[HiFiHawaii808]

I'm curious to hear the C9 but it's really a crazy thing to consider given how little of my listening is done while I'm stationary. The Shanling M8 is presently the upper limit of what I'd really consider pocketable/portable...but it would still be nice to have an option like the C9 around the house "just because". I wonder how much it could really add to M8 + Elysium. The thing that always gets me at this point that my search is no longer about ironing out imperfections in what I have-- Ely + M8 leaves nothing to be desired to me while I'm listening to it...so I know that I could be totally happy without adding anything to it. It's more about tweaks and refinements at this point. Heck in the past few days I've had nothing but a Andro 2020 and my M8 and that pairing has left me wanting nothing...if society collapsed tomorrow and all I had was what I have on me now audio wise I'd be just fine. This just serves to emphasize the power of curiosity and love of variety that characterizes this hobby.

The C9 + R6 2020 is pretty easy to carry around the house in one hand. This is very convenient and provides an untethered use case. You can also put it into a transportable case for listening on the road. Pictures below show its profile and fit into an IFI Traveller case.

But, what it also does is improves full sized headphone use cases. I am currently travelling and I brought my monstrous ZMF Verite Closed headphones. These headphones are very finnicky and do not sound great with most amps. Even with the Hugo 2 it needs EQ. I did not like how the VC sounded with a Chord Hugo TT2 (I heard it in a hifi shop so I couldn't equalize them). The VC sounds best when paired with a tube amp. The VC Still do not sound that great with the R6 2020 + C9. But, when I pair the VC with the Hugo 2 + C9, it sounds fantastic without EQ. I am running C9 in preamp and Tube timbre mode. So, Cayin's experience in building tube amps was employed in making the C9 and it really makes a difference to both IEMs and full sized headphones that sound best with tubes. I think those who haven't spent a lot of time with full sized tube amps don't have as good of an appreciation for this feature of the C9.

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

The n6ii + A02 is rumoured to be one of the best pure line outs in the game

Until Cayin replaces it later this month. Since the Amp2 has been rumored to be MD. This is what many think the May surprise is.

 

[Andykong]

Once you get the C9 and start listening to your IEMs with it, taking it away is like giving up your Queen in a game of chess before the start of the game to your opponent. I think the C9 is the most important component in an IEM chain because it makes everything sound better. If you have a C9, you don't need a high end DAP. Midfi DAP is sufficient for TOTL sound. But, it can also make your TOTL DAP sound even better. It makes a Hugo 2 sound better.

Looks like more users start to recognise that the amplifier is the more important in the music playback chain. We used to believe Digital Audio/DAC is the most important link and run after latest DAC chipset or ask for Dual DAC architecture, C9 thread probably is the only place in HeadFi forum that will encourage Midfi DAP + amplifier over TOTL DAP with better DAC/decoding capability in most cases.

 

[aaf evo]

Looks like more users start to recognise that the amplifier is the more important in the music playback chain. We used to believe Digital Audio/DAC is the most important link and run after latest DAC chipset or ask for Dual DAC architecture, C9 thread probably is the only place in HeadFi forum that will encourage Midfi DAP + amplifier over TOTL DAP with better DAC/decoding capability in most cases.

Not that I consider it mid fi but it’s price places it there… but the Lotoo PAW 6000 + C9 produces the best sound I have heard to date over any standalone DAP.

 

[Tanalasta]

Looks like more users start to recognise that the amplifier is the more important in the music playback chain. We used to believe Digital Audio/DAC is the most important link and run after latest DAC chipset or ask for Dual DAC architecture, C9 thread probably is the only place in HeadFi forum that will encourage Midfi DAP + amplifier over TOTL DAP with better DAC/decoding capability in most cases.

Agreed it’s definitely not the chipset alone but the implementation of the entire source. TOTL DAPs tend to have turned their DAC and headphone internal amp output.

Of course some of us here are pairing TOTL DAPs with C9 and $6000 IEM

I’m looking forward to seeing how the C9 + Fiio m11 pro compares to the C9 + SP2K when my C9 arrives.

And also if there is much difference between 4.4mm in or 3.5mm in and mixing SE and Balanced input/output?

 

[Andykong]

Well, you convinced me that I need a true balanced line out, so that is what I am going to get. I'll wait to see what Cayin releases and then make a choice. I like the iBasso sound, so the DX300 with the upcoming line out feature is the front runner right now. I would love to see you knock them out of contention.

The n6ii + A02 is rumoured to be one of the best pure line outs in the game

Unfortunately the A02 is sold out in many countries, and we didn't have any immediate plan to develop a line-out priority DAP solution. Maybe we'll revisit this topic down the road. On the other hand, I have explained our thoughts in another thread, we are very ambitious with C9: we want C9 to decouple with N6ii. The C9 must aim at a much larger customer group than N6ii users base in order to reach economic efficiency, Therefore C9 must be marketed as a cross-brand product in order to reach out to its target customers.

For your reference, the product life cycle of Cayin DAP is relatively long when compare to our competitors. It takes 9-15 months of R&D to develop a new DAP in our practise, and then 4-6 weeks to transfer the R&D prototype to a mass manufacturable product (including the time to develop supply chain), and the time required for second part is getting longer and longer because of the global shortage of semiconductor components and logistic delays. In other word, if we want to develop a new DAP to take advantage of the surprisingly well-received C9, it won't be available till late 2022. In other word, whatever comes out in next few months, is something we planned all the way back in 2020, or even further back.

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

Unfortunately the A02 is sold out in many countries, and we didn't have any immediate plan to develop a line-out priority DAP solution. Maybe we'll revisit this topic down the road. On the other hand, I have explained our thoughts in another thread, we are very ambitious with C9, we want C9 to work well with every DAP brands instead of the perfect to Cayin DAP.

For your reference, the product life cycle of Cayin DAP is relatively long when compare to our competitors. It takes 9-15 months of R&D to develop a new DAP in our practise, and then 4-6 weeks to transfer the R&D prototype to a mass manufacturable product (including the time to develop supply chain), and the time required for second part is getting longer and longer because of the global shortage of semiconductor components and logistic delays. In other word, if we want to develop a new DAP to take advantage of the surprisingly well-received C9, it won't be available till late 2022. In other word, whatever comes out in next few months, is something we planned all the way back in 2020, or even further back.

Thank you. I finally got you to preannounce news even if it isn't the news I wanted to hear. I should have been a reporter. Now I can feel more confident buying the DX300.

 

[Andykong]

Thank you. I finally got you to preannounce news even if it isn't the news I wanted to hear. I should have been a reporter. Now I can feel more confident buying the DX300.

Well, it's not really preannounce news, more an explanation, and I have updated my response to further clarify my intention to bring up these issues: we want C9 to decouple with N6ii.

 

[RTodd]

I'm curious to hear the C9 but it's really a crazy thing to consider given how little of my listening is done while I'm stationary. The Shanling M8 is presently the upper limit of what I'd really consider pocketable/portable...but it would still be nice to have an option like the C9 around the house "just because". I wonder how much it could really add to M8 + Elysium. The thing that always gets me at this point that my search is no longer about ironing out imperfections in what I have-- Ely + M8 leaves nothing to be desired to me while I'm listening to it...so I know that I could be totally happy without adding anything to it. It's more about tweaks and refinements at this point. Heck in the past few days I've had nothing but a Andro 2020 and my M8 and that pairing has left me wanting nothing...if society collapsed tomorrow and all I had was what I have on me now audio wise I'd be just fine. This just serves to emphasize the power of curiosity and love of variety that characterizes this hobby.

Yes I agree, I think I may have a solution for carrying the C9 around and still having hands free. It is a lot to carry though no matter what.

It is transportable though and sitting in my office and doing administrative stuff, or writing and reading emails it can sit on my desk and I can listen to that extra something.

I took it on the last flights I took and in my Hadley Pro Camera bag it fit no problem, that is a shoulder bag, and small but still larger than you would need. I kept the tunes going in the terminal and during boarding and exiting the planes. Once at my seat and after we reached the altitude I took it out of the bag so it would not overheat. It was fine and not that much extra. For an IEM like Traillii I would not bother, it just does not do much to make that a more engaging experience than it already is. For the Thummim though big difference to my ears.

 

[Andykong]

Agreed it’s definitely not the chipset alone but the implementation of the entire source. TOTL DAPs tend to have turned their DAC and headphone internal amp output.

Of course some of us here are pairing TOTL DAPs with C9 and $6000 IEM

I’m looking forward to seeing how the C9 + Fiio m11 pro compares to the C9 + SP2K when my C9 arrives.

And also if there is much difference between 4.4mm in or 3.5mm in and mixing SE and Balanced input/output?

or C9 + M11Pro compares to SP2K, they are in the similar price range in terms of total price?

 

[RTodd]

Not that I consider it mid fi but it’s price places it there… but the Lotoo PAW 6000 + C9 produces the best sound I have heard to date over any standalone DAP.

+1

Lotoo I think understands that the DAC choice itself and a balanced approach prior to and through the DAC process is not as important as the amplification choices in terms of sound.
A single DAC chip is good enough, decode in stereo and isolate the channels after they are analog, staying balanced through amplification. From what I hear Lotoo is getting great results with this approach.

If you add the C9 to the PAW6K it may actually achieve as good or really close to as good as its big more expensive brother/s can.

 

[Andykong]

+1

Lotoo I think understands that the DAC choice itself and a balanced approach prior to and through the DAC process is not as important as the amplification choices in terms of sound.
A single DAC chip is good enough, decode in stereo and isolate the channels after they are analog, staying balanced through amplification. From what I hear Lotoo is getting great results with this approach.

If you add the C9 to the PAW6K it may actually achieve as good or really close to as good as its big more expensive brother/s can.

That's a very good point.

Just out of curiosity, if we compare PAW6K with N3Pro via 3.5mm line out to C9, how significant the different will be? Given both DAP will use dual AK4493, if we excluded the analog amplification section, will they perform closer to each other?

 

[bluestorm1992]

+1

Lotoo I think understands that the DAC choice itself and a balanced approach prior to and through the DAC process is not as important as the amplification choices in terms of sound.
A single DAC chip is good enough, decode in stereo and isolate the channels after they are analog, staying balanced through amplification. From what I hear Lotoo is getting great results with this approach.

If you add the C9 to the PAW6K it may actually achieve as good or really close to as good as its big more expensive brother/s can.

To me LP6K + C9 blows away LPGT.

(Lotoo fanboys don’t throw bricks on me; I used to own Lotoo’s entire product line.)

 

[gazzington]

Well, it's not really preannounce news, more an explanation, and I have updated my response to further clarify my intention to bring up these issues: we want C9 to decouple with N6ii.

Lol I totally understand why you would be keen to decouple the c9 from the N6ii but damn it sounds so good

 

[jwilliamhurst]

To me LP6K + C9 blows away LPGT.

(Lotoo fanboys don’t throw bricks on me; I used to own Lotoo’s entire product line.)

What about LPGT with C9?