[kwkarth]

Quote:

Should have come with a freq resp plot.  The drop off is on purpose, and the resolution will make up part of it but yes, 10dB drops do result in a more dark than bright presentation.  The quick drop off doesn't help things any.  Being down 10dB at 20KHz from  a slow drop starting at 1KHz would be less noticeable than 10dB down at 20KHz starting with a cliff at 1KHz =)

Sorry, but this just isn't accurate.  Please read the article on headphone measurement that I posted earlier.
Thanks.
 

 

[Paganini Alfredo]

Oh I like them on the dark side, any headphone, and I knew immediately after looking at the FR graphs that they were my kind of can. As with the 650s, although not the same sonic stamp, the treble is presented in the same manner I feel and thus the reasons for the comparisons to the 650s (the few that have been made. I'm just using them cause it's what I'm used to).
 
Edit: The LCD-2's have a scary tendency to make the music SLOW DOWN, open up, and you really just sit back and take it in. I mean, a song four minutes long sometimes feels like it's seven minutes long. I remember my AKG 701s doing this when I first got into HiFi, then the 650s as well, and now the LCDs do it on a whole other level. It's quite magical.

 

[Solude]

The link you posted is very old news and most of us knew that long before headphones were popular enough for Stereophile to do an article about it.   But I'm all ears, please tell us how a 10dB drop over 1KHz is less noticeable than a 10dB drop over 19KHz?

 

[midoo1990]

 
Quote:

I feel a little guilty getting these ahead of the other members who got in line before I did, but I guess I got lucky snagging them off the for sale forum.
 
Just got done unboxing them and having trouble pinpointing exactly what my initial impressions are. Like others have said, I'm not "wowed" by any means at first. I know exactly what the people earlier were saying about these not being good meet headphones. But that's exactly what anyone would think after waiting so long to finally hear these guys. The payoff comes in adjusting to the new gear I'm thinking.
 
Anyways, my main concern was the high end. I've played some tracks that have given me trouble before and no problems whatsoever. In fact my gut reaction was that I found these a bit recessed in the high end. Darker than my HD650s so far. This is an initial assessment however. But then again I don't consider my HD650s "dark".
 
Comfort isn't going to be a problem for me I think. They do clamp but I rather like the feeling of them being secure on my head for some reason, it's not bothersome. And they do have a physical presence sitting on the head, but even right now it's gone away after only about 20 minutes of listening.
 
I do like what I hear and think these are a grower!

Wohoo,that's not good.I don't want anything as dark as hd650.

 

[Jian]

Yeah, if that's true, it'll be a bit too dark.

 

[Paganini Alfredo]

Well I was gonna upload my FR chart that I got with it but Photobucket isn't working properly. Well, from my setup (HeadRoom's ultra desktop) the LCD's and 650s high end do sound similar. But I mean, it's a completely different headphone. Don't completely dismiss it just cause you don't like the 650s. And do have my HD650 recabled with a Cardas cable and I thought it sounded more neutral than with the stock.
 
Edit: ah, here we go

 

[electropop]

Oh man, that really means live jazz will not prolly sound all that realistic.. But, will be getting my pair next week.

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

The link you posted is very old news and most of us knew that long before headphones were popular enough for Stereophile to do an article about it.   But I'm all ears, please tell us how a 10dB drop over 1KHz is less noticeable than a 10dB drop over 19KHz?

Perhaps you were aware of the article, but from what you just said, you apparently either didn't read or didn't understand the article to which I referred.  Rather than rehearse this yet again in this thread, I would be happy to discuss it further with you via PM if you wish.

 

[kwkarth]

Point of clarification...
 
To say that the LCD-2s sound "dark" to you, when you listen to them is fine, as that is your perception and is every bit as valid as mine or any one else's perception, but to say they sound a certain way based upon the misinterpretation of a FR graph is not acceptable.  You can say something like that might be your opinion or your expectation, etc, but do not misrepresent your misinterpretation of the FR graph as some factual statement about the actual sound of something to which you haven't listened.  To do so, simply flies in the face of too much testimony of record, including the essence of the article to which I referred.

 

[midoo1990]

i am begining to get worried of treble of lcd2.i dont need another headphone that dark as hd650.

 

[jingles_97]

Quote:

i am begining to get worried of treble of lcd2.i dont need another headphone that dark as hd650.

Then perhaps it is time to sell the the HD650
 
I think Audeze should have held back the FR graph, and publish them online instead.  Now all of us see the graphs first before actually hearing them, with may have an effect on some listener's initial perceptions of its characteristics.  In my case, I also feel it's darker than the HD800, or that the HD800 is brighter thatn the LCD-2.  And in some ways they are polar opposites, while both retain a very high level of detail tonally and spatially.

 

[Equus]

I don't find the LCD-2 "dark" at all.  On my amps it doesn't have a lot of bright treble, but on the other hand I've listened to it on amps that made the treble much more forward as well.  It's all subjective in the end, so you may hear it differently depending on your setup as far as your rig and how your head is set up too. 

 

[rhythmdevils]

Judging headphones based on FR graphs alone is like judging the taste of chocolate chip cookies by the ingredients alone.  Yes, the ingredients say something.  If the ingredients are very poor, you may know they won't taste good.  But the difference between an A+ cookie and a B- cookie cannot be discerned by the ingredients.  At the end of the day, you can't know if they're good until you TASTE THEM!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Oh my god, this one has 1 gram more sugar it won't be balanced properly with the richness of the butter
 
Oh my god, this one has too much chocolate chips compared to flour mass, and I'm worried the chocolate will overpower the heartyness
 
Oh geeze-a-whiz they didn't even use butter, they used oil!  Holy smokes, there's no chance in %^& these will taste good
 
the relationship between brown sugar and white sugar is off, and I'm guessing that will result in a flatter sweetness as opposed to the more robust sweetness of brown sugar when used in proper amounts
 
taste them taste them taste them

 

[kwkarth]

Ok, let's get back to looking at the facts, rather than unsubstantiated fears...
 

Above, you see the FR of the top Sennheiser and Beyer cans.  In the midband, all of them spend a lot of time at +5dB.  This is really where your ear will set the reference point.  From that +5dB reference level, the HD800 is down -10 to -12dB at 2kHz.  At around 6kHz, there's a sparkle peak in the HD800 followed by gradual roll off, which actually looks pretty good, at 20kHz, being only -13dB below reference level.
 
On the bass end, the HD800 is about -8dB below reference at 10Hz, which is also quite good.  The traces for the other cans are there for your reference and you can compare them to the HD800.
 
Looking at the FR chart posted by PA above, we can see the reference level is set appropriately at 90dB, and drops about 10dB to 80dB around 2kHz.  There's another dip around 4kHz to -12.5dB below reference and then back up to the -10dB below reference level with a peak around 12.5kHz of 2dB below reference level.  At 20kHz the can is 10dB below reference level.
 
In reality, any measurements above 10kHz are suspect for any can on any dummy head due to un predictable standing wave and reflections inside the mannequin era canal, head and headphone cavity.
 
Looking at the bottom end, the LCD-2 is flat at reference level from midband to below 10hZ.
 
This does not say "dark" any more than any of the other cans shown say "dark."  You really need to listen for yourself before you form an opinion.

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

Judging headphones based on FR graphs alone is like judging the taste of chocolate chip cookies by the ingredients alone.  Yes, the ingredients say something.  If the ingredients are very poor, you may know they won't taste good.  But the difference between an A+ cookie and a B- cookie cannot be discerned by the ingredients.  At the end of the day, you can't know if they're good until you TASTE THEM!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Oh my god, this one has 1 gram more sugar it won't be balanced properly with the richness of the butter
 
Oh my god, this one has too much chocolate chips compared to flour mass, and I'm worried the chocolate will overpower the heartyness
 
Oh geeze-a-whiz they didn't even use butter, they used oil!  Holy smokes, there's no chance in %^& these will taste good
 
the relationship between brown sugar and white sugar is off, and I'm guessing that will result in a flatter sweetness as opposed to the more robust sweetness of brown sugar when used in proper amounts
 
taste them taste them taste them

Well done!!