[OPrwtos]

Quote:

 
EDIT: I don't have any means to level match but from my hardly rigorous comparisons I find high gain sounds worse with my LCD-2 (congested, not relaxed).  

You sure? lol
 

 

[drez]

Quote:

You sure? lol
 

Not sure at all, could be 100% due to level difference as I did not level match this.  I should note that I find high gain volume steps too wide so this is another factor
 

 

[brasewel]

Lee did you try playing your music through USB after 250 hrs to see if the harshness reduced?

 

[leesure]

I've listened thru USB after the burn in and, while it seems somewhat less intense, the edginess remains. It's not bad with the LCD-2 r1 but I'd hesitate to use it with a headphone with a brighter signature and there are better anps for the LCD's...but they all cost $$.

 

[BrainFood]

Quote:

I've listened thru USB after the burn in and, while it seems somewhat less intense, the edginess remains. It's not bad with the LCD-2 r1 but I'd hesitate to use it with a headphone with a brighter signature and there are better anps for the LCD's...but they all cost $$.

Strange that you should think that while one or two others said that USB direct was barely indistinguishable from USB with an expensive transport, such as the Audiophilleo.  Makes one ponder over the comment made by someone a while ago, questioning how much influence the USB implementation of the source has (different computer hardware and OS's, media players etc).  
 
 
 

 

[leesure]

Quote:

Strange that you should think that while one or two others said that USB direct was barely indistinguishable from USB with an expensive transport, such as the Audiophilleo.  Makes one ponder over the comment made by someone a while ago, questioning how much influence the USB implementation of the source has (different computer hardware and OS's, media players etc).  
 
 
 

 
FWIW, the USB sounds better on this amp than optical from my MBPro.  Not sure if it's a jitter issue or an issue with the spdif in general.  I find the USB implementation on the NFB-10 to be more listenable than the optical.
 

 

[d4nim4l]

Quote:

Wow. that's a surprise. I got my HD595 years ago over HD600 solely because of the 300Ohm impedance (price difference wasn't that much). Is your HD595 connecting to the 4pin XLR output? Does NFB10's balanced XLR output shine over the unbalanced output?
 
From one end, I heard people being proud of balanced end-to-end solutions. On the other end, even Sennheiser's $1500 HD800 comes with an unbalanced connector...
 
 

I also bought the HD595s for their lower impedance, because my budget at the time only allowed for a ~$100 headphone amp.  I had planned to convert my 595s to balanced, but hearing how poorly they scaled moving from a total airhead to the NFB-10SE single ended, I decided to get rid of them altogether and not convert them to balanced.
 
With my HD600s the balanced output is noticeably better than single ended, especially in the bass arena.
 
If I had it all to do over again, I would have purchased HD600s (or something of equivalent quality) and saved for a quality dac/amp down the road.  The headphone upgrade was the largest difference to me, and the difference in how the HD600s scale with quality dac/amp compared to the HD595s isn't really even comparable.
 

 

[leesure]

The transducer will ALWAYS make the largestt difference, for better or worse.  In loudspeaker audio, the rule of thumb was that you should invest haf of your budget into the speakers and the other half into source and amplification. The same or similar holds true in head-fi...perhaps not half, but the cans should be the 'best' portion of your chain.  For example, if you have $2,000 to spend...a pretty large initial budget...I would recommend $900-1000 cans and $900-1000 of electronics to drive it, rather than buying $500 'phones and $1500 on the DAC & amp. 
 
While I have not been the most vocal supporter of he sonic signature of the 10SE, what its price does is allow you to invest more in the phones than you could have otherwise while keeping to the budget.  
 
In short, I'd rather see someone buy LCD-2's and a 10se than a maxed Woo WA6SE to drive Senn HD-25's for roughly the same budget.  Always dedicate the most you can to the transducer. 

 

[HD595]

Quote:

The transducer will ALWAYS make the largestt difference, for better or worse.  In loudspeaker audio, the rule of thumb was that you should invest haf of your budget into the speakers and the other half into source and amplification. The same or similar holds true in head-fi...perhaps not half, but the cans should be the 'best' portion of your chain.  For example, if you have $2,000 to spend...a pretty large initial budget...I would recommend $900-1000 cans and $900-1000 of electronics to drive it, rather than buying $500 'phones and $1500 on the DAC & amp. 
 
While I have not been the most vocal supporter of he sonic signature of the 10SE, what its price does is allow you to invest more in the phones than you could have otherwise while keeping to the budget.  
 
In short, I'd rather see someone buy LCD-2's and a 10se than a maxed Woo WA6SE to drive Senn HD-25's for roughly the same budget.  Always dedicate the most you can to the transducer. 

Thanks for the great tip! I was actually thinking about NFB12 initially which price matches quite well with HD595. Then I thought about HD650/AKG K702 to replace HD595 since I have somewhat capable amp. I totally get what d4nim4l and you suggested. My appreciation once again! So would it be 
     "buy NFB12" -> "trade HD595 + NFB12" -> "buy HD650 + NFB10" or
     "buy NFB10" -> "trade HD595"               -> "buy HD650"?
Hmmm, maybe I should just stick with NFB12 for a while. By then, Dr. He might have an Async USB, 32bit/384KHz DAC, including analog input DAC+Amp combo for sale.
 

 

[leesure]

Quote:

Hmmm, maybe I should just stick with NFB12 for a while. By then, Dr. He might have an Async USB, 32bit/384KHz DAC, including analog input DAC+Amp combo for sale.

 

You do realize that there will be little to no source material in 32bit for a LONG time.  There's still very little in 24bit now.  even if you can fine the source material, the differences will be extremely subtle compared to any other changes you make in your chain...especially compared to the headphones themselves.
 
Please tell me you're not seriously factoring that into your decision. 
 
If you hjave the budget, the I'd strongly suggest the latter route.  Buy the NFB-10se, whose feature set is unrivaled at this pricepoint, then upgrade to the HD-650's, assuming you like their sound. 
 
Whatever you decide to do, MAKE SURE you listen to it 1st.  DO NOT take what I say or what anyone else says on an interweb forum as gospel. No idea where you live, but the odds are you have a head-fi meet of some sort near you in the future.  If not, host one and make sure to invite someone with the gear you want to hear!

 

[HD595]

Quote:

You do realize that there will be little to no source material in 32bit for a LONG time.  There's still very little in 24bit now.  even if you can fine the source material, the differences will be extremely subtle compared to any other changes you make in your chain...especially compared to the headphones themselves.
 
Please tell me you're not seriously factoring that into your decision. 
 
If you hjave the budget, the I'd strongly suggest the latter route.  Buy the NFB-10se, whose feature set is unrivaled at this pricepoint, then upgrade to the HD-650's, assuming you like their sound. 
 
Whatever you decide to do, MAKE SURE you listen to it 1st.  DO NOT take what I say or what anyone else says on an interweb forum as gospel. No idea where you live, but the odds are you have a head-fi meet of some sort near you in the future.  If not, host one and make sure to invite someone with the gear you want to hear!

Just sent an email to Kingwa about why he did not allow DAC bypass in his DAC+Amp combo products, e.g. NFB-10,5,12..., which can only do Amp bypass. Are there any obvious reasons I ignored?
 
Great tip on the head-fi meet! I live in Cary, North Carolina. If anyone close-by has an Audio-gd HP Amp nearby, please help me out. Thanks a lot.
 

 
 

 

[sridhar3]

Quote:

I live in Cary, North Carolina.

It's kinda OT, but living in Cary, NC gives you a few unique opportunities.
 
Cary Audio Design (CAD) is located in Apex.  They have a lot of awesome gear there, though majority is catered to home theater and loudspeaker rigs.
 
Drew Baird of Moon Audio is located in Holly Springs.  He runs Moon out of his house, and he has a big listening room upstairs with a lot of different headphone gear.  
 
I had a chance to visit both CAD and Moon Audio when I came out to Cary to spend time with my cousin, a local DJ (DJ Rang).  While in Cary, Drew let me spend 3+ hours in his listening room, listening to music through various headphones in a quiet environment.  Great experience.

 

[leesure]

Not exactly right next door, but 3/31/2012 will see a big meet visit Charlotte, NC.
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/562582/3-31-12-canfest-iii-headphone-event-charlotte-nc-with-turntable-and-vinyl-show
 

 

[SemiAudiophile]

^ Joeseph Grado gonna be there. I'm jealous.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by drez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
Whether other equipment is worth the price premium depends on how much you appreciate certain differences.  IMO certain gears are WAY too expensive regardless of performance for most people, or even for the technical audacity of the design esp from some ex-DIY designers and cable makers, but hey this is an over-inflated market full of apparently very rich people.
 
I find glare pretty apparent when using filter 7 on low gain, I will see if it's there on high gain but IMO with vocals other upsampling filters are better.
 
EDIT: I don't have any means to level match but from my hardly rigorous comparisons I find high gain sounds worse with my LCD-2 (congested, not relaxed).  For vocals I would avoid filters 1, 4, 7, and seem to like filter 9.

So did you end up keeping the ES? I see that you sold the SE..
 

 

[tim3320070]

Quote:

Thanks for the great tip! I was actually thinking about NFB12 initially which price matches quite well with HD595. Then I thought about HD650/AKG K702 to replace HD595 since I have somewhat capable amp. I totally get what d4nim4l and you suggested. My appreciation once again! So would it be 
     "buy NFB12" -> "trade HD595 + NFB12" -> "buy HD650 + NFB10" or
     "buy NFB10" -> "trade HD595"               -> "buy HD650"?
Hmmm, maybe I should just stick with NFB12 for a while. By then, Dr. He might have an Async USB, 32bit/384KHz DAC, including analog input DAC+Amp combo for sale.
 

It's seems like everybody ends up somewhere higher up the equipment chain than where they started (I am no exception). You might save yourself a lot of bother by just going for it with the 10SE and HD650 (or K701, DT880, etc.). I will tell you the 10SE is a considerable leap in fidelity over the NFB12 from my direct experience.