[adrianm]

Read the section on optical cables in post #3 of the Mojo thread, and check whether you are comparing apples with apples.

Well i kept testing and the impressions remain the same, the QED definitely sounds less "fuzzy" , with more depth and it's especially apparent on piano and guitar strings. Granted, the very loose fit on the m-scaler might have played a part, i still didn't like it on usb, especially due to the background noise and brighter sound, but that also remained on the Naim nd5 via coax.
Edit : retested with Agnes Obel's Piano Sessions off Philharmonics (Deluxe Edition) and there's still a stark difference on the way piano and strings sound.

 

[edwardsean]

If you like Marcus Miller, have you tried Victor Wooten?

I run across his name with Stanley Clarke, but never really dived into his stuff. Please recommend a track.

 

[iamoneagain]

The optical connections on the Dave and mscaler are kind weird. I couldn’t the 2 cables I had to snap into place like I could with the Hugo 2. I also couldn’t get them to output to 192k like I did with the Hugo 2. So think that was affecting the sound. But even with that being the case it still sounded better than the Mac mini usb output. That had no weight to it. Bass was much better with optical. I almost wrote off usb all together.

Wasn’t until tried the usb on MacBook Pro that realized usb could sound good, if not better than optical. At that point I was thinking of either buying a glass optical cable that snapped into place or a better usb streamer. I went with the streamer because the MacBook was old and dying.

Not sure if you have access to any hires files but would be good to see if 192k works on your optical cables. That’s the true test.

I actually just switched back to Tidal from Qobuz after realizing differences between the hires files and 44k were so minor with the mscaler in place. Qobuz still has missing albums and would rather have that larger section. Only issue is there’s at least 20-30 albums in my selection that are MQA only. On quick test MQA unfolded still sounds pretty good but less precise soundstage compared to the cd version thru mscaler/Dave.

 

[adrianm]

Not sure if you have access to any hires files but would be good to see if 192k works on your optical cables. That’s the true test.

They don't. I've tried. Not sure if it's Dave, the mobo drivers or the cable. FWIW this one doesn't output anything at 192 when i test with the windows tool, the cheap one just outputs some horrible static noise .

 

[adrianm]

Wasn’t until tried the usb on MacBook Pro that realized usb could sound good, if not better than optical. At that point I was thinking of either buying a glass optical cable that snapped into place or a better usb streamer. I went with the streamer because the MacBook was old and dying.

My macbook pro is a new one so no usb ports,just thunderbolt, i'm not sure if the adapter has any impact but i'll a/b again with the new optical cable. Still have to get a streamer in and i'm not sure if the Naim Nd5 xs2 is a good choice since it only has a bnc connection.
Out of Innuous, Auralic, Lumin and the popular choices does any one of them have a pc version of the app?

 

[iamoneagain]

They don't. I've tried. Not sure if it's Dave, the mobo drivers or the cable. FWIW this one doesn't output anything at 192 when i test with the windows tool, the cheap one just outputs some horrible static noise .

That sort of was the other reason I went for usb streamer. No issues with 192k files. And I couldn’t be sure new optical would actually fix the softness vs knowing better usb was showing real improvement.

I have no plans to play with expensive usb cables. Saw article on how basically the shorter, the better, so just ordered cheap short one from Amazon. Will get here today and see if I can hear any difference. With the Hugo 2 one of those $80 Cinnamon cables was brighter and worse than cheap $5 cable from Amazon.

 

[adrianm]

That sort of was the other reason I went for usb streamer. No issues with 192k files. And I couldn’t be sure new optical would actually fix the softness vs knowing better usb was showing real improvement.

I have no plans to play with expensive usb cables. Saw article on how basically the shorter, the better, so just ordered cheap short one from Amazon. Will get here today and see if I can hear any difference. With the Hugo 2 one of those $80 Cinnamon cables was brighter and worse than cheap $5 cable from Amazon.

Do you know if the BNC input is also reclocked to Dave's master clock? Aka also "jitter immune" , though i know some claim reclockers make a difference, and from what i'm seeing, they probably do. This new cable made crossfeed 3 just a focused and clear as 0 or 1,and improved depth by quite a bit, so clearly not jitter immune.
I'm trying to make a short list of what streamers to audition based on their inputs. Innuos isn't in the area and tbh i don't need/want storage or roon, so i'm looking for something with preferably a nice windows interface as well.
Though Tidal just announced Tidal Connect so it might be better to wait and see what streamers support it.

 

[miketlse]

They did, if you mean the plastic protectors. No, the end caps are stuck onto the end of the optical fibre, but they can become detached (see link). The plastic protectors are intended to help prevent the end caps (if they are present) becoming dirty, scratched, detached etc.

Erm, no, the old cable probably was, i've wiped the lens at both ends with a cloth (not sure what the proper way to do it is, i'll try alcohol too) and it does seem to sound better now. Alcohol is probably the best that you can realistically do, apart from grinding with presumably a very fine grit paper (plus a microscope to view the condition of the end cap)

The cheap one is 3m long and the new one is 2m long. Not excessively long - I have used a 10m long kabeldirect cable without any issues, but the best practice is always to avoid coiling the cable if possible.

The cheap one is secure but it doesn't take much for it to fall out, especially in the m-scaler i could never get it to click in, it just kind of hung in place and would fall if touched. Doesn't sound right, because to be fully secure, you should hear a click. May be the root cause of much of your dissatisfaction with the cheap cable.
The qed one locks in place very firmly.
Overall i still think the qed one sounds a bit clearer ,but the delta is smaller now. Not surprising that the QED sounds better
I use kabeldirect cables, but I have often thought about trying Lifatec cable (which is an Optical cable used in the medical and audio industry) https://www.lifatec.de/en/products.php

Hope this helps you experiment with obtaining better sound using optical cables, without needing to spend the earth.

 

[adrianm]

Hope this helps you experiment with obtaining better sound using optical cables, without needing to spend the earth.

Thanks, the cheap one is a Sonorous , and it's only 2 months old so it hasn't seen much moving around, but it has been coiled multiple times as apparently 3m was too long. It is plastic though so i'm not sure if there's an impact, maybe the light bending adding to the jitter while using it?
This is by far the biggest upgrade i've had well..since Dave, there is more a discernable depth to the music that wasn't there before and tonality has changed, it's so different i'm still getting accustomed to it.
This has me seriously considering a high end streamer as i'm sure there is more improvement to be had from even less jitter and the popular opinion is that usb is preferred to toslink.
Any recommendations? i'm curious what the delta is going from a Hifiberry to Aries G1 to a DCS Network Bridge.

 

[Triode User]

Any recommendations? i'm curious what the delta is going from a Hifiberry to Aries G1 to a DCS Network Bridge.

Unfortunately there is only one way for you to find out and that is to try in your own system. This is especially the case as you have not had an easy journey with the Mscaler. I have not heard the dCS but I have compared a few including the higher end Innuos and in my system they made a really worthwhile improvement with both solo Dave and Dave+Mscaler. There are many other makes though and it might take a few weeks of demos to home in on what you like and fundamentally whether you want to go with optical, usb or spdif. Some high end ones only do one.

 

[saudio7]

Aries G1 benefits from adding USB cleaning like iFi, only G2 has galvanic isolation, but still I think it is cheaper to add stuff to G1, didn‘t try G2.
Improvements when adding iGalvanic or micro iUSB 3.0 are small but easy to hear.

 

[MatW]

Aries G1 benefits from adding USB cleaning like iFi, only G2 has galvanic isolation, but still I think it is cheaper to add stuff to G1, didn‘t try G2.
Improvements when adding iGalvanic or micro iUSB 3.0 are small but easy to hear.

I only know the G2 but I'm very pleased with it. But cannot comment on how it compares.

 

[adrianm]

Aries G1 benefits from adding USB cleaning like iFi, only G2 has galvanic isolation, but still I think it is cheaper to add stuff to G1, didn‘t try G2.
Improvements when adding iGalvanic or micro iUSB 3.0 are small but easy to hear.

Since the G2 has galvanic isolation, as well as Dave, wouldn't that create a ground loop?

 

[adrianm]

here are many other makes though and it might take a few weeks of demos to home in on what you like and fundamentally whether you want to go with optical, usb or spdif. Some high end ones only do one.

Yeah i was considering getting the Naim nd5 xs2 (bnc and torroidal psu), Lumin u1 mini (everything and switching psu) and Arires G1 (usb and dual lpsu), i feel like Aries is the most streaming focused one. And something cheaper like a ProJect Stream Box S2 Ultra or Stack Audio Link 2 to get a feel for the differences. Or my dealer recommended 3d lab in france.
I was curious if SPDIF data also gets reclocked like usb *allegedly* LOL.

 

[miketlse]

Thanks, the cheap one is a Sonorous , and it's only 2 months old so it hasn't seen much moving around, but it has been coiled multiple times as apparently 3m was too long. It is plastic though so i'm not sure if there's an impact, maybe the light bending adding to the jitter while using it?
This is by far the biggest upgrade i've had well..since Dave, there is more a discernable depth to the music that wasn't there before and tonality has changed, it's so different i'm still getting accustomed to it.
This has me seriously considering a high end streamer as i'm sure there is more improvement to be had from even less jitter and the popular opinion is that usb is preferred to toslink.
Any recommendations? i'm curious what the delta is going from a Hifiberry to Aries G1 to a DCS Network Bridge.

Sorry, I don't have a high end streamer, so can't provide an authoritative answer.
You are already at my level - considering Allo or Tinkerboard based streamer.