[OctavianH]

If there are already 100 000 posts related to NFB-11 and HD600, I need to make a new one. So I used NFB-11 with Beyerdynamic T5p (portable Tesla, low impedance brother of T1) for more than a year (headphones are v1, 3 years old). During this time I was not 100% happy, because the detail was great, but the sound was too neutral towards a litthe bit harsh on highs and very unforgiving to the not very well recorded tracks. Recently I had the opportunity to buy some Sennheiser HD 650 and HD 600 at a good price. Now, my conclusions:
 
-HD650 are too "veiled" (dark or whatever) to me, with too much bass and not very good mids/highs (I listen mostly to metal or rock music).
-HD600 sound much better and closed to what I expected, and even the detail level seemed improved.
 
I tried both with stock cable and also switching them, and observed that for me the stock HD600 cable was the best choice. Now I read forums and others opinion and all praise the HD650 cable on the HD600 phones. For me, the impresion was that the HD650 cable was adding more bass and less treble to HD600, but I was also loosing detail. So I decided to keep HD600 with stock cable, and maybe upgrade to a better one in the future. 
 
And now comes my question, related to cables and general impressions regarding pairing of NFB-11 and HD600:
- Am I crazy or the cable changes the sound quite much? Here a lot of people say that it has no influence, and there are no electrical reasons to belive that the sound is different.
- Does anyone finds the HD600 a better pair for NFB-11 instead of the most expensive 650? Sounds strange to buy a cheaper headphone of the same vendor which sounds a lot better.
 
Hmm, ok, these are my concerns, hopefully I will not regret the 650s at this price. It does not make sense to keep them since I own also the Beyerdynamic T5p and a pair of "rock" headphones, Grado SR325is (which I find also too harsh on NFB-11 but I use them adding a tube Littledot MK II and they start so shine, still sometimes harsh and unforgiving with some tracks).

 

[cel4145]

- Am I crazy or the cable changes the sound quite much? Here a lot of people say that it has no influence, and there are no electrical reasons to belive that the sound is different.

Well, the scientific perspective is that unless you conduct proper double blind testing, it's too easy to bias a sighted evaluation. If you want to learn more, research and ask questions in the Head-Fi Sound Science forum.

 

[Triggaaar]

Too bright?
 
I had narrowed my DAC/Amp search down to the NFB28/29 and NFB11.
I'd like the balanced pre-out of the NFB28, but I don't want to need balanced cables for all headphones, so I was thinking the NFB11 or 29.
 
But I've read a lot suggesting these NFBs are a little bright sounding with some headphones. I have the HD650s (which I'm sure will be fine), the HE400i, but I'll also add to the collection (for example, some AKG K712pro which might be a bit bright).
 
So although I'm tempted to get the NFB29, I wonder if I should instead be thinking of the NFB11 and also a little tube amp for when I need to tone down brightness, or something completely different.

 
HELP!

 

[i019791]

The NFB29 should be the less bright, and much better, of the two.
Don't expect brightness issues with your phones, including the AKG.

 

[ipromesisposi]

The NFB29 should be the less bright, and much better, of the two.

Enough to consider double the price?

 

[ipromesisposi]

Alllow me explain myself.
 
In my country the final prices (inc. tax, shipping, etc) are the following (from european dealer, but just about the same from chinese Audio GD):
 
NFB-11.....389€.....404$
 
NFB-29.....864€.....898$
 
 
The difference is ¿fair?¿huge?¿obscene? You name it.
 
I can go with my HD650 and NFB-29, or
upgrade to HD700 and NFB-11.
 
Tough decision, or not. Meanwhile, I'll go on with my tiny Fiio (and the money in the bank).

 

[i019791]

I don't think I can advice how much the price difference will be worth to you.
By the way, HD700 is not universally accepted as an upgrade to the HD650.

 

[Triggaaar]

My research has been concluded.
 
Quote:

  Enough to consider double the price?

No.
 
 

  Alllow me explain myself.
 
In my country the final prices (inc. tax, shipping, etc) are the following (from european dealer, but just about the same from chinese Audio GD):
 
NFB-11.....389€.....404$
 
NFB-29.....864€.....898$
 
 
The difference is ¿fair?¿huge?¿obscene? You name it.

Irrelevant. There, I named it. They have the same DAC. The 29 has a load more power. Power that you just don't need.
 
 

I can go with my HD650 and NFB-29, or upgrade to HD700 and NFB-11.
 
Tough decision, or not. Meanwhile, I'll go on with my tiny Fiio (and the money in the bank).

It's an easy decision. Get the NFB11.

 

[i019791]

  No.
 
 
Irrelevant. There, I named it. They have the same DAC. The 29 has a load more power. Power that you just don't need.
 
 
It's an easy decision. Get the NFB11.

They have the same dac chip. You are probably implying that all Audio-gd dacs using the es9018 chip sound the same regardless of their implementation. If you have heard a lot of them, fine.
Better power supply and better volume control may be more important than more power, which comes as a bonus in the amp part.

 

[Triggaaar]

  They have the same dac chip. You are probably implying that all Audio-gd dacs using the es9018 chip sound the same regardless of their implementation.

Implementation is important, but I see no reason why Audio-GD would have messed it up with the NFB-11.
 
 
 

If you have heard a lot of them, fine. Better power supply and better volume control may be more important than more power, which comes as a bonus in the amp part.

The power supply is a completely different method, and I believe the NFB11 works as a class A amp at normal listening volumes. I haven't heard them, I am only going off the opinions of those I trust. I of course accept that you have tried them and you felt the NFB29 is better. It's a lot more money though and I feel that the money is for the bigger chassis, extra connectivity, remote functionality and extra power. If you need those connections, remote etc, that's a different matter. For most I would think the money saved could be better spend on headphones.

 

[ipromesisposi]

 
Quote:

  No.
 
 
Irrelevant. There, I named it. They have the same DAC. The 29 has a load more power. Power that you just don't need.
 
 
It's an easy decision. Get the NFB11.

Nice and clean.
Very kind of you.
 
 
Quote:

  For most I would think the money saved could be better spend on headphones.

 

Yesterday I enjoyed a sensational Sennheiser A/B test. Simultaneously governed by a Vioelectric HPA H90, I can try them for hours:
My HD650: Pretty warm, yet a very good contender in vocal music.
Flagship HD800S: Unquestionably better, wider soudstage, delicious treble, confort, etc.
 
And then I tried (briefly) others amps/dacs: Marantz HD-DAC1, Audiolab M-DAC+, Oppo HA-1, and Bryston BHA-1. The sound differences were minimal.
So my path is clear now.

 

[Triggaaar]

  Nice and clean.
Very kind of you.
 
 

Yesterday I enjoyed a sensational Sennheiser A/B test. Simultaneously governed by a Vioelectric HPA H90, I can try them for hours:
My HD650: Pretty warm, yet a very good contender in vocal music.
Flagship HD800S: Unquestionably better, wider soudstage, delicious treble, confort, etc.
 
And then I tried (briefly) others amps/dacs: Marantz HD-DAC1, Audiolab M-DAC+, Oppo HA-1, and Bryston BHA-1. The sound differences were minimal.
So my path is clear now.

You're welcome. Of course I respect i0's opinion.
 
But I've never seen anyone suggest that the NFB11 isn't good. Not anyone. So the DAC is decent, well implemented, and it has class A power at most listening volumes. You can get better no doubt, but you'll notice bigger differences between different headphones. If you're getting expensive hard to drive headphones you might instead need to consider the balanced NFB28. Only IMO of course.

 

[ipromesisposi]

  You can get better no doubt, but you'll notice bigger differences between different headphones.

 
Exactly! This is the conclusion of my test. So, first of all, I (really) need get a HD800s. From that moment I'll try electronics starting off moderate prices like Audio-GD NFB-11, Fostex HP-A4BL, Schiit Jotunheim, etc. If the differences are not abysmal with its bigger brothers, I think I'll stand there forever (until Sabre or Wolfson, etc develop another chip level, LOL).

 

[evilmind]

Question: I have an elear, a mojo and a DPX1. For work, I'm considering a stack or an all in-one and I'm hesitating between CMA600i or an audio GD. Would the NFB11 be enough to power and make the elear sing with the sound coming directly from a computer ? Or would it be better going DPX1 through NFB11? or it's not enough and I should go for something more powerful if I want to power the Elear properly ?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Triggaaar]

  Would the NFB11 be enough to power and make the elear sing with the sound coming directly from a computer ?

 
Yes.