[Andykong]

Charging Issue

I've had the player almost a week now and the first few days after the charge went down ( as low as 25%) I just plugged in and later when I returned all was well.( I did not pay attention to the charge time)
But twice now, when into the red zone (below 10%) the charge took 6 hours+.
I understand the charging should be around 2 hours.

I have several means to charge, one is an Anker multi device charger that delivers 2.1-2.4 amps to each device.
Several apple chargers delivering 2.1amps
Both set ups are working fine on all my devices.

I'm wondering if this will improve or is something amiss?

I can assure you that I have tested N3 charging time personally with the supplied cable, after several charging cycle, I can achieve from 10% to 90% (my regular charging cycle) in well below 2 hour.

This is the second recent report regarding slow charging, we didn't have this issue in the past, so we investigated the issue and find out that this is a firmware glitch in firmware v2.0, the charging current is lower then the published specification, causing a significantly longer charging time.

We shall rectify the problem and issue a new firmware as soon as possible, we are sorry for all inconvenience caused.

If you must get back to the original 2 hours charging performance, you can roll back N3 to previous firmware version before you charge the DAP, and the glass it back to v2.0 after you finish charging. Yes, this is not ideal, just a temporary solution for the needed.

Will come back to the forum as soon as I have the new firmware.

 

[riffrafff]

I've been charging my demo unit from my Laptop honestly,

I've been listening over the last few days, thus far I'm impressed with it's size and power! I'm comparing it Volume matched to my RockBoxed HM601, and I've found it's actually got a little more headroom than my 601, plus it's smaller. Volume control is also more precise on the N3 as opposed to the old analog wheel I've got on my 601.

For critical listening, I I've played Igor Levit — Goldberg Variations, BWV 988 - Aria with 30 Variations and So What by Miles Davis, each matched to a 74.2 dBs listening level.

The sound though... isn't as impressive as I'd hoped. I played with the different filters, I found that with the Sharp filter there was better tactility better impact but it caused the sound stage to sound a bit disjointed. While with slow, you have a softer sound but a more cohesive image, super slow proved even softer... I eventually settled on slow, though even with the slow filter the timbre remains a bit cold and the sound lacks impact and sufficient body.

How ever, the N3 is more dynamic and has a better detail retrieval, so while I wasn't impressed with the presentation of percussion or stringed instruments, the presentation for horns really caught my attention! Noise is another advantage the N3 has, it's much blacker than the HM 601 which has an audible hiss that's apparent during rests in the music, certainly the three adjustable gain positions help keep the noise down! While I don't own IEMs for those that do, the quieter and more precise volume control of N3 will certainly be appreciated!

I've been listening to DaiQing Tana for about 2 hours now, with both players. For this track, the mix is already very thick, so the clarity of the N3 is doing a much better job with layering the different instruments. I prefer the vocal only intro with the HM 601, but as soon as the acoustic guitar enters the mix, it get's too thick and I'm no long able to really follow the big drum as well. For me that big drum really makes the track! An the N3 is resolving it more cleanly than the HM601, even with a thinner headphone the warmer thicker sound of the HM 601 is a poor compliment to this track. Again, both tracks volume matched, though at 79.1 dBs this time around.

Little things like the Guitar pop out more on the N3, and the drum isn't drowning in all the mid range decay. Though, on the flip side the violin at the tracks end doesn't have quite the same beautiful timbre... but I'd prefer to enjoy the ENTIRE song rather than have a DAP that compliments only the beginning and ending parts of this particularly thick mix

My listening thus far has also been with my Superlux HD 668B, with stock pads. Both of the amps were ran on High Gain. I frankly like to use entry level headphones with entry level sources. Since chances are customers buying a $150 DAP will most likely also be listening with a headphone priced similarly. How ever I do have a very organic sounding Nhoord Red V1 that does NOT like my Hm 601, so I intend to see how my impressions change as I move from entry to mid range level headphones. I imagine the blacker background and more apparent macro dynamics will really shine on the Nhoord Red

Entry level? Hmmm. Most of my cans cost more than my N3.

 

[Makiah S]

Entry level? Hmmm. Most of my cans cost more than my N3.

Well it's a shame you don't have anything from the entry level segment of the headphone market. I make it a habit to evaluate amps/dacs/daps with headphones from different sectors of the market. I like to start with the Superlux HD668B, before I move into listening with some of my nicer cans, it would be a shame to recommend or review a DAP if I've only heard it through a $300+ set of headphones.

Plenty of new members here who are asking for recommendations have a price range they like to work in, and I like to have experience listening to products I think are worth while within their price range. Help them get the best experience that works in their budget, in this case the HD 668B and N3 are a solution for personal audio that doesn't cost any more than $200.

 

[fish1050]

I can respect, however a good source and amp are equally important as a headphone. I can take my modest HD668B which by the way is a prenominal sounding headphone, and pair it with my Hifiman Hm901 n PicoPower an suddenly gain huge improvements to sound.

I've not heard the B&W series headphones, an sadly my Zmf Eikon doesn't sound good from the N3 an neither does my HE4... an when I started this hobby in highschool I had a DT 880 and a Hm602. Because that's all I could afford! I saved up another 3 months after that to get my self a cmoyBB from JDS Labs after wards an used that set up for a year before I even considered getting any desktop gear.

That and even in the price range of the P7 there's not going to be a huge step up from the HD668B, Superlux made a real giant killer with this bad boi, it's a lot like my old Dt 880, but without the comfort and durability

I always worked up slowly, buying the best headphones amp and source I could.

Sorry but I have to disagree to some extent on the DAP/amp headphone debate. I sold high end gear for 15 years and listened to literally hundreds of headphones on every type of audio system home and portable at every price point. My experience has taught me that headphones by far make the biggest difference in sound quality. With today's hardware there is very little difference in true sound quality between DAP's even hundreds of dollars apart. After all they are using alot of the same parts across multiple DAP's at multiple price points. Give me a DAP like the N3 and my favorite B&W P5S2's over a more expensive DAP and cheaper quality headphones any day.

I don't hear a huge difference between DAP's hundreds of dollars apart in price but I do hear a noticeable difference listening to headphones hundreds of dollars apart. Multiple blind listening tests between DAP's and headphones has taught me that much.

Give me a pair of headphones that has the sound signature I like and they will make any reasonably priced DAP sound good. Give me a pair of headphones with a sound signature I don't like and no DAP at any price will sound good.

 

[gLer]

Sorry but I have to disagree to some extent on the DAP/amp headphone debate. I sold high end gear for 15 years and listened to literally hundreds of headphones on every type of audio system home and portable at every price point. My experience has taught me that headphones by far make the biggest difference in sound quality. With today's hardware there is very little difference in true sound quality between DAP's even hundreds of dollars apart. After all they are using alot of the same parts across multiple DAP's at multiple price points. Give me a DAP like the N3 and my favorite B&W P5S2's over a more expensive DAP and cheaper quality headphones any day.

I don't hear a huge difference between DAP's hundreds of dollars apart in price but I do hear a noticeable difference listening to headphones hundreds of dollars apart. Multiple blind listening tests between DAP's and headphones has taught me that much.

Give me a pair of headphones that has the sound signature I like and they will make any reasonably priced DAP sound good. Give me a pair of headphones with a sound signature I don't like and no DAP at any price will sound good.

Couldn't agree more. Also, headphones affect other aspects of the music listening experience, like comfort. Of course more expensive doesn't always mean more comfortable, but it's something to consider. More expensive does usually mean better quality materials/finishes, which also contributes to the experience. It's a long chain, but headphones, IMO, are the most important and valuable link.

 

[PapaThrust]

I can assure you that I have tested N3 charging time personally with the supplied cable, after several charging cycle, I can achieve from 10% to 90% (my regular charging cycle) in well below 2 hour.

This is the second recent report regarding slow charging, we didn't have this issue in the past, so we investigated the issue and find out that this is a firmware glitch in firmware v2.0, the charging current is lower then the published specification, causing a significantly longer charging time.

We shall rectify the problem and issue a new firmware as soon as possible, we are sorry for all inconvenience caused.

If you must get back to the original 2 hours charging performance, you can roll back N3 to previous firmware version before you charge the DAP, and the glass it back to v2.0 after you finish charging. Yes, this is not ideal, just a temporary solution for the needed.

Will come back to the forum as soon as I have the new firmware.

That's great news - thanks for clarifying.

 

[Makiah S]

Sorry but I have to disagree to some extent on the DAP/amp headphone debate. I sold high end gear for 15 years and listened to literally hundreds of headphones on every type of audio system home and portable at every price point. My experience has taught me that headphones by far make the biggest difference in sound quality. With today's hardware there is very little difference in true sound quality between DAP's even hundreds of dollars apart. After all they are using alot of the same parts across multiple DAP's at multiple price points. Give me a DAP like the N3 and my favorite B&W P5S2's over a more expensive DAP and cheaper quality headphones any day.

I don't hear a huge difference between DAP's hundreds of dollars apart in price but I do hear a noticeable difference listening to headphones hundreds of dollars apart. Multiple blind listening tests between DAP's and headphones has taught me that much.

Give me a pair of headphones that has the sound signature I like and they will make any reasonably priced DAP sound good. Give me a pair of headphones with a sound signature I don't like and no DAP at any price will sound good.

Your right! Headphones make the biggest impact more so than anything else, but the devil is in the details. There is no debate, your DAC and AMP impact the sound of your headphones, and when you've found the headphones that you like, the differences in the rest of your chain are apparent. Your Dac/Amp aside from their basic function will compliment your headphone. My W1000X was a really bright headphone, for a while I liked it with a my HM 801... then... one day I just... it felt too thick. I really didn't like it any more. Can't say why, So I upgraded into a HM901, from a PCM 1704 to an ECC Sabre 9018, BIG difference in how those two sound, the 801 had a thicker more sustained decay/release. A little too much bloom in the mid range, the 901 was much cleaner. An with a headphone that I like an appreciate the difference was evident,

So the question is how does the Cayin N3 compare to another Dap in my collection? So far, well! It's different sonically than what I have, but it's function and utility are also a breathe of fresh air coming from something as archaic as the HM601. An finally, until you've heard the HD 668B please don't write it off, it's really an amazing sounding headphone! Still, I've got my Audio Technica ES 10 with me today, for round two if my listening impressions

 

[fish1050]

Your right! Headphones make the biggest impact more so than anything else, but the devil is in the details. There is no debate, your DAC and AMP impact the sound of your headphones, and when you've found the headphones that you like, the differences in the rest of your chain are apparent. Your Dac/Amp aside from their basic function will compliment your headphone. My W1000X was a really bright headphone, for a while I liked it with a my HM 801... then... one day I just... it felt too thick. I really didn't like it any more. Can't say why, So I upgraded into a HM901, from a PCM 1704 to an ECC Sabre 9018, BIG difference in how those two sound, the 801 had a thicker more sustained decay/release. A little too much bloom in the mid range, the 901 was much cleaner. An with a headphone that I like an appreciate the difference was evident,

So the question is how does the Cayin N3 compare to another Dap in my collection? So far, well! It's different sonically than what I have, but it's function and utility are also a breathe of fresh air coming from something as archaic as the HM601. An finally, until you've heard the HD 668B please don't write it off, it's really an amazing sounding headphone! Still, I've got my Audio Technica ES 10 with me today, for round two if my listening impressions

Okey lets qualify this a bit, I said within a few hundred dollars of each other not 5x+ the price. Yes I would expect to hear differences between a Cayin N3 and an Astell and Kern or HiFiman model costing 5x more but enough of a difference to justify paying 5x more? When I was shopping for my first DAP I auditioned several HiFiMan, Astell and Kern and even Calyx models. They were well outside my budget but I wanted to know what kind of bar was being set. I was not impressed with any of the UI for any of these models. Then I listened to the Fiio X3-II and eventually the Sony A17 which I bought and still have. I got the A17 and my beloved B&W P5S2's for $560.00 and I am still loving the sound 3 years later. Did the higher end units sound better, of course but 3x the price better, no way. Plus the lousy battery life and atrocious UI on the more expensive models turned me off completely. I don't care how good it sounds if it sucks to use it then I won't buy it.

Bottom line, my advice is to first find a pair of headphones you really like. Make sure you like how they sound, that they fit well and are comfortable to wear, and hopefully isolate well. Once you have the headphones now you can truly judge how different DAP's sound to you.

 

[Makiah S]

Okey lets qualify this a bit, I said within a few hundred dollars of each other not 5x+ the price. Yes I would expect to hear differences between a Cayin N3 and an Astell and Kern or HiFiman model costing 5x more but enough of a difference to justify paying 5x more? When I was shopping for my first DAP I auditioned several HiFiMan, Astell and Kern and even Calyx models. They were well outside my budget but I wanted to know what kind of bar was being set. I was not impressed with any of the UI for any of these models. Then I listened to the Fiio X3-II and eventually the Sony A17 which I bought and still have. I got the A17 and my beloved B&W P5S2's for $560.00 and I am still loving the sound 3 years later. Did the higher end units sound better, of course but 3x the price better, no way. Plus the lousy battery life and atrocious UI on the more expensive models turned me off completely. I don't care how good it sounds if it sucks to use it then I won't buy it.

Bottom line, my advice is to first find a pair of headphones you really like. Make sure you like how they sound, that they fit well and are comfortable to wear, and hopefully isolate well. Once you have the headphones now you can truly judge how different DAP's sound to you.

This thread has nothing to do with justification, my point isn't to say GO BUY this $500 Dap over this $150, my point is to take two products within a price range and see which is better, better in the sense of battery life, sound quality and overall usability. Headphones are also not the point of this thread either, and actually at this moment, I've got my Audio Technica ES 10 [though it's heavily modded so hard point of reference] and I'm still hearing the same... better imaging, timbre and macro dynamics on the HM601, vs the superior clarity, micro dynamics and speed on the N3. Again both DAPs are volume matched for this track as well.

I'm not here to promote Hifimans DAPs. They are atrocious, the battery life is a joke [though the rock boxed hm 601 like never dies... ] and their ui needs work. Plus their functionality is very basic... really my aim is to honestly find something that BOTH sounds better than they do AND has more functionality. Thus far, the N3 does not satisfy that requirement, it offers a different sound with WAY better functionality and more power/matching potential with a different UI. So for me thus far the N3 isn't better than my hm601, it's also not worse. It's just different! An different is good as different people need and want different things fundamentally. I'm going to start playing around with some of that functionality so I can get a feel for it, an I'll report back then.

So far though, I am continuing to enjoy it. An I'm adjusting to the Ui as well. It's a nice improvement from what I'm used to!

 

[Indrajit]

I can assure you that I have tested N3 charging time personally with the supplied cable, after several charging cycle, I can achieve from 10% to 90% (my regular charging cycle) in well below 2 hour.

This is the second recent report regarding slow charging, we didn't have this issue in the past, so we investigated the issue and find out that this is a firmware glitch in firmware v2.0, the charging current is lower then the published specification, causing a significantly longer charging time.

We shall rectify the problem and issue a new firmware as soon as possible, we are sorry for all inconvenience caused.

If you must get back to the original 2 hours charging performance, you can roll back N3 to previous firmware version before you charge the DAP, and the glass it back to v2.0 after you finish charging. Yes, this is not ideal, just a temporary solution for the needed.

Will come back to the forum as soon as I have the new firmware.

Do the firmware updates bring any difference to the native sound quality of N3?

 

[fish1050]

This thread has nothing to do with justification, my point isn't to say GO BUY this $500 Dap over this $150, my point is to take two products within a price range and see which is better, better in the sense of battery life, sound quality and overall usability. Headphones are also not the point of this thread either, and actually at this moment, I've got my Audio Technica ES 10 [though it's heavily modded so hard point of reference] and I'm still hearing the same... better imaging, timbre and macro dynamics on the HM601, vs the superior clarity, micro dynamics and speed on the N3. Again both DAPs are volume matched for this track as well.

I'm not here to promote Hifimans DAPs. They are atrocious, the battery life is a joke [though the rock boxed hm 601 like never dies... ] and their ui needs work. Plus their functionality is very basic... really my aim is to honestly find something that BOTH sounds better than they do AND has more functionality. Thus far, the N3 does not satisfy that requirement, it offers a different sound with WAY better functionality and more power/matching potential with a different UI. So for me thus far the N3 isn't better than my hm601, it's also not worse. It's just different! An different is good as different people need and want different things fundamentally. I'm going to start playing around with some of that functionality so I can get a feel for it, an I'll report back then.

So far though, I am continuing to enjoy it. An I'm adjusting to the Ui as well. It's a nice improvement from what I'm used to!

Considering everyone is going to use this or any other DAP with headphones or iem's then offering opinions on headphones is perfectly legitimate in my opinion. Not really talking about justification on your part but my own observations based on my experiences.

 

[Francisk]

Considering everyone is going to use this or any other DAP with headphones or iem's then offering opinions on headphones is perfectly legitimate in my opinion. Not really talking about justification on your part but my own observations based on my experiences.

Any good sounding DAP should sound good with any good sounding IEMs or headphones unless the rare occasions when headphone has too high an impedance for the DAP, in which case you'll need an external headphone amp. As for IEMs, I still haven't found any IEMs that can't be driven to dangerously loud levels by the N3.

 

[scott1]

I'm just gonna change the subject for a sec and thank gLer and XVortex for their V2, really liking it so far despite the loss of the nipple wallpaper. Thanks again guys!

 

[CayinSupport]

I've upgraded mine to custom 2.0. No problem so far and the UI is slightly improved. Clicking feels more responsive now.

One thing i have not figured out is how to use the playlist on the menu. the m3u file I put on the SD card showed up on the folder instead of on the playlist menu.

Please refer to this link: http://en.cayin.cn/download/show?id=13514

 

[spoonspoon]

Just for reference I have charged the batt from 28% to about 98% in 3.5hrs with iPad 2.4A charger.