Dave has a crossfeed setting that does DSP to create a presentation that is trying to mimic speakers, and it does it pretty well. I don't remember what kind of EQ it's doing , but I can't really listen without it anymore
DAVE's crossfeed is definitely better implemented than many EQ, but I felt there was still a slight loss of transparency and transients are not as clean and so do not use it. I agree it adds depth and the presentation is more natural, the sound-stage width is reduced which is expected. There is no free lunch, one has to give some to get some and it will depend on where one draws a line...
I think it all comes down to the fact that the Susvara has the recessed bass, but excels in everything else. That alone can change someone's thoughts and perceptions. Also sound changes on the day/mood. Like right now at work I'm listening to:
Delerium - Chimera
TT2 > LCD-5
I don't know if it's because I've caught up on my lack of sleep lately (I work tons of OT. yay IT industry), but this album sounds and feels way different today. This is something I've played about 10 times before since getting these headphones. It's such more "atmospheric" and I'm noticing so much more out of the album. I'm just in a completely different mood today and that probably plays a HUGE part of how my ears are processing things.
Are you asking for LCD-5 preset specifically? we have always had the linear presets in Roon. We just released the presets for CRBN and Euclid and waiting for Roon to release it. We are currently testing LCD-5 preset and hope to release that in a month or so.
Both CRBN and LCD-5 presets were created in collaboration with Bob Katz and Gary Cole. This way, our hope is to close the 'circle of confusion' when it comes to EQ. When you have mastering engineers put their stamp of approval on how their tracks translate with the EQ, then we remove some of the subjective aspects of creating the EQ. But this does not mean everyone would prefer such EQ, it just means that is how the creator intended a track to sound.
I am excited about your Roon EQ preset release for the LCD-5 ! I have found the Roon EQ presets for your other Audeze headphones to usually be pretty great! Please keep us updated so I can discuss this for a future video on our TSAV youtube!
Dave has a crossfeed setting that does DSP to create a presentation that is trying to mimic speakers, and it does it pretty well. I don't remember what kind of EQ it's doing , but I can't really listen without it anymore. It adds depth to the soundstage and makes the bass sound like it's an actual room, instead of coming from 2 separate earcups. This setting didn't seem to add as much depth on the LCD-5, as it did on the Elite.
I don't remember if i turned this off when EQ'ing the LCD-5 to be honest, but i tested with the Z1R now and the degradation is definitely there with it on. It becomes a wall of sound. I know I tested all possible combinations and I preferred the LCD-5 with the crossfeed than with Resolve's EQ.
I'd probably have to do more research to find out exactly what the Dave's DSP is doing and then compensate for that in Resolve's EQ in Roon to actually match it , but that's too much work at this point.
Ok. Still not understanding. Are you are saying the crossfeed from Dave was used in addition to eq when testing? And, when using crossfeed with eq on Elite, this is where you are referring to the loss of clarity and soundstage on the 5?
I messed with the 3D on my iCan and 90 degree sounded like it was more separated like speakers but this was just an artificial effect to me, like a gimmick, so I decided I didn't need that effect as these are headphones and not speakers. The center focus became less apparent with it. I could say this was a loss of clarity too because it wasn't as forward anymore or in a sense attenuated due to the effect. Maybe the 5's just don't take well to faking more of an already simulated stage, similar to as I have read about the HD 800's.
So, I get it if you are hearing less of a crossfeed effect or a degradation of sort but just using eq and not crossfeed and eq, I cannot confirm any degradation of any kind just using eq so far.
I think it all comes down to the fact that the Susvara has the recessed bass, but excels in everything else. That alone can change someone's thoughts and perceptions. Also sound changes on the day/mood. Like right now at work I'm listening to:
Delerium - Chimera
TT2 > LCD-5
I don't know if it's because I've caught up on my lack of sleep lately (I work tons of OT. yay IT industry), but this album sounds and feels way different today. This is something I've played about 10 times before since getting these headphones. It's such more "atmospheric" and I'm noticing so much more out of the album. I'm just in a completely different mood today and that probably plays a HUGE part of how my ears are processing things.
Ok but I don't think we have found anyone who prefers Diana to literally everything, gunna throw in Stellia, the STAX SR009S SR007MK2..... Raal.... I mean like, you have to admit the dude has weird taste, he called the LCD-3F bright
He said this was bright....
I don't think he has quite reached Zeos levels of inconsistency but I think at the level he is at it should be a requirement to have a basic measurement rig or something.... I still watch him, hell I still watch Zeos(or at least skim thru his videos) but I can't seriously consider what he says. I think it's a bit amateur to not have any way to confirm the headphone you get when you get them from 3rd party sources is representative or be able to archive essentially what you got for reference later... I don't think the case above is an example of that either but I mean this was a problem in Tyll's day, now you can get an ear rig for a few hundred bucks, no you don't need something you can compare to graphs taken with $10k+ devices but you at least need a baseline or control.... No excuse IMO, DMS did good starting to show and take measurements.
Ok. Still not understanding. Are you are saying the crossfeed from Dave was used in addition to eq when testing? And, when using crossfeed with eq on Elite, this is where you are referring to the loss of clarity and soundstage on the 5?
I messed with the 3D on my iCan and 90 degree sounded like it was more separated like speakers. but this was just an artificial effect to me, like a gimmick, so I decided I didn't need that effect as these are headphones and not speakers. The center focus became less apparent with it. I could say this was a loss of clarity too because it wasn't as forward anymore or in a sense attenuated due to the effect. Maybe the 5's just don't take well to faking more of an already simulated stage, similar to as I have read about the HD 800's.
So, I get it if you are hearing less of a crossfeed effect or a degradation of sort but just using eq and not crossfeed and eq, I cannot confirm any degradation of any kind just using eq so far.
The volume drops by several db when using the iCan 3d toggle, so one would need to turn it up a bit to do a fair direct comparison. In my experience, most music does not change / changes for the worse with the 3d boost. But some songs do noticeably sound better when this is used, I think it just depends on how it is mastered.
Ok. Still not understanding. Are you are saying the crossfeed from Dave was used in addition to eq when testing? And, when using crossfeed with eq on Elite, this is where you are referring to the loss of clarity and soundstage on the 5?
I'm saying I don't reliably remember so I'd rather not venture a guess, as I only cared about what sounded better at that moment on both headphones, but that's the only case where I've been able to reproduce it at the moment. It only matters what sounds good to you
DAVE's crossfeed is definitely better implemented than many EQ, but I felt there was still a slight loss of transparency and transients are not as clean and so do not use it. I agree it adds depth and the presentation is more natural, the sound-stage width is reduced which is expected. There is no free lunch, one has to give some to get some and it will depend on where one draws a line...
The center focus became less apparent with it. I could say this was a loss of clarity too because it wasn't as forward anymore or in a sense attenuated due to the effect.
That's pretty much it, Dave's crossfeed does have a slight blurring of the center , but I feel like the tradeoff is worth it on most tracks, so I just left it on. However throwing EQ on top of that is a bit of a mess, but maybe I'm just not proficient at it/too lazy to compensate for CF. Back when I had time and energy for stuff like this I couldn't afford the gear. Now, this is spot on :
I am really looking forward to the CRBN preset in Roon. I like the sound and ease of use with the LCD-4 preset. Can't wait. Right now I don't use any EQ with the CRBN but have debated on some tweeks. I'm sure Audeze will do better than me.
I am really looking forward to the CRBN preset in Roon. I like the sound and ease of use with the LCD-4 preset. Can't wait. Right now I don't use any EQ with the CRBN but have debated on some tweeks. I'm sure Audeze will do better than me.
If you aren't using them for production work and just want to enjoy them, add a 3dB bass boost at 80hz. I'm fairly certain Audeze will have at least that much boost in their final parameters.
Are you asking for LCD-5 preset specifically? we have always had the linear presets in Roon. We just released the presets for CRBN and Euclid and waiting for Roon to release it. We are currently testing LCD-5 preset and hope to release that in a month or so.
Both CRBN and LCD-5 presets were created in collaboration with Bob Katz and Gary Cole. This way, our hope is to close the 'circle of confusion' when it comes to EQ. When you have mastering engineers put their stamp of approval on how their tracks translate with the EQ, then we remove some of the subjective aspects of creating the EQ. But this does not mean everyone would prefer such EQ, it just means that is how the creator intended a track to sound.
Bob Katz and Gary Cole hard at work creating EQ profiles for CRBN and LCD-5 referencing Bob Katz Dynaudio monitors and Gary Cole cross references it with his Barefoot monitors. Bob Katz and Gary Cole would post a detailed writeup on how they arrived at these profiles, but the EQ profiles involve gentle changes only to get them to match their reference.
Bob Katz and Gary Cole hard at work creating EQ profiles for CRBN and LCD-5 referencing Bob Katz Dynaudio monitors and Gary Cole cross references it with his Barefoot monitors. Bob Katz and Gary Cole would post a detailed writeup on how they arrived at these profiles, but the EQ profiles involve gentle changes only to get them to match their reference.
Bob Katz and Gary Cole hard at work creating EQ profiles for CRBN and LCD-5 referencing Bob Katz Dynaudio monitors and Gary Cole cross references it with his Barefoot monitors. Bob Katz and Gary Cole would post a detailed writeup on how they arrived at these profiles, but the EQ profiles involve gentle changes only to get them to match their reference.
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