[dosquito]

Quote:

Originally Posted by luidge /img/forum/go_quote.gif HD580 and other Senn best dynamic headphones require good amplification to shine IMO. If you listen to them without much power they won't be a lot better than cheap headphones because they are not reaching their potential. My advice would be to buy a cheap dedicated headphone amp. If you don't want to use any amp in between your source and your headphones, i would suggest trading your HD580 for a pair of Grado or allessandro. Good luck in improving your sound without bitching about people who find their way in this hobby. Amicalement Luidge

the bloat should be supplying comparable amplification to anything else around its price (~$250 upgraded)

 

[ericj]

Quote:

Originally Posted by edgar67 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Is it really backwards if "Insanity could also be..."?

It's just a blazingly stupid statement.

I hear people parroting "Well, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results" and i have a reflexive need to smack them upside the head.

"Insanity" is a term used (unscientifically) to refer to the whole spectrum of maladaptive behavior and thought.

And frankly, there is no shortage of real world situations where doing the same thing over and over is required, and plenty of situations where the expectation of a possible different result is warranted. We live in an inconsistent world, and some people, myself included, exist in an economic space where the identification of inconsistencies is required and advantageous.

People who always expect something unlikely are clearly insane, but represent a small fraction of the nutters wandering the streets.

/rant off

 

[Wmcmanus]

Is it just me, or am I missing something? I really wouldn't expect to hear much of a difference when moving from the HD485 to the HD580. Sure, there could be some minor improvements, but you should be hearing the same Sennheiser 'house sound'; to hear significant improvements, the HD650 would be the way to go. Either that, or try an entirely different brand of headphones that are not married to that same design philosophy.

Note that I'm not being critical of the OP. I'm just wondering why he would have been led to believe that there would be dramatic improvements based on the changes that he made? Yes, he upgraded his source and amplification as well, but again, not in any dramatic way.

So to my way of thinking, he should be been expecting to hear EXACTLY what he did hear: incremental improvements. This is what I would expect if I moved up just a couple of notches in the product line of a company that has a well known house sound.

Maybe I'm just out of date. For one, I haven't read any threads about the HD485 or HD580 in a long time (if ever). Perhaps some of our newer members are now exaggerating how great the HD580 are. But as far as I can remember, they have always been regarded as mid-fi headphones, or (at best), Sennheiser's entry level high-end product.

Thus, if going from HD485 to HD580, I'd expect to move from mid-mid-fi to high-mid-fi or low-high-fi. In other words, incremental improvement, just as delivered. In fact, I suspect this is pretty much what Sennheiser had in mind when developing each of these products.

 

[fraseyboy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by luidge /img/forum/go_quote.gif HD580 and other Senn best dynamic headphones require good amplification to shine IMO. If you listen to them without much power they won't be a lot better than cheap headphones because they are not reaching their potential. My advice would be to buy a cheap dedicated headphone amp. If you don't want to use any amp in between your source and your headphones, i would suggest trading your HD580 for a pair of Grado or allessandro. Good luck in improving your sound without bitching about people who find their way in this hobby. Amicalement Luidge

I disagree. My HD580's sound no different with my LD MKII than straight out of my H120.

 

[donunus]

I agree that the hd580/600 amping is overrated. of course an amp will give it more power and volume but the sound is not changed from veiled to suddenly "open"... like a lot of headfiers claim. The hd600s sounds almost the same balancewise using my gilmore lite with dps compared to my laptops headphone jack. volume and refinement are improved with the amp but nothing uncommon that other headphones dont show.

 

[major_works]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rds /img/forum/go_quote.gif Glenn Gould's recording are generally poor quality. So things sounding less than real is probably attributable to the recording rather than your equipment. Try the Goldberg Variations Recreation if you have it. An amazing recording in binaural too!

I've been listening to a lot of Gould in the past year, having picked up the amazing 80-CD box set of his entire Columbia catalog. I have to disagree with you. I think Gould was rather well-recorded for the most part. Yes, he liked, on occasion, to play little games with microphone placement, etc., but he had excellent producers (Andrew Kazmin, for one).

 

[analogbox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree that the hd580/600 amping is overrated. of course an amp will give it more power and volume but the sound is not changed from veiled to suddenly "open"... like a lot of headfiers claim. The hd600s sounds almost the same balancewise using my gilmore lite with dps compared to my laptops headphone jack. volume and refinement are improved with the amp but nothing uncommon that other headphones dont show.

It maybe true that sound signatures hardly change by amping HD580/HD600. But it's not just the volume that quality amps provide to those headphones. The biggest difference by amping the phones, in my case, were the more cleaner sound and wider soundstage. Feeding my HD600 and HD650 from the Glow amp sounds more focused and immense than feeding it from my Corda Move, never mind my Powerbook or PC. To me, that was worth the price of admission.

 

[analogbox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dosquito /img/forum/go_quote.gif wow. that seems to make quite the difference. that foam looks cheap anyway and it is pretty thick. i don't want my drivers to get damaged though. is there some sort of replacement foam or maybe nylon thing that I can cut out and just put in its place? omg...miles davis kind of blue sounds SO good without the foam. is there anyone who actually prefers having the foam in your HD580/HD600? could you please tell me the differences you've noticed. i have trouble believing sennheiser engineers would put that stuff in there if they could have spent 2 cents more for a thinner foam

I don't remember the model number but I know some of the low Senn models have thinner foam discs than that of HD580/600/650. They have different shapes but you can probably cut it to fit. The previous owner of my HD600 had already installed hand-cutted glassfiber mesh cloths in place of regular foam discs and I think it's a perfect combination. You can easily get this from any hardware stores, I believe.

 

[beg2differ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gilency /img/forum/go_quote.gif I sincerely believe that Fritz should be in a mental hospital. He should not be allowed to have so many headphones. It is insane. It is against nature. They should be distributed amongst the rest of headfiers. I'll take first dibs since a feel duty bound to help him get rid of those nasty headphones!

I will second that. lol.

I have to say that I understand what dosquito is trying to point out though.
For "normal" people, who can't really identify nuances and the slightest details in the music that they listen to, there really would be no point in trying to upgrade their cans.

Personally, I wish my hearing was better so that I can notice those things a lot better and be more satisfied with my phones and have an excuse to keep upgrading. lol

 

[Henmyr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolchu001 /img/forum/go_quote.gif snip... "Being $200 richer wouldn't give me the happiness these headphones gives to me" ...snip

I will remember this line next time I feel poor

Quote:

Originally Posted by beg2differ /img/forum/go_quote.gif I will second that. lol. I have to say that I understand what dosquito is trying to point out though. For "normal" people, who can't really identify nuances and the slightest details in the music that they listen to, there really would be no point in trying to upgrade their cans. Personally, I wish my hearing was better so that I can notice those things a lot better and be more satisfied with my phones and have an excuse to keep upgrading. lol

Before I got my first setup (DT990 + Headfive), I was also very unexperienced. Not only with headphones, but with hifi in general. I sure did appreciate the upgrade DT990 did on PX100/PortaPro.

What I experienced was bass on an whole other level, clarity, clearer midrange, MUCH larger soundstage, and I was just un unexperienced newbie back then (I might still be a newbie, but a much more experienced newbie).

I would very much recommend "normal" "lesser" people to upgrade their cans. I would tell them everything I know about hifi so far and then give them a push in the right direction.

My brother for exemple. He have tried both my MS2i and DT880. He have mostly said "oh, this sound rather good" and not given it a second thought. Recently I had him listen to my AD2000, and he was like "hooooly shiiiiit!" and was stunned for a while and then said "Oh damn, maybe I too will have to get these

". And with this, I mean that it is all about finding a sound you like. If the R10 is the wrong sound for a particular person, he/she might not appreciate the upgrade from KSC75->R10, but might love Alessandro MS1.

 

[DefectiveAudioComponent]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree that the hd580/600 amping is overrated. of course an amp will give it more power and volume but the sound is not changed from veiled to suddenly "open"... like a lot of headfiers claim. The hd600s sounds almost the same balancewise using my gilmore lite with dps compared to my laptops headphone jack. volume and refinement are improved with the amp but nothing uncommon that other headphones dont show.

There is no veil.

 

[wrecked_porsche]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DefectiveAudioComponent /img/forum/go_quote.gif There is no veil.

x2

Only bad amplification and missing synergy.

 

[Henmyr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrecked_porsche /img/forum/go_quote.gif x2 Only bad amplification and missing synergy.

The only time I've heard a Sennheiser "veiled" was the HD650 in a store. It had stock cable and was powered by X-Can V3 and some cd-player. The veil in upper midrange was very noticable then.

The HD650 I had had an Oehlbach. Not even with Headfive (which is not an optimal pairing with HD650) would I've classified them as veiled, not even compared to DT880. I do not feel that the HD600 I have now is veiled either. Both the HD650 I had and the HD600 I have now were/are the old version.

I though that X-Can v3 + HD650 was a good pairing? I have no idea why I heard the veil.

 

[wrecked_porsche]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrecked_porsche /img/forum/go_quote.gif Only bad amplification and missing synergy.

What I'm trying to say is that the "veil" is a result of bad amplification and lack of synergy IMO.
I've heard both cases before; veiled and non veiled.

OT already....

Anyway, let's not go there....

 

[Young Spade]

I am new to the site and the massive spending of money for headphones and music related stuff but I now see what all the fuss is about.

I now have no problem shelling out hundreds of bucks for sound because its some of the best enjoyment that I have had ever. That and video games.

(I am only 16 so I have a long way to go)