[newworld666]

Strange. I’ m looking at Daps to try in a semi-transportable set up and the Kann Alpha was one i auditioned extensively with both iems and an Aeon closed. The dap i tried had no problems driving the Aeon playing large scale classical music - a real tester for current delivery - on high gain. Used several different recordings including some notorious for their demands on a system (Abbado’s CSO Prokofiev Lieutenant Kije Suite, Gergiev’s Rite of Spring, jurowski’s the Planets). Took it up to 110 and my hearing gave up before the KannAlpha - no distortion to my ears. In listening to EDM Trentemoller, DeadMaus and Yotto no issues either. Still prefer the SE180 or the DX300 but the Kann Alpha was not disgraced and had more current and voltage than its rivals. All imo…

You should just try Cradle to the Grave from Max Richter (Hostiles Alum) in hires ... between 50" to 1'20 ... there should be monstrous clipping at almost any volume level with the Kann Alpha like most low sensitivity Headphones (I would say more or less than 90db) and it's even worse with less than 40 ohms..
Clearly, there is almost no juice available from the Kann Alpha at 25ohms or less though they announce 12V available => it's mostly clipping and distorted sound over 135/150 volume level (when needed).

 

[MartyMcfly3004]

You should just try Cradle to the Grave from Max Richter (Hostiles Alum) in hires ... between 50" to 1'20 ... there should be monstrous clipping at almost any volume level with the Kann Alpha like most low sensitivity Headphones (I would say more or less than 90db) and it's even worse with less than 40 ohms..
Clearly, there is almost no juice available from the Kann Alpha at 25ohms or less though they announce 12V available => it's mostly clipping and distorted sound over 135/150 volume level (when needed).

Just found the song and tried it with the Aeon Noires. I could get some distortion at high volumes on that track. But it was way higher than I would be happy to listen to music at, by about 20 /150 on medium gain. Also that track has a lot of low end at that point, so this might be quite a niche issue and might be more of an issue with the stealth as they are slightly harder to drive.

Obviously ymmv but in everyday use, for me, I’ve been very happy with the alpha and my planar headphones (audeze lcd-2 closed, aeon open, aeon noires).

 

[dragolds]

Hello everyone. Can anyone confirm if this player can read/play 6 channel recordings? I have few albums ripped in flac from 6 channel sacds and even though I am listening them via stereo headphones with my Shanling m6 pro they sound great due to the high dynamic range. That is possible with android based daps , but wonder if Astell and kern ui would handle that.?

 

[Gilles De Rais]

You should just try Cradle to the Grave from Max Richter (Hostiles Alum) in hires ... between 50" to 1'20 ... there should be monstrous clipping at almost any volume level with the Kann Alpha like most low sensitivity Headphones (I would say more or less than 90db) and it's even worse with less than 40 ohms..
Clearly, there is almost no juice available from the Kann Alpha at 25ohms or less though they announce 12V available => it's mostly clipping and distorted sound over 135/150 volume level (when needed).

You raise this single track (and single section of that track ) every time as an example of the failure of the Kann Alpha/Aeon. Other people have tried this track and noted that to achieve your results you need to drive the headphone to excessively loud (even painful) levels, they also note similar results with desktop amps - there is a reference on Head-fi to a Burson 3x distorting.
I believe you are cherry-picking if this is the only example you use in your criticism. If there is a failure, you need to replicate it with other material and produce an iterative set of results. I was conscious of your comments on the Richter, which is why I chose those specific and particular recordings. I am comfortable that my approach of a range of music and recordings at a reasonable volume is more relevant to every day listening than your single example at ear-shattering levels.

 

[newworld666]

You raise this single track (and single section of that track ) every time as an example of the failure of the Kann Alpha/Aeon. Other people have tried this track and noted that to achieve your results you need to drive the headphone to excessively loud (even painful) levels, they also note similar results with desktop amps - there is a reference on Head-fi to a Burson 3x distorting.
I believe you are cherry-picking if this is the only example you use in your criticism. If there is a failure, you need to replicate it with other material and produce an iterative set of results. I was conscious of your comments on the Richter, which is why I chose those specific and particular recordings. I am comfortable that my approach of a range of music and recordings at a reasonable volume is more relevant to every day listening than your single example at ear-shattering levels.

I have many samples, and it is almost impossible to enjoy a HEDDphone One or DCA Stealth at a realistic volume level .. (of course not at 20/150@mid gain, which would be just ridiculous even to buy such bulky Kann Alpha for such power needs) => but this tyest is based on a real piece of classical music and it is the easiest way to control, it takes a few seconds to test even at low volume level and get a significant result no need to use strange words or not understandable expressions to try to describe the sound our are listening... it's just clipping or distorted.
With such test, you have an answer straight away with low impedance and low sensitivity headphones. It's really worth to do !!!!

I can compare my Kann Alpha with Centrance M8V2, Xduoo XD-05, and some other portable amps which are all clipping while Less Bx2plus, Fiio M17 doesn't clip at all or amps like THX887. The Kann Alpha is one of the weakest amp I own.. I really don't know where are the 12V, but it's the only one with such distortion at a realistic volume level with most headphones. Only line out is really spotless .. but, of course, it's not at all at a12V output, so with a THX 887 amp behind, sound quaslity is what you are basically expecting

After having bought 2 version of Kann Alpha (Chinese end Europe), I think, It's worth that other people know before buying this item has :
- an obsolete wifi hardware,
- an obsolete android version (no neutron bubble upnp, UAPP, ..., )
- a ridiculous limited PEQ (unable to access +-10db),
- an unstable upnp server access,...) ..
- impossible to use an eternal DAC and charging the Kann Alpha at the same time
- no BT LDAC DAC function
- using a BT remote is a real pain, because of a very short sleep function.
- of course one of the weakest amp I own, in real life many of my DAPs have more or less such amp power without announcing 12V output.

Then you can be happy with this dap ... it's totally up to you, but why buy such functionally limited DAP if you don't need 12V output or just play Mid Gain at 20/150 vol level ?

 

[Gilles De Rais]

I have many samples, and it is almost impossible to enjoy a HEDDphone One or DCA Stealth at a realistic volume level .. (of course not at 20/150@mid gain, which would be just ridiculous even to buy such bulky Kann Alpha for such power needs) => but this tyest is based on a real piece of classical music and it is the easiest way to control, it takes a few seconds to test even at low volume level and get a significant result no need to use strange words or not understandable expressions to try to describe the sound our are listening... it's just clipping or distorted.
With such test, you have an answer straight away with low impedance and low sensitivity headphones. It's really worth to do !!!!

I can compare my Kann Alpha with Centrance M8V2, Xduoo XD-05, and some other portable amps which are all clipping while Less Bx2plus, Fiio M17 doesn't clip at all or amps like THX887. The Kann Alpha is one of the weakest amp I own.. I really don't know where are the 12V, but it's the only one with such distortion at a realistic volume level with most headphones. Only line out is really spotless .. but, of course, it's not at all at a12V output, so with a THX 887 amp behind, sound quaslity is what you are basically expecting

After having bought 2 version of Kann Alpha (Chinese end Europe), I think, It's worth that other people know before buying this item has :
- an obsolete wifi hardware,
- an obsolete android version (no neutron bubble upnp, UAPP, ..., )
- a ridiculous limited PEQ (unable to access +-10db),
- an unstable upnp server access,...) ..
- impossible to use an eternal DAC and charging the Kann Alpha at the same time
- no BT LDAC DAC function
- using a BT remote is a real pain, because of a very short sleep function.
- one of course one the weakest amp I own, in real life many of my DAPs have more or less such amp power without announcing 12V output.

Then you can be happy with this dap ... it's totally up to you, but why buy such functionally limited DAP if you don't need 12V output or just play Mid Gain at 20/150 vol level ?

I can understand that the use case you have means this is not the dap for you. What I'm pointing out is that on the basis of one (and only one) example, you are driving other people away from something that may suit their needs. Some users don't stream, but work from local (ie mSD card) replay. To them the 'flaws' you raise re streaming are irrelevant, but that doesn't suit your agenda...
You say you have many samples, I've never read you refer to them, just this one piece over and over on this forum (11 times by my count, its not hard to do a search). If you refer to no other piece of music, your argument remains flawed - you need a broader sample size and an iterative process to 'prove' the problems. All you've done is identify an outlier.
I've outlined my approach and music and stated quite clearly that while not for me, the Kann Alpha does drive the Aeon more than adequately for a range of music played at reasonable listening levels. I note you're now bringing the Headphone and the Stealth into the equation, which are just not suited for mobile use (I think the M17 qualifies as 'transportable').
Your constant use of the same 'evidence', leads me to believe (in my opinion), you'd be best served by just walking away from these topics, you don't like the equipment, it doesn't suit you, you've registered your complaints - no need to flog a dead horse.

 

[Andricop]

an obsolete android version (no neutron bubble upnp, UAPP, ..., )

You are mixing 2 different things here.
The Android version is perhaps obsolete but the fact that you cannot install Neutron or UAPP has nothing to do with the obsolescence of the Android version; it's by design on all recent A&K players, it's a closed version of Android, they only support some apps https://us.astellnkern.com/blogs/news/open-app-service-instructions
If you want to be able to install any Android app on your DAP like on a smartphone you should choose other brands like Shanking, FiiO or Sony which support full Google Play Store.

 

[newworld666]

You are mixing 2 different things here.
The Android version is perhaps obsolete but the fact that you cannot install Neutron or UAPP has nothing to do with the obsolescence of the Android version; it's by design on all recent A&K players, it's a closed version of Android, they only support some apps https://us.astellnkern.com/blogs/news/open-app-service-instructions
If you want to be able to install any Android app on your DAP like on a smartphone you should choose other brands like Shanking, FiiO or Sony which support full Google Play Store.

Ok then ... PowerampEQ, Wavelet (both requires Android 10 minimum), Amazon HD music in Hires mode, and so many have difficulties with Tidal..
Android 7 is definitely obsolete in 2021/2022...
You can have a look in the beginning, of this thread, I decided to pull the trigger because official A&K sponsors claimed here that AKConnect would allow me to access to my synology upnp server and music providers like Qobuz ...... it was mostly impossible due to obsolete wifi hardware and android software => no firmware could fix this terrible issue. The amp's power is not at all there as indicated with 12V with no loads.
I still own Fiio M11 and Hiby R6 pro too .. both are working as expected (better than Kann Alpha), but they are missing some amp power like A&K Kann Alpha.

 

[MartyMcfly3004]

Then you can be happy with this dap ... it's totally up to you, but why buy such functionally limited DAP if you don't need 12V output or just play Mid Gain at 20/150 vol level ?

Realise I wasn’t very clear. I meant to distort the sound I had to make the volume around 20/150 higher than I normally would. To around 120/150.

At this volume the music was at vomit inducing levels. I’m thinking South Park brown noise episode. Highly unpleasant.

 

[chi2]

Found some basic measurements of output power of the Kann Alpha by hifinews.co.uk (https://www.astellkern.co.uk/downloads/ak/hfn-kann-alpha.pdf).
Single ended it has 85mW into 32ohm (THD<1%). For a DAP of this size and weight claiming to be able to drive full size headphones that is disappointing. The Qudelix-5K has the same output power (85mW into 33ohm as measured by Amir on ASR) and weighs 26g compared to the 316g of the Kann Alpha. The single ended E1DA 9038D dongle at 12g delivers 155mW into 33ohm. Thats over 80% more.

 

[Onik]

Fiio M17 is out for sale in uk but with a stiff price need to sell my KA soon.

Anyone tried the new M17 and compared with KA? how is the wifi streaming performance?

 

[newworld666]

Fiio M17 is out for sale in uk but with a stiff price need to sell my KA soon.

Anyone tried the new M17 and compared with KA? how is the wifi streaming performance?

I own both ... almost nothing to be comparable between the two ... just weight is in favor of the Kann Alpha and that's all.
The M17 is probably the most complete, up to date and versatile DAP on the market. When plugged in with an external DC12V/3A power supply, it can even compete with some rather good desktop DAC+AMP.

 

[aravaioli]

Found some basic measurements of output power of the Kann Alpha by hifinews.co.uk (https://www.astellkern.co.uk/downloads/ak/hfn-kann-alpha.pdf).
Single ended it has 85mW into 32ohm (THD<1%). For a DAP of this size and weight claiming to be able to drive full size headphones that is disappointing. The Qudelix-5K has the same output power (85mW into 33ohm as measured by Amir on ASR) and weighs 26g compared to the 316g of the Kann Alpha. The single ended E1DA 9038D dongle at 12g delivers 155mW into 33ohm. Thats over 80% more.

Thanks for this article. An enlightening reading indeed, especially the statement "In practice the KANN Alpha clips at 35mW/32ohm (or 1.06V) in the ‘Low’ mode and 85mW/32ohm (or 1.65V) in either the ‘Mid’ or ‘High’ modes" which is really pathetic for its price and size and actually much worse than I thought (the ifi Go Blu has twice the power at 32ohm, 165 mW, and weighs a few grams just as the Qudelix 5K).

The clipping I reported in driving the Dan Clark Audio Aeon RT Closed refers to the balanced output and I wonder how much better that was and if it matches the 245 mW of the Go Blu.

 

[newworld666]

Thanks for this article. An enlightening reading indeed, especially the statement "In practice the KANN Alpha clips at 35mW/32ohm (or 1.06V) in the ‘Low’ mode and 85mW/32ohm (or 1.65V) in either the ‘Mid’ or ‘High’ modes" which is really pathetic for its price and size and actually much worse than I thought (the ifi Go Blu has twice the power at 32ohm, 165 mW, and weighs a few grams just as the Qudelix 5K).

The clipping I reported in driving the Dan Clark Audio Aeon RT Closed refers to the balanced output and I wonder how much better that was and if it matches the 245 mW of the Go Blu.

I use every day the ifi Go Blu in balanced mode with a Senn IE 900... but, I just tried with my DCA Stealth and compared ifi Go Blu with the Kann Alpha and Centrance M8V2=> all are clipping ..
Volume level for a 24ohms impedance headphone in balanced mode are almost similar though M8V2 is > Kann Alpha is a bit >Go Blu), maybe there is a bit less distortion at max vol for the iFi Go Blu than the Kann Alpha, M8V2 just clipping but no significant distortion like the Kann Alpha.
All of this in balanced mode.
In line out mode => there is no clipping at all with the Kann Alpha when I am using a Less BX2+ or THX887 amp in balanced mode as link to the DCA Stealth or HEDDphone one.
And of course, I don't detect any clipping with IE900 or Vision Ears EXT with any of those items...
I would think that only the amp part of the Kann Alpha is like the Wifi module => a real crap, obsolete and for a very limited use.

 

[Onik]

I own both ... almost nothing to be comparable between the two ... just weight is in favor of the Kann Alpha and that's all.
The M17 is probably the most complete, up to date and versatile DAP on the market. When plugged in with an external DC12V/3A power supply, it can even compete with some rather good desktop DAC+AMP.

Btw did you try the Fiio M17 as DAC only mode/Line Out SE/Balanced to more powerful amps? does it work flawlessly when using it on Windows 10, shows bit rate information when playing Flac/DSD files?

Also how is the Wifi streaming performance? any issues like KA?