[Stinky Fart]

I will, thanks! Why I'm so dependent on Mike's review is because he had reviewed the Uber Muzik Tiny Tube Dac and I'm torn between NFB-12 and that. There's only one review on Tiny Tube and it doesn't compare to other dac/amps. So I thought that if Mike didn't like the NFB-12, that meant the Tiny Tube is better. Although now I know about the different settings I'm again torn between the two
Hope someone can shed some light here

 

[tim3320070]

Better to his ear, it's subjective mostly.

 

[mrspeakers]

The review is only a partial review if he doesn't try other modes the device is capable of, using only default 8x and USB vs. coax.   I found that the alternate 4x filters with S/PDIF worked much better for my setup.  
 
Take it with a grain of salt as the reviewer clearly didn't exercise all aspects and options of the box.  While I haven't heard a better DAC/AMP at the price, I also point out that taking aim at Schitt products as peers is NOT the same, as it's a dedicated amp without the DAC/receiver.

 

[JIGF]

Yeah, Mike's reviews can be way too subjective most of the time. But again, that is normal. And its nice to have such a nice place for reference purposes.
 
On the NFB-12, I liked it very much with the HE-4, which is the setup I my dad uses.

 

[eclipes]

which 4x filter did you find acceptable?
 
Quote:

The review is only a partial review if he doesn't try other modes the device is capable of, using only default 8x and USB vs. coax.   I found that the alternate 4x filters with S/PDIF worked much better for my setup.  
 
Take it with a grain of salt as the reviewer clearly didn't exercise all aspects and options of the box.  While I haven't heard a better DAC/AMP at the price, I also point out that taking aim at Schitt products as peers is NOT the same, as it's a dedicated amp without the DAC/receiver.

 

 

[captouch]

Now I get what you meant that he was using the worst setting. However, your review on the 8x linear phase half-band was not half as bad as how Mike reviewed it. Maybe Mike was using them without an additional amp. Have you tried using yours without your EF5? I'd like to know how they sound straight from NFB-12 since I will also use the amp section of the NFB-12

I made comments in posts 1268, 1286, 1313, and 1315 on the HP out by itself. It's a $200-250 DAC/AMP so you can't expect both to be stellar for that price. The DAC is quite good to my ears, the HP amp is a bonus to have and you can certainly use it to tide you over until you get a better amp. But it's not on the same level as the EF5 or Crack. It seems to have the power, but not the detail and refinement. But the EF5 is $500 new and only an amp so it better sound better! And the Crack is a DIY that costs $220 plus your time to build or $370 or so assembled and is really only for higher impedance cans. So it should also sound better.

I would think of the NFB-12 as a $150-175 DAC with a $50-75 HP amp built in. Could you find a better DAC in this price range? Could you find a better dedicated HP amp in this range? Really not sure because both of those ranges are pretty cheap.

Someone is selling a couple of NFB-12's in the for sale section for $175. Pretty sure those don't have the adjustable filters, but that's pretty cheap for a nice sounding DAC and decent sounding HP amp for anyone on a really tight budget. But if you have the $, I personally think the option to change filters is worth the extra $75 or so, unless you were willing to lift pins and airwire to make a one time filter change on the fixed setting units.

 

[Stinky Fart]

Quote:

I made comments in posts 1268, 1286, 1313, and 1315 on the HP out by itself. It's a $200-250 DAC/AMP so you can't expect both to be stellar for that price. The DAC is quite good to my ears, the HP amp is a bonus to have and you can certainly use it to tide you over until you get a better amp. But it's not on the same level as the EF5 or Crack. It seems to have the power, but not the detail and refinement. But the EF5 is $500 new and only an amp so it better sound better! And the Crack is a DIY that costs $220 plus your time to build or $370 or so assembled and is really only for higher impedance cans. So it should also sound better.
I would think of the NFB-12 as a $150-175 DAC with a $50-75 HP amp built in. Could you find a better DAC in this price range? Could you find a better dedicated HP amp in this range? Really not sure because both of those ranges are pretty cheap.
Someone is selling a couple of NFB-12's in the for sale section for $175. Pretty sure those don't have the adjustable filters, but that's pretty cheap for a nice sounding DAC and decent sounding HP amp for anyone on a really tight budget. But if you have the $, I personally think the option to change filters is worth the extra $75 or so, unless you were willing to lift pins and airwire to make a one time filter change on the fixed setting units.

hey thank you for your time explaining
I think I'll order these from the website! Thanks again!

 

[Brooko]

Quote:

which 4x filter did you find acceptable? 
 

I'm currently using the 4 x oversampling, minimum phase 'soft-knee'.  Just thought I'd try something a little different.  So far quietly enjoying it.  Not quite as detailed as the 8 x upsampling minimum phase apodising - but on my DT880 and HD600 it retains a nice sparkle at the top end and seems quite dynamic.  I'll give it a few days.  It seemed like the best of the 4x options with my cans.
 

 

[Jibbie]

I haven't messed with any of the filters yet.  I have gone back and forth between high and low gain, and I honestly can't tell a difference.  Sometimes I think the dynamics are slightly better on high gain, but then a I quickly realize that the volume is ever so slightly louder and that is what is causing me to hear a difference.  Anyone else think the gains sound the same?

 

[mrspeakers]

Unless you have a device to level match gain settings (radio shack SPL meter will do) then it's VERY hard to differentiate between settings.  I personally don't seem to hear much but I haven't dragged out the SPL meter to be sure.
 
Volume definitely impacts people's perceptions....

 

[olor1n]

Why would there be a difference between low and high gain at the same level? I recently compared the gain on my NFB-10SE and found no perceptible difference. I used an SPL metre to volume match. Not sure how drastically different it is from the NFB-12, but I can't imagine Kingwa compromising the lower gain setting in any of his designs.

 

[eclipes]

volume does impact people's perceptions, but I did find on low gain its rather flat and dead. After using on high gain, music is more alive and musical. But  it might be placebo lol... 

 

[Tilpo]

volume does impact people's perceptions, but I did find on low gain its rather flat and dead. After using on high gain, music is more alive and musical. But  it might be placebo lol... 

Without more objective methods of comparing there is no way to know.
Honestly, I doubt there will be a large difference. It's just changing a bunch of resistances; technically speaking there would be something wrong with the design if changing the gain altered the sonic characteristics in any audible way.

 

[tme110]

I don't believe there is any difference between high and low gain.

 

[satwilson]

I have the new model w/adjustable filters, this is my first DAC/ headphone amp so I don't have anything to compare to. I was just trying to upgrade the sound out of my laptop with HD280s and decided to get the NFB12. I have read this thread from page 1 and have been trying to decide my can upgrade, HD650; DT990,600ohm; or maybe the Thunderpants, I am aware these are all pretty different options and am leaning towards the DT990 as they are reputed to be somewhat bright and thought they might pair well with NFB12s slightly dark sound. I live in a small town in Kansas and don't have the option to audition these options. Out of the blue, a friend, a former recording engineer, (never knew that until we started discussing music), offered to loan me their Koss ESP950s. My initial impression, through the fixed output was lukewarm at best. Certainly better mids and highs than the HD280s, but no bottom end, weak/flabby. After searching HF forums I found some suggesting the 950s sound better with a hotter input than fixed. I set the Koss E/90 amp at 90% and switched the NFB12 to variable output, controlling the volume with the NFB12. I was amazed by the difference, the 950s had come alive. I am aware of the mixed reviews of the 950s, many suggesting they sound better/ great with a better amp. Suddenly there WAS a soundstage; articulate, detailed highs, mids, and plenty of punchy tight bass. Once again, I have no experience to compare anything, was just hoping someone else might be able to hook up an NFB12 variable output to the 950s and post their impressions from a more experienced point of view. I realize this is an unlikely pairing, however for me I may have found my upgrade. Any comments would be greatly appreciated.