Cayin N6ii, Unlimited Possibilities: a fully modularized smart DAP
Sep 24, 2020 at 2:50 PM Post #5,117 of 8,192
We have submitted the new firmware to Qualcomm already, waiting for an OTA timeslot, hopefully we can officially release the new firmware by tomorrow.

Thanks Andy for the update! Will give it a try when it is available.
 
Sep 24, 2020 at 11:13 PM Post #5,118 of 8,192
Announcement of Cayin N6ii firmware v2.2EN

aQZQauY.jpg


New Functions and System Optimization

1. Added data and user-interface to support the forthcoming Audio Motherboard;
2. Fixed PCM filter bug which the system automatically resets PCM filter when pause or skipped music during playback;
3. Adjusted audio settings, when playing MQA music files, automatically paired with MQA designated filter, the PCM filter options would be switched off;
4. Other bugs fixed and system optimization.

For more information including the procedures of updating to the new firmware, please visit our official website HERE,
or download the firmware directly through Google Drive HERE.
 
Last edited:
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
http://en.cayin.cn/
Sep 25, 2020 at 12:37 AM Post #5,119 of 8,192
Announcement of Cayin N6ii firmware v2.2EN

aQZQauY.jpg


New Functions and System Optimization

1. Added data and user-interface to support the forthcoming Audio Motherboard;
2. Fixed PCM filter bug which the system automatically resets PCM filter after pause or skipped music during playback;
3. Adjusted audio settings, when playing MQA music files, automatically paired with MQA designated filter, the PCM filter options would be switched off;
4. Other bugs fixed and system optimization.

For more information including the procedures of updating to the new firmware, please visit our official website HERE,
or download the firmware directly through Google Drive HERE.

Glad to report that everything works as it should. Now I can enjoy E02‘s sound again with Z1R :thumbsup:
 
Sep 25, 2020 at 12:55 AM Post #5,120 of 8,192
202009010644259709.jpg


Looks like in the E01 module, the 9038Pro is using OPA1662 for I/V conversion and OPA1612 for LPF. I have tried this exact combo in a different device. Sound should be on the neutral, slightly clinical and analytical side with great details and an open soundstage. Noise floor should be fairly low too
 
Sep 25, 2020 at 11:42 AM Post #5,121 of 8,192
I’m still enjoying E02, but it’s the skipping at the start of songs that I’m finding difficult to deal with.
Glad to report that everything works as it should. Now I can enjoy E02‘s sound again with Z1R :thumbsup:
@Andykong:
I would like to ask about the status of the "skipping issue" mentioned a lot here.

First, has it been fixed with the v2.2 firmware? If yes, and if it does work, then please disregard everything else in this post of mine.

Second, I would like to report what I see with firmware 1.22 EN. I did not install any v2.x firmware yet, since I read about its bugs. I am using the T01 module, and I am using three players, Cayin and HiBy Music Apps, Qobuz. I found a track (16/44.1, standard PCM/FLAC) where a piano chord is being struck right at the track's beginning. The track is sitting on my SD card in the N6ii (actually twice, transfered from my PC for use by Cayin/HiBy, and imported within Qobuz).

The behavior of all three players is identical or, to say the least, very similar - they all exhibit the obnoxious skipping:
  • When this track is being started autoatically in a normal gapless replay sequence from the previous track, all is fine; the chord is intact.
  • When I start replay with this track itself, i.e. when I hit "Play" on it from a paused or stopped state, the initial cord gets truncated. Something like half a second to one or two seconds of the music gets discarded.
  • I am experiencing issues with all three apps to move the time slider back to 0:00 on any track, it just happens to go to something like 0:02.
I do also have the Qobuz app on my iPhone under iOS. No problem whatsoever!

I admit that I did not research into this faulty behavior as much as some of my companions did previously. I just wanted to mention three things, (1) my use of the T01 module, and (2) all three apps, and (3) Qobuz app behaving properly on iOS. And I should say that I can't remember such faulty behavior with firmware versions around end of 2019; but I am not sure whether firmwares back then worked properly or whether I didn't observe the skipping faults.

Thanks a lot in advance for feedback on the "skipping" status. Again, please forgive me if it has been fixed, the firmware v2.2 announcement doesn't mention it specifically.
 
Last edited:
Sep 25, 2020 at 12:04 PM Post #5,122 of 8,192
@Andykong:
I would like to ask about the status of the "skipping issue" mentioned a lot here.

First, has it been fixed with the v2.2 firmware? If yes, and if it does work, then please disregard everything else in this post of mine.

Second, I would like to report what I see with firmware 1.22 EN. I did not install any v2.x firmware yet, since I read about its bugs. I am using the T01 module, and I am using three players, Cayin and HiBy Music Apps, Qobuz. I found a track (16/44.1, standard PCM/FLAC) where a piano chord is being struck right at the track's beginning. The track is sitting on my SD card in the N6ii (actually twice, transfered from my PC for use by Cayin/HiBy, and imported within Qobuz).

The behavior of all three players is identical or, to say the least, very similar - they all exhibit the obnoxious skipping:
  • When this track is being started autoatically in a normal gapless replay sequence from the previous track, all is fine; the chord is intact.
  • When I start replay with this track itself, i.e. when I hit "Play" on it from a paused or stopped state, the initial cord gets truncated. Something like half a second to one or two seconds of the music gets discarded.
  • I am experiencing issues with all three apps to move the time slider back to 0:00 on any track, it just happens to go to something like 0:02.
I do also have the Qobuz app on my iPhone under iOS. No problem whatsoever!

I admit that I did not research into this faulty behavior as much as some of my companions did previously. I just wanted to mention three things, (1) my use of the T01 module, and (2) all three apps, and (3) Qobuz app behaving properly on iOS. And I should say that I can't remember such faulty behavior with firmware versions around end of 2019; but I am not sure whether firmwares back then worked properly or whether I didn't observe the skipping faults.

Thanks a lot in advance for feedback on the "skipping" status. Again, please forgive me if it has been fixed, the firmware v2.2 announcement doesn't mention it specifically.
What you have put in your three bullet points is exactly what I have been describing (or trying to).

I updated this morning to v2.2en. The first track I went to after the update was ‘Here’s The Tender Coming‘ by The UnThanks. I use this track to test female vocals. It is also good for this purpose we are discussing though as the singing starts immediately so you can definitely tell what has been skipped. The title of the song also happens to be the first line sung. After the upgrade I pressed play on this and it went; ‘....he tender coming’, completely skipping the ‘Here’s’ and the first part of ‘the’. This was streaming straight from Tidal. I did try a few other track I use for this issue, just hitting play that is, and so far they seem fine. I’m worried that it still happened after the update with the first song I played though.

I am going to test offline download and songs on my SD card next.
 
Sep 25, 2020 at 12:07 PM Post #5,123 of 8,192
A02 Audio Motherboard, the last piece of puzzle to complete the N6ii platform

Cayin yesterday announced the fifth Audio Motherboard for N6ii. The well-received E01 and E02 Audio Motherboards have reinforced our rational on N6ii: pursue ultimate by focusing on one thing at a time. While a lot of DAPs try to support as many connectors/formats as possible, the E01 and E02 go the other way round by supporting only one headphone output on each Audio Motherboard. The A02 takes another big step forwards by not providing any headphone output at all. In other word, A02 won't drive your headphone or IEM. It offers shared line out and pre out (selectable by pull down menu) on both 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced connector. In other word, the A02 transform the N6ii into a high quality analog source for portable headphone amplifiers, active studio monitors, integrated amplifier or power amplifier of home audio system, but you cannot use it for headphone applications directly.

A02 Audio Motherboard 01.JPG

A02 offers two shared Pre/LO connectors (3.5mm and 4.4mm)

A Familiar Digital Audio platform

The A02 Audio Motherboard adopted the same DAC architecture with N8 using two AK4497 in Mono mode and we had used this DAC chipset in the first Audio Motherboard A01 as well. We are very familiar with this high quality DAC chipset in portable application. The sheer resolution and density of the analog output from this chipset is impressive and in our opinion, a perfect choice for the A02 purpose.

The decoding capability is basically the same as A01 Audio Motherboard. It will decode DSD upto DSD256 (1Bit/11.2MHz) and PCM upto 32Bit/384kHz.

Line Out and Pre Out

Cayin N6ii users should be familiar with the concept of Line out already. When we launch E02, the unamplified 4.4mm balanced line out is well discussed and received, a lot of users even acquired 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapter in order to achieve 3.5mm single-ended line out from E02. The good news is, with A02 Audio Motherboard, you can have both 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced line out without needing an adapter. Since headphone amplifier is completely absent in this Audio Motherboard, we have the luxury to install 3 line amplifiers (one for 3.5mm single-ended and two for 4.4mm balanced) and optimized for line out purpose, so rest assure these are very high quality line out among portable DAPs. As usual, we offered choices of output levels to Line Out so that users can always achieve best configuration with respect to the gain level of the connected amplifier. Users can specify High, Mid and Low from Line Out setting under Music Setup menu. The corresponding output level is document in the table below.

A02 Specification (Line Out).jpg


The other unique feature of A02 is Pre-amplifier output. We believe this is the first ever similar implementation among portable DAPs. Both output connectors on A02 are configurable into Line Out or Pre Out through pull down menu.

So what exactly is pre-amp output? How is it different from Line Out? In simple terms, Line Out is a fixed level output that is unaffected by the volume control. Pre-Amp output, on the other hand, is a variable level output that you can adjust through the volume control. In other word, you should connect the line level output to a variable gain audio device (i.e, with volume control) and connect the pre-amp output to a fixed gain audio device (e.g, power amplifier or power speakers)

In addition to volume control, the output level of these two options might also be varied. The Line output is, in many cases, a buffered output from DAC (and LPF) with little or no gain. Pre-Out varied significantly among different brands or different products line from the same brand. I have seen preamp with maximum output as low as 4V, and I have also seen preamp with maximum output as high as 20+V, and in this case, the maximum output of pre out from A02 is 8.2Vrms (4.4mm balanced) and 4.2Vrms (3.5mm single-ended) respectively. This is a relatively high output level for portable device and it should have enough gain (and flexibility in volume control) to mix and match with different power amplifier in home audio system. On the other hand, with a 4.4mm to dual XLR Balanced adapter, you can use the preamp output from A02 to drive active speakers such as ATC SCM19A (home audio System) or Dynaudio BM5 MK3 (desk-fi system)

To implement these features correctly, the pre-out from A02 has its dedicated line amplifiers (independent from line out). Again, we used 3 line amplifiers (one for 3.5mm single-ended and two for 4.4mm balanced) and they are optimized for pre-out specifically. Last but not least, we use a low noise and low distortion 4-channel resistance ladder electronic volume control from JRC instead of the digital volume of AK4497 in A02. This will ensure the pre-out can deliver stellar dynamic range even at low volume level.

A02 Specification (Pre Out).jpg


User Selectable LPF

Sine we don’t need to include headphone amplifier circuit in A02, we have room to explore some new options to increase the versatility of the Audio Motherboard. In this particular attempt, we have installed two distinctive set of LPF, the DSD LPF is 3rd order RC Filter and the PCM LPF is 2nd order RC Filter. The DSD LPF is a sharper High frequency filter when compare to the PCM LPF. We call this DSD LPF because it can tame the excessive high frequency noise for DSD material effectively before feeding the DAC output to the analogue circuit.

It is worth noticing that using DSD LPF for DSD material is not an absolute requirement, nor is using PCM LPF for PCM material. After you installed A02 to your N6ii, you can find three LPF settings available from pull-down menu: Auto, DSD and PCM. When you select Auto, the system will select the predefined filter according to the format of current playback. On the other hand, you can select DSD LPF or PCM LPF manually. By controlling the level of high frequently filtering, you can achieve your preferred sound signature. For the record, T01 Audio Motherboard employs 3rd orders LPF and A01, E01, E02 employ 2nd order LPF. So there is no such thing as 3rd order is better than 2nd order, or vice versa. It's a matter of optimization and since we happen to have ample space in this particular Audio Motherboard, we offer both so that you can make your own choice.

A02 Audio Motherboard PCBA.JPG

PCBA of A02 Audio Motherboard

N6ii A02 Functional Diagram.jpg

Functional Framework of A02 Audio Motherboard.

So N6ii with A02 is a DAP without headphone output. This is a bold move even for Cayin, we’ll never be able to do that with regular DAP products, the modular design N6ii is the only platform that allow us to try out innovations like this, nevertheless this is a niche market within the personal audio niche market, we do not expect a lot of N6ii users will need this, but we believe this is a good inclusion in N6ii Audio Motherboard family. When we launch N6ii, we adopted the slogan of “Unlimited Possibilities”, and we think the A02 just opened up a lot of possibilities to N6ii users.

In view of specialized features, the A02 aims at a very niche market and we'll only commit one production batch of 500 units. The suggested retail price of A02 is US$419 and available by mid-October 2020.

PS. Cayin will take a short break from 1-8 October for Chinese National Day and resume duty on 9th October 2020.

PPS. We do not have any Audio Motherboard in our development plan after A02, so unless a very innovative and feasible idea comes up down the road, this is it.
 
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
http://en.cayin.cn/
Sep 25, 2020 at 12:41 PM Post #5,126 of 8,192
А02 is not my cup of tea.

you mean, not your cup of vodka? :D j/k

As I mentioned before, I think A02 will be great to use with upcoming C9, or just in general with any amplifier that needs a clean LO input. Pre-Out will be useful with portable amplifiers that don't have a volume control so you don't have to connect them to headphone out (to avoid double-amping). Also, Pre-Out will be great for a high gain amplifiers like BX2 where you can't use many IEMs without attenuating down input pre-gain.
 
Sep 25, 2020 at 12:52 PM Post #5,128 of 8,192
Update on skipping

I’ve just tested offline Tidal downloads. There are some tracks I use because the singing begins immediately, thus it is easy to tell if there is an issue. These are:

‘Best of You’ by Foo Fighters
‘Help!’ By The Beatles
‘Suppers Ready’ by Genesis
‘Here’s The Tender Coming’ by The Unthanks
‘Carry on Wayward Son’ by Kansas

Every one of these skipped when I pressed on them to play.

I’ve just tested the SD card via Cayin music app and this seems to be ok, although I cannot say 100% yet as I want to load up some of the above songs to check.
 
Sep 25, 2020 at 2:42 PM Post #5,129 of 8,192
you mean, not your cup of vodka? :D j/k

As I mentioned before, I think A02 will be great to use with upcoming C9, or just in general with any amplifier that needs a clean LO input. Pre-Out will be useful with portable amplifiers that don't have a volume control so you don't have to connect them to headphone out (to avoid double-amping). Also, Pre-Out will be great for a high gain amplifiers like BX2 where you can't use many IEMs without attenuating down input pre-gain.
For all this cases I have CDM, and that is pairing well with N6ii, no need change motherboard when I connect to external dac/amp or want listening music on the way with iems only - that is the sound that is better than cup of vodka IMHO 🤣
 
Last edited:
Sep 25, 2020 at 5:59 PM Post #5,130 of 8,192
A02 Audio Motherboard, the last piece of puzzle to complete the N6ii platform

Cayin yesterday announced the fifth Audio Motherboard for N6ii. The well-received E01 and E02 Audio Motherboards have reinforced our rational on N6ii: pursue ultimate by focusing on one thing at a time. While a lot of DAPs try to support as many connectors/formats as possible, the E01 and E02 go the other way round by supporting only one headphone output on each Audio Motherboard. The A02 takes another big step forwards by not providing any headphone output at all. In other word, A02 won't drive your headphone or IEM. It offers shared line out and pre out (selectable by pull down menu) on both 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced connector. In other word, the A02 transform the N6ii into a high quality analog source for portable headphone amplifiers, active studio monitors, integrated amplifier or power amplifier of home audio system, but you cannot use it for headphone applications directly.

A02 Audio Motherboard 01.JPG
A02 offers two shared Pre/LO connectors (3.5mm and 4.4mm)

A Familiar Digital Audio platform

The A02 Audio Motherboard adopted the same DAC architecture with N8 using two AK4497 in Mono mode and we had used this DAC chipset in the first Audio Motherboard A01 as well. We are very familiar with this high quality DAC chipset in portable application. The sheer resolution and density of the analog output from this chipset is impressive and in our opinion, a perfect choice for the A02 purpose.

The decoding capability is basically the same as A01 Audio Motherboard. It will decode DSD upto DSD256 (1Bit/11.2MHz) and PCM upto 32Bit/384kHz.

Line Out and Pre Out

Cayin N6ii users should be familiar with the concept of Line out already. When we launch E02, the unamplified 4.4mm balanced line out is well discussed and received, a lot of users even acquired 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapter in order to achieve 3.5mm single-ended line out from E02. The good news is, with A02 Audio Motherboard, you can have both 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced line out without needing an adapter. Since headphone amplifier is completely absent in this Audio Motherboard, we have the luxury to install 3 line amplifiers (one for 3.5mm single-ended and two for 4.4mm balanced) and optimized for line out purpose, so rest assure these are very high quality line out among portable DAPs. As usual, we offered choices of output levels to Line Out so that users can always achieve best configuration with respect to the gain level of the connected amplifier. Users can specify High, Mid and Low from Line Out setting under Music Setup menu. The corresponding output level is document in the table below.

A02 Specification (Line Out).jpg

The other unique feature of A02 is Pre-amplifier output. We believe this is the first ever similar implementation among portable DAPs. Both output connectors on A02 are configurable into Line Out or Pre Out through pull down menu.

So what exactly is pre-amp output? How is it different from Line Out? In simple terms, Line Out is a fixed level output that is unaffected by the volume control. Pre-Amp output, on the other hand, is a variable level output that you can adjust through the volume control. In other word, you should connect the line level output to a variable gain audio device (i.e, with volume control) and connect the pre-amp output to a fixed gain audio device (e.g, power amplifier or power speakers)

In addition to volume control, the output level of these two options might also be varied. The Line output is, in many cases, a buffered output from DAC (and LPF) with little or no gain. Pre-Out varied significantly among different brands or different products line from the same brand. I have seen preamp with maximum output as low as 4V, and I have also seen preamp with maximum output as high as 20+V, and in this case, the maximum output of pre out from A02 is 8.2Vrms (4.4mm balanced) and 4.2Vrms (3.5mm single-ended) respectively. This is a relatively high output level for portable device and it should have enough gain (and flexibility in volume control) to mix and match with different power amplifier in home audio system. On the other hand, with a 4.4mm to dual XLR Balanced adapter, you can use the preamp output from A02 to drive active speakers such as ATC SCM19A (home audio System) or Dynaudio BM5 MK3 (desk-fi system)

To implement these features correctly, the pre-out from A02 has its dedicated line amplifiers (independent from line out). Again, we used 3 line amplifiers (one for 3.5mm single-ended and two for 4.4mm balanced) and they are optimized for pre-out specifically. Last but not least, we use a low noise and low distortion 4-channel resistance ladder electronic volume control from JRC instead of the digital volume of AK4497 in A02. This will ensure the pre-out can deliver stellar dynamic range even at low volume level.

A02 Specification (Pre Out).jpg

User Selectable LPF

Sine we don’t need to include headphone amplifier circuit in A02, we have room to explore some new options to increase the versatility of the Audio Motherboard. In this particular attempt, we have installed two distinctive set of LPF, the DSD LPF is 3rd order RC Filter and the PCM LPF is 2nd order RC Filter. The DSD LPF is a sharper High frequency filter when compare to the PCM LPF. We call this DSD LPF because it can tame the excessive high frequency noise for DSD material effectively before feeding the DAC output to the analogue circuit.

It is worth noticing that using DSD LPF for DSD material is not an absolute requirement, nor is using PCM LPF for PCM material. After you installed A02 to your N6ii, you can find three LPF settings available from pull-down menu: Auto, DSD and PCM. When you select Auto, the system will select the predefined filter according to the format of current playback. On the other hand, you can select DSD LPF or PCM LPF manually. By controlling the level of high frequently filtering, you can achieve your preferred sound signature. For the record, T01 Audio Motherboard employs 3rd orders LPF and A01, E01, E02 employ 2nd order LPF. So there is no such thing as 3rd order is better than 2nd order, or vice versa. It's a matter of optimization and since we happen to have ample space in this particular Audio Motherboard, we offer both so that you can make your own choice.

A02 Audio Motherboard PCBA.JPG
PCBA of A02 Audio Motherboard

N6ii A02 Functional Diagram.jpg
Functional Framework of A02 Audio Motherboard.

So N6ii with A02 is a DAP without headphone output. This is a bold move even for Cayin, we’ll never be able to do that with regular DAP products, the modular design N6ii is the only platform that allow us to try out innovations like this, nevertheless this is a niche market within the personal audio niche market, we do not expect a lot of N6ii users will need this, but we believe this is a good inclusion in N6ii Audio Motherboard family. When we launch N6ii, we adopted the slogan of “Unlimited Possibilities”, and we think the A02 just opened up a lot of possibilities to N6ii users.

In view of specialized features, the A02 aims at a very niche market and we'll only commit one production batch of 500 units. The suggested retail price of A02 is US$419 and available by mid-October 2020.

PS. Cayin will take a short break from 1-8 October for Chinese National Day and resume duty on 9th October 2020.

PPS. We do not have any Audio Motherboard in our development plan after A02, so unless a very innovative and feasible idea comes up down the road, this is it.

Looks like this will pair well with the upcoming C9 :relaxed:
 

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