[johnjen]

My only reservation with regards to spinning discs either digital or analog is mostly to do with the fuss factor AND especially in the case of digital, adding a DSP stack in between the spinner and the dac.
Because at this point with the results I'm able to achieve using carefully dialed in DSP tricks (PRT, HP compensation EQ, SSBB, and down sampling (where needed) etc.), results in a most compelling SQ presentation, that I wouldn't want to give up
And this degree of having the entire system dialed in is only possible when these tweaks are part of the package.

So when the very bottom end couples and is coherent and cohesive with everything above it, on a 'voice' by 'voice' basis, the results are quite sublime.

Of course the downside is that SuperDuperSuperGlue results in long listening nights
JJ

 

[alpovs]

Streaming is very useful for discovery of new music. How else?

 

[wink]

..... youtube......

 

[Locutus73]

I have always preferred the sound of a spinning disc to a stream. This is despite – the inconvenience to maintain a physical library only to then locate, pick, and play a CD.

I find this an interesting starting point for a discussion. I don’t mean that my observations apply to you in particular, but your words are a starting point. We are all (like many mammals) creatures of habit, our brains feel a comfortable pleasure when exposed to repetitive inputs so we feel good with our habits and our rituals. This is a scientific objective fact, nothing mystical; for instance, part of the smoking addiction resides in its rituality. Now physical media bring with them a sort of ritual: taking time looking at the hardly earned collection, smelling the scent, touching the case, the booklet, the vinyl or the CD, manually operating the player, possibly waiting for the tubes to warm up. This ritual makes our brain feel good (probably stimulating the production of endorphins, I might be wrong) and since we listen mostly with our brain, this can objectively alter our subjective perception of music, improving it regardless of the physical characteristics of the pressure waves that stimulate our ears... and if the ritual is harmless, why not?

Then there is the fetishist aspect (I don’t mean anything negative) of the physical media. I’m the first who, for instance, buys expensive Radiohead boxsets filled with CDs, vinyls, magnetic tapes, art prints, just for the pleasure of having them… you know, my preciousss… and then I actually listen to the (uncompressed and unwatermarked) digital downloads they offer the moment you complete the online payment for the preorder.

If all audio hobbyists were attuned to the logic and science of @Locutus73, I would be out of the business of making audio products;

Let me disagree with this statement… well, uhm, I’m joking, but you actually wouldn’t be out of business with me since I’m both a new head-fier and a new schiit-head with my lovely Bimby Gen5+Valhalla 2 stack… and yes I feel pleasure looking at the warm red glowing tubes.

I should be retired; I do not have to work. I do it for fun.

You’re a lucky man.

I am confident we can recognize our differences and remain cordial

I think that all the discussion was conducted cordially. Actually I find the whole forum unusually (and
pleasantly) friendly and cordial comparing to what I read in other places.

His logical asseveration stands up and is in particular proper for the sound science threads on other areas of this forum, where others dbeate over who is right and right absolutely.
[...]
As a new user of HeadFi, he may find many more kindred folks in Sound Science.

Excuse me if I don’t understand, I’m not an English native speaker; are you suggesting me to follow one more thread that I might find interesting or are you inviting me to move?



Regards
Locutus73

 

[Locutus73]

I don’t think all tracks on Tidal are watermarked.

Yes, not all tracks are watermarked. It depends on what the music labels upload to them.

Isn’t it only that one label?

DISCLAIMER: my sources are Internet articles and posts so they might be wrong.

It seems that Sony is the other major that uses watermarks (see https://www.wired.com/2008/01/drm-is-dead-but-watermarks-rise-from-its-ashes/), but I don’t see many complaints about that (I don't know why, maybe they use a less audible watermark or maybe this is just a very old article). Sony did eviler things in the past, does anyone remember the scandal for the rooktit they put on some CDs (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal)?
On the other hand it seems that not all Universal music is watermarked; on some posts somewhere I read that some music that previously was watermarked now is not watermarked; someone hypothesized that the now unwatermarked songs are the ones they’re reuploading since they are releasing both new MQA and non MQA versions. Who knows…



I think that all this issue is not emerging in the industry with the right level of attention.
Recently something similar happened in the gaming industry, with Electronic Arts publishing the new Star Wars Battlefront 2 game crippled with micro transactions and loot boxes, actually screwing the users with a subpar experience. This generated a general s**t-storm, with users on the warpath, very bad reviews from the online media (see http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-4/star-wars-battlefront-ii) and with the Belgian government investigating if loot boxes and micro transactions have to be considered like gambling. Disney CEO called EA CEO and a second later the micro transactions (but not the loot boxes) were gone. This to say that s**t-storms and bad publicity can move the industry.



Locutus73

 

[Brubacca]

I have always preferred the sound of a spinning disc to a stream. This is despite – the inconvenience to maintain a physical library only to then locate, pick, and play a CD. The promise of convenience with online streaming has been a wet dream of sonic performance. I also realize that the prior opinion is just that, and not proven logical fact.

I don't think you are alone in this. I have always thought that the act of transmitting a file across an ethernet wire degraded the sound. Ethernet by its nature deconstructs a file and puts it back together. I have always wanted someone to manufacture a CD player per se for files. (Not to be confused with a CD player for CDs). Meaning a device with an actual remote control, and actual screen to navigate and select songs. Basically you locally plug in a USB drive or local hard drive and sit back and enjoy. No app control required, no ethernet/internet required. Something similar to the Bryston line of digital players, but affordable and designed primarily to be controlled locally.

@Baldr I guess what I am saying/asking is do you despise the sound of a computer file (flac, wav, whatever) or is the transport medium (internet, ethernet wire) killing the sound?

 

[Baldr]

Excuse me if I don’t understand, I’m not an English native speaker; are you suggesting me to follow one more thread that I might find interesting or are you inviting me to move?

Locutus73

To the contrary, please remain! I only mentioned the other threads because they pay attention to minutiae and are quite analytical, an approach I thought which may appeal to your sense of detail and logic. That, in contrast to my more general approach. Those threads are classic proponents of themes of those with which I strongly disagree in a general sense, and with which I agree on many of the details and underlying tenets.

All are welcome on this thread, and it is, I am confident, among the least censured and the most cordial. Not much debate going on here. I hope that those who visit here can take as much away as I have received from all of you.

 

[MWSVette]

To the contrary, please remain! I only mentioned the other threads because they pay attention to minutiae and are quite analytical, an approach I thought which may appeal to your sense of detail and logic. That, in contrast to my more general approach. Those threads are classic proponents of themes of those with which I strongly disagree in a general sense, and with which I agree on many of the details and underlying tenets.

All are welcome on this thread, and it is, I am confident, among the least censured and the most cordial. Not much debate going on here. I hope that those who visit here can take as much away as I have received from all of you.

Lack of censorship on this and Jason's threads are why they are my favorites.

And please do not retire until the thrill is gone. Then enjoy your well earned time.

Until that day comes please keep designing new Schiit for us to enjoy...

 

[alpovs]

Streaming is very useful for discovery of new music. How else?

..... youtube......

I don't think youtube has what Tidal has, especially classic music, and in Tidal quality. Try uploading anything copyrighted to youtube - it gets blocked automatically.

 

[alpovs]

Lack of censorship on this and Jason's threads...

That's naive. You never noticed some messages were removed?

 

[MWSVette]

That's naive. You never noticed some messages were removed?

Yes, I have...

However the posts that I have observed being deleted were seldom removed by either Mike or Jason. Most deleted post are done by the site MOD's. The only ones I have ever seen removed by Mike or Jason were either sexist, political or just plain rude. And in those cases I would have deleted them also.

And at this point in my life I am well past naïve.

While the Schiit threads are my favorites there are others on Head-fi that do not share Mike and Jason's belief in limited censorship and I have observed considerably more deleted on those other threads.

Rant over...

 

[GearMe]

To the contrary, please remain! I only mentioned the other threads because they pay attention to minutiae and are quite analytical, an approach I thought which may appeal to your sense of detail and logic. That, in contrast to my more general approach. Those threads are classic proponents of themes of those with which I strongly disagree in a general sense, and with which I agree on many of the details and underlying tenets.

All are welcome on this thread, and it is, I am confident, among the least censured and the most cordial. Not much debate going on here. I hope that those who visit here can take as much away as I have received from all of you.

This!

...makes it the best thread on Head-Fi

 

[MWSVette]

This!

...makes it the best thread on Head-Fi

Agreed 100%...

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

and since we listen mostly with our brain

We listen to music with our brains and our brains only.
But the brain has many inputs and sensor equipment attached to it, including a second (intestinal) brain.

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

does anyone remember the scandal for the rooktit they put on some CDs

Had to read this a few times before I was convinced.
A rooktit is the mammalian nipple for feeding newborn chess pieces.