[UntilThen]

-Is the EL3N better sounding than the OTL? My primary headphones will be the ZMF Auteur & LCD2F.

I wish I could answer the first part of the question but I can't. I've not heard the EL3N amp. The OTL amp on the other hand is such a classy act with LCD2f, Eikon, Atticus and HD800. Beautiful, beautiful sound that I can't get enough. I can only recommend it without reservations, especially now that my 4 chosen drivers are perfectly quiet with six cylinders 6BX7s.

See the picture below of the Gec B36 in action and the other 3 drivers on standby. Today I'm a very happy man because they are all quiet with 6 x 6bx7 now.

As an aside, I'm still deliberating between another EL3N or 2a3 amp. Life has some hard decisions.

 

[Xcalibur255]

But I made it! Last month saw me move in to a new place. Though, I'm not strong enough yet to move my furnishings (mid-June), only a few priorities matter right now: audio gear; three longboards; fridge. Everything else can wait!

Welcome back. Hope things continue to improve for you.

 

[UntilThen]

@Sound Infinity this is a good write up and I enjoy the interactions with fellow audio enthusiasts on their systems.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/2359glenn-studio.600110/page-1256#post-14092808

Last year I went a bit nuts on both HiFi and Head-Fi. I think it has stabilised now. I hope.

 

[gibosi]

="felix3650, post: 14241611, member: 444906"]

-Is the EL3N better sounding than the OTL? My primary headphones will be the ZMF Auteur & LCD2F.

I would suggest that in terms of sound quality, both are topnotch. One is not better than the other, but given that they are designed around different tubes, they do sound somewhat different.

In my opinion, I think it is most useful to think about the EL3N as an output transformer-coupled amp suitable for low-impedance drivers, including loud speakers. That is, there is a transformer between the output tubes and your headphones and/or loudspeakers. And it is important to keep in mind that an output transformer adds some degree of distortion. However, the Lunsdahl brand is among the very best available and if you need to drive loud-speakers and/or inefficient, low-Z headphones the EL3N might very well be the best amp for you.

On the other hand, the OTL is an output transformer-less amp. That is, there is nothing between the output tubes and your headphones, and thus an OTL has lower distortion. On the other hand, since there is no output transformer, it cannot be used to drive loudspeakers and it might not match up well with very inefficient low-Z headphones.

Further, the tube-rolling options with the EL3N are very limited, while with the OTL, the sky is the limit.

Hope this helps with your decision... but perhaps it would be best if you buy both.

 

[felix3650]

I wish I could answer the first part of the question but I can't. I've not heard the EL3N amp. The OTL amp on the other hand is such a classy act with LCD2f, Eikon, Atticus and HD800. Beautiful, beautiful sound that I can't get enough. I can only recommend it without reservations, especially now that my 4 chosen drivers are perfectly quiet with six cylinders 6BX7s.

See the picture below of the Gec B36 in action and the other 3 drivers on standby. Today I'm a very happy man because they are all quiet with 6 x 6bx7 now.

As an aside, I'm still deliberating between another EL3N or 2a3 amp. Life has some hard decisions.

I would suggest that in terms of sound quality, both are topnotch. One is not better than the other, but given that they are designed around different tubes, they do sound somewhat different.

In my opinion, I think it is most useful to think about the EL3N as an output transformer-coupled amp suitable for low-impedance drivers, including loud speakers. That is, there is a transformer between the output tubes and your headphones and/or loudspeakers. And it is important to keep in mind that an output transformer adds some degree of distortion. However, the Lunsdahl brand is among the very best available and if you need to drive loud-speakers and/or inefficient, low-Z headphones the EL3N might very well be the best amp for you.

On the other hand, the OTL is an output transformer-less amp. That is, there is nothing between the output tubes and your headphones, and thus an OTL has lower distortion. On the other hand, since there is no output transformer, it cannot be used to drive loudspeakers and it might not match up well with very inefficient low-Z headphones.

Further, the tube-rolling options with the EL3N are very limited, while with the OTL, the sky is the limit.

Hope this helps with your decision... but perhaps it would be best if you buy both.

Thank you both guys! I won't be driving speakers. My main system would be headphones (at least for the time being). And both of my headphones are easily driven and quite efficient. Probably I would opt for preamp outputs with the OTL if Glenn offers that as an option and go with powered desktop speakers.

Can't afford both unfortunately

 

[leftside]

@felix3650 The GOTL could drive you insane or insanely happy with the amount of tube rolling options. With the ELN (and the 300B) you basically get your set of tubes and you are done. Look at our good friend UT on here. He keeps telling us he's "done" with tube rolling, and then the next day he's straight back at it again! I have the 300B, and it's the best thing since sliced bread. But, I'm also getting the GOTL, and have a bunch of new tubes lined up and ready.

To my ears, the 300B has a very modern sound. Super airy, detailed, wide soundstage, clarity, and hint of warmth with the tubes - amazing! I've listened to a lot of headphone amps and headphones over the years, and it doesn't get better than this. You'll need to make sure you also have good headphones to get the most out of it. There are noticeable differences with this amp as you go up the chain with headphones - whereas with some other amps you might not notice these differences so easily.

With the right tubes in my existing WA22, I can tweak it to sound a little more laid back and romantic. Not sure if you're familiar with McIntosh gear. Their vintage gear has a very distinctive sound, more laid back and romantic. And the newer gear has that more modern sound. I sometimes miss the vintage Mac gear that I used to have, but with the right tubes in the headphone amp I can regain some of that sound without needing to buy a bigger house with a third music room The GOTL will give me even more options - such as the fabulous B36!

 

[UntilThen]

UT's insanely happy. If you want that insane happiness you have to follow me.

Here's a story worth telling. I almost put my order in for a DNA Stratus but I had a rethink about the EL3N amp and I know the thought will always haunt me as to how the EL3N will sound. Besides the Stratus is an insanely one year wait and rolling 2a3 tubes might kill me.

So .... now I am in talks with Glenn about what I want in a EL3N amp. Here are my possible choices:-

. Joe's version with 3 rca input. (Whirlwind)

. Sam's version but with vitamin-Q caps

. Sam's version without speakers output but with 3 rca inputs.

Decisions, decisions....

 

[Xcalibur255]

I would spend my money on the best transformers you can fit in your budget UT. I regret not spending the extra money to do amorphous core trannies on my 45 amp. It's not just a question of resolution, they improve the tone too which is what really matters. I would also have gotten speaker outputs on mine if I could do it all over again. 45s pushing a high sensitivity speaker like Zu or Tekton is probably the sound I've been looking for all this time and I could have left that door open for myself but didn't and now I regret it. It's always good to give yourself options.

As for the stages, I wonder if it's possible to directly couple the two EL3N stages? As they say the best cap is no cap at all.

If that's not possible and you are not shy about spending money then using interstage transformers for coupling is an option too, though one that will make your chassis size bigger.

 

[Silent One]

Welcome back. Hope things continue to improve for you.

I've been touched and inspired by all of your comments...thanks kindly. For me, one of the great things about the audio community is my enthusiasm for the hobby isn't solely dependent on what I have or don't have because I still can share in other's joy and continue to learn from other's adventures. What a satisfying hobby!

 

[UntilThen]

Xcal, thanks for sharing your ideas. Having speakers output is appealing to me more now. I could use high efficiency near field monitors in my study.

Amorphorous core trannies. Is this going to cost me my kidneys? Aren't the Lundahl transformers good enough? Glenn, what do you think?

I am not going to use the Duelund coupling caps. I will go with the more humble vitamin-Q caps.

As for directly coupling the 2 stages, I await to be educated.

Interstage transformers. Isn't that what Jetl is going to do with his specially ordered transformers?

 

[2359glenn]

UT's insanely happy. If you want that insane happiness you have to follow me.

Here's a story worth telling. I almost put my order in for a DNA Stratus but I had a rethink about the EL3N amp and I know the thought will always haunt me as to how the EL3N will sound. Besides the Stratus is an insanely one year wait and rolling 2a3 tubes might kill me.

So .... now I am in talks with Glenn about what I want in a EL3N amp. Here are my possible choices:-

. Joe's version with 3 rca input. (Whirlwind)

. Sam's version but with vitamin-Q caps

. Sam's version without speakers output but with 3 rca inputs.

Decisions, decisions....

If you want I can build you a 2A3 amp or 45 amp with Lundahl transformers and use a 6SN7 driver with multi voltage switch.

 

[2359glenn]

I would spend my money on the best transformers you can fit in your budget UT. I regret not spending the extra money to do amorphous core trannies on my 45 amp. It's not just a question of resolution, they improve the tone too which is what really matters. I would also have gotten speaker outputs on mine if I could do it all over again. 45s pushing a high sensitivity speaker like Zu or Tekton is probably the sound I've been looking for all this time and I could have left that door open for myself but didn't and now I regret it. It's always good to give yourself options.

As for the stages, I wonder if it's possible to directly couple the two EL3N stages? As they say the best cap is no cap at all.

If that's not possible and you are not shy about spending money then using interstage transformers for coupling is an option too, though one that will make your chassis size bigger.

If you get speakers 12 to 16 ohm you can plug them into the headphone jack

 

[UntilThen]

If you want I can build you a 2A3 amp or 45 amp with Lundahl transformers and use a 6SN7 driver with multi voltage switch.

Geezus, my excitement level just jump many notches.

So expand on this for me. How many 2a3 or 45 tubes involved? Single driver tube or dual. Any rectifiers in this?

Obviously this is transformer coupled right?

 

[2359glenn]

Hi Matt

Have to decide push pull or single ended or parallel single ended I prefer the sound of single ended myself push pull = more power.
What tube a 2A3 is really parallel 45s even if you look inside the 2A3 you can see it is two 45s inside except mono plate.
There is also the 6A3 or 6B4 that is a 2A3 with a 6 volt heater these might be cheaper? easier to build the heater DC power supply
less current at 6 volts.
then what driver 6SN7 , C3g , EL3n ???

Think about it
Am I driving you crazy yet? most anything is doable.
Glenn

 

[UntilThen]

I'm trying to dig up Xcal 45 tube amp picture to see how it looks.