[Andykong]

hummm. that one is difficult for me as i only have a Koss Porta pro as secondary headphone.
What i tested (but in a hurry and will do further testing once i have more time) is:
N3>3.5mm jack in aux-Xduoo (on aux setting)>HD600 only amp of the Xduoo (i don't like it, sounds to loud not very clean/precise)
The best use of this combo (for the moment, as i have to find a coax-usb-C cable for the optical connection) =
N3>3.5mm jack in aux-Xduoo (on USB setting: same as above but you select the medium setting in input- i thought i would need a usb connection but it works via the 3.5mm jack)>HD600
I think that uses the DAC+AMP of the Xduoo and i love its sound (but can't say if i prefer it vs the N3 alone as it's already very good alone when i test it with my HD600 without amp: great clarity and precision)
And there's a great deal of settings i have to explore (DAC filters: sharp/slow roll-off, Short delay sharp/slow)
The N3 can drive headphones until 200ohms (and my hd600 doesn't sound ridiculous at 90% only with the N3) so if you have a pair of headphone that are under 200ohms impedance, the N3 is a really great solution (I love it with my Porta pro too, less details and clarity, great dynamic and fun V-shaped sound...just didn't test it with the Xduoo)

Did you set the N3 to Line out mode when you connect the N3 to your XDuoo? If yes, you are connected in Line out. If not, you are Phone out mode. I can confirmed that you are not connected to digital output from N3, so you are using the XDUoo as a headphone amp. only.

In either case, you are not hearing the best of N3. The line out mode is N3's weak link when compare to phone out and digital out.

Can you clarify. I thought the line out , while sharing the same 3.5mm port, came from an output prior to the headphone circuit. Is the line out really just the headphone amp output on high volume?

This is the functional framework of N3, you can consider the line out signal as a fixed 1.0V output from the headphone output, and the signal has gone through exactly the same stage of voltage amplification and current amplification stage as the headphone output, so I agree with you that its not as clean as a dedicated line out straight from the DAC output.

 

[Andykong]

What are then the options to get a digital out from N3? If I want to use the N3 just as source an use an external dac?

as far as I can see:

1- N3 usb-C out -> cable usb-C to 3.5mm (like the cayin one) -> 3.5mm in of external dac
2- N3 usb-C out -> cable usb-C to USB female -> USB male from external dac
3- N3 usb-C out -> cable usb-C to digital coaxial (exists?) -> digital coaxial in from external dac

Am i Right? there are another options?

A bit complicated, right? I have explained the Dual digital out form N3 previously, maybe you can check it out again:
https://www.head-fi.org/f/threads/c...coax-out-for-150.833932/page-39#post-13377434

 

[Pacem]

An other question: can we browse and have the Cayin N3 to read local files (from its SD card or from its own memory) from the phone app?
I'm reluctant when it comes to bluetooth codecs.

 

[BroncoVA]

I guess you went to the online shop of MusicTeck, that's our US distributor. For the record, that is NOT a quote from Cayin. So Cayin didn't ask for $50 shipping cost.

I have listed MusicTeck in the announcement because they are the first dealer created a product page for the cable. I have looked for other dealers such as AdvancedMP3 from UK or our distributor from Japan, they have ordered the cable but they didn't up up a link for it on that day, so leaving only one alternative in the list.

We have listed our international distributor/dealers in our website, you are welcome to check out the list and pick one that is more reachable from your locatoin.
http://en.cayin.cn/netword/show?c=129&ctype=2&smallid=191&id=13499

In face, we have a distributor in Italy, maybe you can call them up and see if they have carried the cable:
POLARIS AUDIO SRL
Address:Via Matteo Babini, 2800139 - ROMA (RM)ITALY
VAT ID: IT12844831003
Phone: 0039-06-91.650.8973

oopps...yes my bad! I totally messed up on that one: it's not Cayin but U.S.A based MusicTeck that charges 50$, sorry to have named your company for that ludicrous pricing.
The roman distributor has also a site http://www.polarisaudio.it/ , i'll look up on there, thanks for the tip!

 

[Andykong]

Thanks for the reply. The hissing with IE80 is definitely less obvious than with SE535, but it's still very noticeable and can get annoying sometimes.
To put things into perspective, the hissing of my Cayin N3's output is a lot louder than my iPhone, because I cannot hear any hiss with my IE80.

I can say with confident that N3 is the quietest DAP in Cayin line up so far, and the background noise of N3 is among the best when consider its output and driving power.

We can't just look at the background noise issue without considering the output different. Let's compare the rated output of iphone (@33ohm) and N3 (@32ohm)
iphone 6 = 26.39 mW,
N3 = 130mW+130mW
Source: http://www.anandtech.com/show/8554/the-iphone-6-review/11

So the N3 is pumping out around 500% (rated) output when compare to a mobile phone, to control the final (total) noise output at the same level, the N3 will have to lower the noise floor by 80% to start with.

This is just a simplified illustration, there can be different aspects to look at the same issue, for example we can look at the signal processing path of amplification design, the N3 will go through voltage amplification and then current amplification, but most if not all mobile phone will not have any "amplification" inside the phone as most likely it will be a direct output form the DAC chipset.

So comparing the background noise of a mobile phone against a high power DAP is not really a fair game. Cayin has tried our best to keep the background noise down to a level that it won't affect music listening, but the noise is still there, if you are sensitive to the background noise (trust me, some ears are more sensitive than others on hissing) or you try to look for it deliberately, the noise is there. Fortunately we didn't receive a lot of complain on the background noise so far (200+ pages) so we assume the noise issue is at acceptable level to most users.

I understand the frustration on background noise because I was an addict on noise detection when I start this hobby, I even bought a Westone W1 IEM (122dB/mW) as noise detector to challenge DAP and headphone amplifiers, but over the years, I start to "undo" my attention to the hissing and it works gradually. When I don't deliberately look for it, I don't hear it even with my noise detector IEM. Let's hope the issue is getting better to you down the road.

 

[BroncoVA]

Did you set the N3 to Line out mode when you connect the N3 to your XDuoo? If yes, you are connected in Line out. If not, you are Phone out mode. I can confirmed that you are not connected to digital output from N3, so you are using the XDUoo as a headphone amp. only.

In either case, you are not hearing the best of N3. The line out mode is N3's weak link when compare to phone out and digital out.





This is the functional framework of N3, you can consider the line out signal as a fixed 1.0V output from the headphone output, and the signal has gone through exactly the same stage of voltage amplification and current amplification stage as the headphone output, so I agree with you that its not as clean as a dedicated line out straight from the DAC output.

Totally forgot the line out setting... I was on Headphone but with different sounding as i selected Aux/USB on my Xduoo.
So i think i was listening in phone mode (when Xduoo on usb it's already good; on Aux the sound is not good).
I'll have to find that cable for digital out

 

[georgelai57]

Would Tidal HiFi on my iPhone be able to transmit via BT to the N3's Hiby music app?

 

[fourrobert13]

Would Tidal HiFi on my iPhone be able to transmit via BT to the N3's Hiby music app?

Not sure how that would work. The Hiby app is on your phone as well, but I'm pretty sure you can stream tidal from your phone via Bluetooth to the N3. The Hiby link app is just an app on your phone that allows users to control the N3 via Bluetooth.

 

[Slater]

The 3.5mm port of N3 is shared between Headphone out and line out, N3 does not support optical out, so the port definitely won't output optical signal at anytime.

My bad; I was misinformed. Thanks for clearing it up.

 

[georgelai57]

Not sure how that would work. The Hiby app is on your phone as well, but I'm pretty sure you can stream tidal from your phone via Bluetooth to the N3. The Hiby link app is just an app on your phone that allows users to control the N3 via Bluetooth.

Thanks

 

[jms74]

Hello jms74,

Could you please detail the operation steps taken leading up to the force close, are they similar / identical to the steps given in Cayin's HiByLink connection guide?

Also, can you open system settings on your phone, look for Installed Apps->HiByMusic and tell us what permissions have been given / denied it?

Thank you and best regards,
Joseph Yeung
HiByMusic Team Member

Following the steps to the letter was my first attempts, then i tried other methods to see if anythink worked.
About the app permissions on android, it has Storage, Localization, and Phone permissions, all turned on. Note that my smartphone defined language isnt english so these words i chose for permissions are a translation and may not be the same terms used by official english android.

 

[Slater]

Note that my smartphone defined language isnt english...

Maybe that's the problem? What if you temporarily changed the language to English and tried the app again? If it works, there's your problem. If it still force closes, it's something else.

 

[tikue666]

Would one of you fine gentlemen be kind enough to point me to posts that talks about the comparisons between the N3 and M2s?

 

[fourrobert13]

Would one of you fine gentlemen be kind enough to point me to posts that talks about the comparisons between the N3 and M2s?

Post 2178

 

[gonzfi]

At some point in the future will the N3 be able to recognise audible files (.AAX I think)? Would make it the perfect DAP for exercising then!