[GnuB]

I realize that there are many of these threads already, but I need a little more focus than what I have been able to glean from thread research.  I posted it here in the Headphone Amp thread because I view this as a Headphone amp with input versatility rather than as a "dedicated source" issue.
 
 
I am looking for a 1-piece, combination Headphone amp / DAC that will be used as a stand-alone unit (not as a DAC driving another amp) driving inexpensive, middle of the road, low impedance headphones (ER4P, HD555, etc).  The sources I will be using are DAP's, a Netbook, CD player w/ analog out and/or DVD player with SPDIF out.  Most of the time I will use it to listen to VBR WMA rips but occasionally will want to kick back with my favorite CD.
 
Inputs in order of importance: Analog, USB, SPDIF Coax, SPDIF Optical.
Criteria in order of importance: SQ of the Headphone amp, convenience of hookup and operation, build quality/durability.
 
The sound signature that I enjoy would lean toward the detailed but warm sound.  I am listening to a Corda Move on both the ER4P's and the HD555s now and think that combination does pretty well for vocal presentation, instrument separation and detail.  The only downfall is that it looses a little resolution on complex passages with a lot of instruments.  But the point is that I would be satisfied with an amp with a similar or better sound signature.
 
Of the reviews I have read (and a grateful nod to those head-fiers that have contributed their time and effort into creating the reviews), I think the following products offer the versatility that I am looking for within the realm of possibility for my wallet.
 
Matrix Cube Dac / Amp.
Yulong D100 (My mistake, doesn't include an analog in.)
Maverick Audio D1
Audio-GD Fun
 
Aune Mini USB/DAC Headphone Amp (Recent addition to the list. Has analog in but SPDIF is coax, not optical but the price point is reasonable)
 
I think all of these can be had for $500 or less. I would be interested in hearing from owners of these units what issues they have had with them in real life with regard to quality, interaction with the manufacturer / seller if any and suitablity for the headphones I have mentioned that might be helpful to me in making a purchase decision. 

 

[Caphead78]

Audio GD is coming out with another combo unit, the NFB-11. Only $260 and probably worth your consideration if you are already thinking of the Fun.
Quote:

I realize that there are many of these threads already, but I need a little more focus than what I have been able to glean from thread research.  I posted it here in the Headphone Amp thread because I view this as a Headphone amp with input versatility rather than as a "dedicated source" issue.
 
Matrix Cube Dac / Amp.
Yulong D100
Maverick Audio D1
Audio-GD Fun
 
I think all of these can be had for $500 or less. I would be interested in hearing from owners of these units what issues they have had with them in real life with regard to quality, interaction with the manufacturer / seller if any and suitablity for the headphones I have mentioned that might be helpful to me in making a purchase decision. 
 

 

[GnuB]

Quote:

Audio GD is coming out with another combo unit, the NFB-11. Only $260 and probably worth your consideration if you are already thinking of the Fun.

I looked at it on the web site.  It has a discrete headphone circuit and a Sabre DAC so it "sounds" good on paper but it is hard to get a feel from the specs and broken english descriptions whether I would be interested or not. 
 
I see from your sources list that you have a NFB-3.  I didn't see that on their site.  Is it a DAC?
 
 

 

[Caphead78]

Yes it is, I listed it a bit prematurely though because it probably wont ship until later this week.
There is a head-fi forum on the NFB-11 here: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/516886/audio-gd-nfb-11
 
Quote:

I looked at it on the web site.  It has a discrete headphone circuit and a Sabre DAC so it "sounds" good on paper but it is hard to get a feel from the specs and broken english descriptions whether I would be interested or not. 
 
I see from your sources list that you have a NFB-3.  I didn't see that on their site.  Is it a DAC?
 
 

 

[ThePunisher]

Hi, I have one of the "other threads" and I'm also looking at both the FUN and D1 as options within my budget. Good luck finding help and making a decision, I've found a general lack of help in the few threads I've made. If I purchase either of the above DAC/amp units I will be sure to let you know how I like it.

 

[Currawong]

You will probably find, down in the low range of gear, that everything gets a bit flustered with complex passages in music.  A headphone amp needs a pretty serious power supply for this not to happen (preferably not sharing its power with a DAC as well).  That ends up pushing your budget closer to double.  However, you aren't going to realise much benefit until you get better headphones, which I'd consider doing first.  For $500 I'd find a second-hand pair of HD-600s and take the NFB11 at the promo price while it's there.  Later on you can use the NFB-11 as a DAC for a better HP amp.

 

[lepel]

are you like tube ?

when you like , try Maverick Audio D1 = estimate $200 + roll tube + roll op-amp = $250

or Maverick Audio D1 + Maverick TubeMagic A1 Amplifier = estimate $450
 
Quote:

Mav D1 info : http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/470639/maverick-audio-tubemagic-d1-dac-amp-condensed-faq-and-info-thread

 

[ThePunisher]

Quote:

are you like tube ?

when you like , try Maverick Audio D1 = estimate $200 + roll tube + roll op-amp = $250
 

 
The tube on the D1 is only for the preamp, the headphone out is SS, and OP said he will be using headphones.
 

 

[GnuB]

Quote:

  Yes it is, I listed it a bit prematurely though because it probably wont ship until later this week. There is a head-fi forum on the NFB-11 here: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/516886/audio-gd-nfb-11

 
I took a closer look.  It doesn't have analog in so doesn't fit my needs so I will continue looking.
 
Thanks

 

 

[GnuB]

Quote:

when you like , try Maverick Audio D1 = estimate $200 + roll tube + roll op-amp = $250
or Maverick Audio D1 + Maverick TubeMagic A1 Amplifier = estimate $450 

 
Lepel,
 
 
Thanks for your comments.  Obviously you have a lot of respect for the D1 but here are some comments gleaned from reviews on the Maverick D1 Headphone amp:  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/507905/maverick-d1-for-headphone that make me want to give it a little more consideration before I buy it.
 
"the headphone out from the D1 isn't very good.  But holy cow when you pair the D1's tube-preout with another amp it sounds amazing!"  This one echoes your recommendation of pairing the D1 and A1 which may be an option I will consider.
 
"I found the D1 to be a monumental disappointment despite its price point.  Maybe I got a total dud, but there wasn't much I liked about it.  I gave it away to a friend.  The headphone jack had a terrible and persistent hum.  I also thought it was overly bright."  The poster may not have  given it enough time to burn in or may have had unreasonable expectations for the price point. 
 
"I thought the headphone out of the D1 was a little bass shy and bright, but with a (cheap) OPAMP swap it changes alot. Though, the tube output of the Mav with a good tube like the upgrade GE or the WE396a vastly improves its SQ."  This comment goes along with your suggestion of rolling the op-amp and tube.  Again, a worthy option to consider.
 
Anyhow, I haven't eliminated the D1 as a possibility.
 
 
 
 

 

[GnuB]

Quote:

 Hi, I have one of the "other threads" and I'm also looking at both the FUN and D1 as options within my budget. Good luck finding help and making a decision, I've found a general lack of help in the few threads I've made. If I purchase either of the above DAC/amp units I will be sure to let you know how I like it.

 
I also will post here the results of my research and purchase decision.  It looks like I am getting some valuable suggestions to consider.  There is no clear front runner at the moment.
 

 

[GnuB]

Quote:

  You will probably find, down in the low range of gear, that everything gets a bit flustered with complex passages in music.  A headphone amp needs a pretty serious power supply for this not to happen (preferably not sharing its power with a DAC as well).  That ends up pushing your budget closer to double.  However, you aren't going to realise much benefit until you get better headphones, which I'd consider doing first.  For $500 I'd find a second-hand pair of HD-600s and take the NFB11 at the promo price while it's there.  Later on you can use the NFB-11 as a DAC for a better HP amp.

 
Currawong,
 
It is hard for me to admit that I would just be satisfied with a middle of the road, all-in-one headphone amp / dac to go along with the HD555's without crushing my inner audiophile, and I totally agree that better headphones without a doubt would be a better option in the long run but restraint is in order.  If I bought 600s, 650s or 800s then I would absolutely have to have a higher end amp to do them justice because they would make the flaws in lower end equipment painfully obvious.  Then comes the need for a better digital source and a high-end dac to get the most benefit  from the source.  And then there are the interconnects and cabling and high quality power sources and I would have to re-rip all of my CD's to lossless and upgrade my DAP to play them.  Then would come higher quality IEMs to listen to the DAP with the lossless files.  Pretty soon my quest for a simple all-in-one headphone amp / dac to go along with the HD555s is way out of hand.  Someday I might be able to go there but not today.  To quote another reviewer "At some point you reach the best price to performance ratio, and it starts costing quite a bit of money to buy incremental improvements after that point."  Right now I think I will be satisfied (for a time) with the price / performance of the HD555's and one of the amp/dacs I listed above or perhaps this one at an even lower price point.  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/438473/info-on-the-aune-usb-dac-amp  I wish it were otherwise.
 
Anyhow, I really appreciate the head-fi community and the breadth of experience represented here.  On the good side, it provides a wealth of information about the entire spectrum of audio equipment at all price points.  On the bad side... well there is my wallet.
 
 
 
 

 

[GnuB]

Quote:

  For $500 I'd find a second-hand pair of HD-600s .....

 
OK. I MAY need to back-peddle on my last post, but then again....  
 
I found HD600s new for $308 and HD650s new for $320 which is way more reasonable than I previously expected.  But.. If the 600s/650s at three times the price I paid for the 555s are better by a substantial margin, then wouldn't the 800s ($1300) at 4 times the price of the 600/650s be substantially better than the 600/650s?  Where does it stop?  Is there really satisfaction to be had at the 600/650 price point?  Or do I have to go all the way to the 800s?  Then what about Grado and Beyerdynamic phones....?   And electrostatics...?  I am not really sure what point I am trying to make here, but clearly there is no clear "best" choice.  I am happy for those who can afford the best of the best but I just want to listen to some music.

 

 

[Caphead78]

If you watch the FS forums you can find even better deals on the senns. I got my 650s in perfect condition for $250 and yes, there is plenty of satisfaction to be had there.
 
I am curious as to why analog in is so important to you. you said you would be using a CD player to feed the amp, but have a DVD player w/ digital out. Do you just have a very very good CD player that you want to utilize the DAC of?
Quote:

 
OK. I MAY need to back-peddle on my last post, but then again....  
 
I found HD600s new for $308 and HD650s new for $320 which is way more reasonable than I previously expected.  But.. If the 600s/650s at three times the price I paid for the 555s are better by a substantial margin, then wouldn't the 800s ($1300) at 4 times the price of the 600/650s be substantially better than the 600/650s?  Where does it stop?  Is there really satisfaction to be had at the 600/650 price point?  Or do I have to go all the way to the 800s?  Then what about Grado and Beyerdynamic phones....?   And electrostatics...?  I am not really sure what point I am trying to make here, but clearly there is no clear "best" choice.  I am happy for those who can afford the best of the best but I just want to listen to some music.

 

 

[GnuB]

 
I like the Aune and right now it is the front-runner. It looks like it will deliver reasonable performance at a reasonable price.  I have perused every thread I could find on the unit, and keeping in mind the axiom that "Your Mileage May Vary", it is apparent that most of the owners of the unit have expressed satisfaction with the results they heard. 
 
 One upgrade I am considering that seems to provide "hearable" improvements would be to replace the 2604 with dual OPA627's on a brown dog in the headphone circuit.
 
 "The 627 was like looking at a beautiful painting of the place rather than a photograph. You need to understand that the painting may not be 100% accurate but is a work of art while the photograph maybe a better representation of what you see but it may lack that warmth that the painting can convey."
 
 
 Anyhoo, that's my thoughts for now.
 
One final thought...  The price point of the Aune is such that getting the HD600 or HD650 may be a consideration so that is another point in its favor.