chapel of Merton College. It is a superb recording. You can download it in hi-res or cd quality here  http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/dc.asp?dc=D_CDGIM041 and the booklet here http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/notes/810412-B.pdf 

 

[Crgreen]

I heard the Tallis Scolars perform the Allegri in Chester Cafhedral, with the three vocal groups distributed accordingly. At the high C from the soprano, I thought I was levitating.

I also heard the Monteverdi Vespers there (including Emma Kirkby) with the setting sun glowing through the stained glass windows as the opening tocatta rang out. Another glorious performance. For sheer beauty of sound, I recommend the William Christie, Les Arts Florisants recording.

 

[EVOLVIST]

DAVE's noise floor is identical to Mojo (-180dB) and both have no measurable noise floor modulation according to Rob and so this is not how DAVE is better than Mojo.  In this regard, both of these DACs are better than any non-Chord DAC currently in production.

DAVE has a better power supply with lower impedance than Mojo.  This results in better dynamic contrasts, bass, definition and all the other things that go along with a better power supply.  

DAVE also has lower distortion.  At RMAF, I witnessed Audio Precision measure both a Mojo and then a DAVE and this was very evident.  No DAC, according to AP, has ever measured as low as the DAVE.

Obviously, DAVE has many more TAPS = more detail.  This is simply a fact.  A system that cannot reveal much difference between the DAVE and other DACs, Mojo included, is simply not resolving enough (at least, that is what I am finding in my own system).  As I have upgraded my source, the power supply to my source, my cabling, my speakers/headphones, my amp, etc., the DAVE has scaled with all of my upgrades.  I don't believe I have yet tapped what the DAVE can do.  When Blu2, DAVINA and Chord's digital amps come out next year, the truer difference between DAVE and Mojo (and any other DAC), I think, will become very evident because only DAVE will be able to fully take advantage of these technologies.

So you're saying that trading my DAVE for a Mojo was an ill-advised move?

 

[jlbrach]

I think the Hugo is the best portable option on the market today...I think the Mojo is 90% of the Hugo and i think they both obviously pale in comparison to the Dave but you can't take the Dave with you on a trip without a lot of effort and the Mojo costs 1/25th of the Dave so all in all I think it is a pretty solid option

 

[Jawed]

When I was comparing DAVE with TT yesterday:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/756029/chord-hugo-tt-high-end-dac-amp-impressions-thread/795#post_12988529

the biggest shock was how noisy DAVE makes TT sound. The measured numbers for both are "far below" what traditional arguments about the audibility of hi-fi measurements would imply. Yet there it was, lots more noise. Some of the noise really felt like the noise modulation that Rob talks about, e.g. rising and falling as a singer sung each word. I described it as a "river of noise lapping at the edges of their singing". For some reason this effect seemed strongest with vocals.

Curiously in some pieces of music, noise in the recording (relatively loud hiss or mains hum buzz) was magnified by TT in comparison with DAVE. Even when I turned DAVE up much louder, the noise in the recording remained relatively quieter versus the music.

Occasionally I also heard a sudden change in loudness of the music when extra instruments joined in, when listening with TT. This change in apparent loudness was completely absent with DAVE. It seemed simply like distortion, what we often describe as a recording having a congested feel.

I don't know what mechanisms in digital to analogue conversion are causing these "faults", WTA filtering, noise shaping or the sophistication of the output elements (20 in DAVE versus 4).

Obviously, by plugging headphones directly into TT and DAVE I'm exposing the comparison to the quality of headphone drive. I definitely noticed that TT "struggles" with HD 800 S somewhere in the region of -20dB on the volume control (obviously varies with the nature of the music), getting softer in the bass than DAVE.

Perhaps these "faults" I heard might just be due to running the TT straight into headphones, with TT being closer to its limit. (Directly driving headphones is the only way I listen, though.)

After all that, I really think the proof is in the listening. Mojo has a wide-ranging set of reasons for sounding worse than DAVE (no galvanic isolation in addition to what I've listed above). What I learnt from my comparison is that the family sound of these Chord DACs is very strong. They make thoroughly worthwhile music for the same basic reasons.

It might be better to simply say that the Chord DAC scale is completely different than any other DACs. Other DACs are on an orthogonal and irrelevant scale in my opinion. My phone (which I enjoy despite the fact it's basically crap) makes music seem as though it's in black and white, not the colour I get with my TT. I strongly suspect most DACs are, at best, sepia tinted. It seems entirely possible to me that most of the world is listening in black and white...

 

[analogmusic]

When I auditioned Dave vs TT, (and this is personall), the huge soundstage of the Dave, and spacious sound of the Dave was 3 Dimensional compared to the much flatter and congested (by comparison with Dave) soundstage of the TT. And I understand this is due to the much superior noise shaper of the Dave (-350 DB) compared to -200DB of Hugo TT
 
Also the musicality of Dave was much more "goosebump" inducing than TT, I guess that is the 256 FS WTA filter, the additional taps, and the 20 E DAC compared to the 4E in Hugo, TT and Mojo.
 
And I do agree about the noise, in isolation, Hugo, Mojo and TT sound very fine, well, that is until one hears Dave.
 
It is like Watching a Blu-ray (Dave) and then going back to DVD (Hugo TT)
 
Dave is much superior to Hugo TT to my ears (and this is personal opinion, YMMV)

 

[romaz]

So you're saying that trading my DAVE for a Mojo was an ill-advised move?

Did you really trade in your DAVE for a Mojo?  I suppose if I had to trade in my DAVE, the Mojo would be a good replacement.
 
I now also own a Mojo and I am enjoying it immensely and so I would never suggest to anyone that buying a Mojo is an ill-advised move but I don't personally find Mojo and DAVE that close in performance, at least not based on how my DAVE is presently set up and unfortunately, there is no way to set up my Mojo in the same way.  While I have a hard time assigning some percentage of just how much better DAVE is than Mojo, to my ears, it is better in enough important and meaningful ways that the price differential was well worthwhile.  Considering I came from a DAC that was 2x the price of DAVE, I guess I view DAVE's value differently than some. 

 

[x RELIC x]

Did you really trade in your DAVE for a Mojo?  I suppose if I had to trade in my DAVE, the Mojo would be a good replacement.

I now also own a Mojo and I am enjoying it immensely and so I would never suggest to anyone that buying a Mojo is an ill-advised move but I don't personally find Mojo and DAVE that close in performance, at least not based on how my DAVE is presently set up and unfortunately, there is no way to set up my Mojo in the same way.  While I have a hard time assigning some percentage of just how much better DAVE is than Mojo, to my ears, it is better in enough important and meaningful ways that the price differential was well worthwhile.  Considering I came from a DAC that was 2x the price of DAVE, I guess I view DAVE's value differently than some. 

I'm pretty sure it was sarcasm.

What I love about the Mojo is it plays withinin the house as the DAVE, especially compared to many of the alternative portable devices out there. The same DNA if you will. For the price the objective performance is out of this world with the Mojo. For the sound the musicality is definitely worth the price of admission.

 

[iDesign]

I'm pretty sure it was sarcasm.

What I love about the Mojo is it plays withinin the house as the DAVE, especially compared to many of the alternative portable devices out there. The same DNA if you will. For the price the objective performance is out of this world with the Mojo. For the sound the musicality is definitely worth the price of admission.

I agree. The Mojo, if optimized properly, in a desktop setup can sound very good. For critical listening I use the DAVE with the HD 800 S headphones but I have the most musical enjoyment using the Mojo with HD 650 headphones. In fact, most of my listening is done with the Mojo and often leads me to wonder if I really need more. My journey with headphones that has now crossed into the tens of thousands of dollars probably could have ended with the Mojo and HD 600-- anything more is excess. As I've said before, a Mojo TT (e.g. Mojo in a larger enclosure, dedicated power supply, galvanic isolation at $2000) seems like an obvious next step for Chord. 

 

[ubs28]

The Mojo in comparison to my Retina Macbook Pro sounds only less digital and is also tuned differently. The soundstage isn't even bigger.

I don't see how people can compare the Mojo to the Dave.