Westone 4: Questions

[Freefallr4545]

As we all know Tight Seals are essential. If your seal is "OK" and not "real Good" you will not get the best sound in these Ba's

 

[WisdomListens]

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Therein lies one problem. I have a 32GB iPhone4, and don't use lossless on it for any music. I use anywhere from 192-320k AAC or MP3, and it sounds fine. I am really not a major believer in lossless for my iPhone, because my ears are apparently too lousy to really hear the difference. Having said that, I have a 160GB iPod Classic 7G I use with my Leckerton UHA-4 amp or to play on my Pure i-20 transport (hooked to home stereo systems), and for that I have ripped most of my CDs to ALAC (actually converted them from flac). But that is for listening through speakers and not on the go. I hardly ever use the iPod Classic/Amp anywhere but home because the iPhone sounds so good. Sell the iPhone and get a 32GB model, and transcode all the ALAC into AAC 256. Or, wait for the iPhone 5 and see if they offer a 64GB model. You can always sell the iPhone 4 and get the upgrade. Since I got the iPhone, portable music players have become really superfluous because to me, the iPhone sounds great, lossy tracks and all.
 
What's this have to do with the W4? I use the W4 for most of my portable listening, and as you have heard, it is superb with the iPhone 4. No amp required.

Whats it have to do with the W4: Well earlier jamesta said that some amplifiers change the soundstage of the W4 to more concert hall-like and since the amps that he suggested were the same price as the W4's they proved to be an impractical upgrade. Since I'm already looking for an audio player with lots of storage I might as well ask if theres an audio player that changes the soundstage.
 
And 32GB still will not be enough since my music collection is getting bottlenecked by my 16GB limit and I predict my collection will rapidly grow once I have a player big enough to hold it all. I do think that some classical tracks noticeably lose quality when not in lossless.
 
Yeah I agree that the W4's sound great on iPhone alone but since I need more storage I thought I could kill 2 birds with 1 stone by also getting a different musical presentation. If I could find a player to make the soundstage more concert hall-like then the player would primarily be for my ever growing classical collection.

 
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As we all know Tight Seals are essential. If your seal is "OK" and not "real Good" you will not get the best sound in these Ba's

Alright well most of the time they are suctioned into my ears so I think thats real good. Not perfect, but real good.

 

[lazysleepyboi]

 
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Whats it have to do with the W4: Well earlier jamesta said that some amplifiers change the soundstage of the W4 to more concert hall-like and since the amps that he suggested were the same price as the W4's they proved to be an impractical upgrade. Since I'm already looking for an audio player with lots of storage I might as well ask if theres an audio player that changes the soundstage.
 
And 32GB still will not be enough since my music collection is getting bottlenecked by my 16GB limit and I predict my collection will rapidly grow once I have a player big enough to hold it all. I do think that some classical tracks noticeably lose quality when not in lossless.
 
Yeah I agree that the W4's sound great on iPhone alone but since I need more storage I thought I could kill 2 birds with 1 stone by also getting a different musical presentation. If I could find a player to make the soundstage more concert hall-like then the player would primarily be for my ever growing classical collection.

 


Alright well most of the time they are suctioned into my ears so I think thats real good. Not perfect, but real good.

well reall good isn't perfect, but it's all a matter of what you're willing to spend. For you, you seem like you're mostly directed at getting a player that can suit your needs. I would suggest getting a ipod classic that has i think 120 or 160 gb of storage. In the future, you can do what other people do and connect it with an amplifier. The best thing would be to get something that will have a placement in your future setups. 
 
edit: the hifiman 601/602/801 wouldn't be practical for you since they cap out at 32gb. They sound really really concert like, but they wont fit your need for storage. Also, cowon players don't really fit that quota for storage either. For me, i go for sound quality over storage, but your needs are different from mine

 

[WisdomListens]

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well reall good isn't perfect, but it's all a matter of what you're willing to spend. For you, you seem like you're mostly directed at getting a player that can suit your needs. I would suggest getting a ipod classic that has i think 120 or 160 gb of storage. In the future, you can do what other people do and connect it with an amplifier. The best thing would be to get something that will have a placement in your future setups. 
 
edit: the hifiman 601/602/801 wouldn't be practical for you since they cap out at 32gb. They sound really really concert like, but they wont fit your need for storage. Also, cowon players don't really fit that quota for storage either. For me, i go for sound quality over storage, but your needs are different from mine

Yeah I'm most likely going to get an iPod classic with the hopes of getting an amp in the future. Don't know much about the choices of audio players nowadays so just wanted to see whats available.

 

[jamesta]

 
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Wow those amps cost as much as the Westone 4's! Do you know of any music players that will do the equivalent to soundstage?

Hence the recommendation to use the money to save up for ES5

 

[jamesta]

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Originally Posted by cliffroyroycole /img/forum/go_quote.gif
...just hoping Apple enlarges the iPhone 5 to 64GB, which will be enough for me.
 


 

 
You & me both, brother!

 

[WisdomListens]

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Hence the recommendation to use the money to save up for ES5

Wouldn't the ES5 have a bigger improvement with amping? haha

 

[BrianMB]

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Originally Posted by WisdomListens /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
And 32GB still will not be enough since my music collection is getting bottlenecked by my 16GB limit and I predict my collection will rapidly grow once I have a player big enough to hold it all. I do think that some classical tracks noticeably lose quality when not in lossless.
 
As to quality loss for tracks not in lossless... I would say it is certainly noticeable! A friend had borrowed me his copy of the Avatar soundtrack by James Horner, ripped in 320kbps mp3. There were numerous tracks where when the full orchestra was playing and there was a large crescendo that I could hear an almost static like sound from the track. I've since picked up the soundtrack for myself, ripped it into ALAC, and voila, no problems. Listening with my iphone 4 and Westone 4s, Klipsch Custom 3s and Etymotic HF3s, I could hear the loss in the tracks, now all 3 are crystal clear!
 

 

[jamesta]

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Wouldn't the ES5 have a bigger improvement with amping? haha

 
It does but the improvement is extremely miniscule compared to the money spent, it's worth it but amping the W4 over getting ES5 is like putting nice rims on a '00 Jetta instead of buying that 06 A4.  The ES5 are an indescribably wonderful experience if one's sound signature preference hovers towards Westone's house sound.
 
 

 

[WisdomListens]

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Quote:As to quality loss for tracks not in lossless... I would say it is certainly noticeable! A friend had borrowed me his copy of the Avatar soundtrack by James Horner, ripped in 320kbps mp3. There were numerous tracks where when the full orchestra was playing and there was a large crescendo that I could hear an almost static like sound from the track. I've since picked up the soundtrack for myself, ripped it into ALAC, and voila, no problems. Listening with my iphone 4 and Westone 4s, Klipsch Custom 3s and Etymotic HF3s, I could hear the loss in the tracks, now all 3 are crystal clear!

Yeah out of all the music out there I think classical would probably be the most susceptible to losing quality with lower encoding because of all the highs and lows in one song.

 

[JxK]

Remember though, when comparing, make sure it's a blind test (ABX). foobar2000 has a great ABX extension you can add on. Works like a charm. For what it's worth, hearing the difference between V0 mp3 (same as 320, but half the size) and FLAC is incredibly difficult. I've done it, but only on a tiny tiny handful of songs. The differences were very minor, and only audible in a quiet room when listening with my full attention. For a portable, where you're not giving the music 100% attention, and where outside sounds invariably leak in, lossless files are just wasted space.
 
The advantage of lossless comes for home listening, where one can devote one's full attention to the music. And also for the ability to convert them to whatever format you want, at any bitrate, without loss of quality. But again, for portable use, V2 mp3 is more than adequate.

 

[mbfraser]

Okay, so my next upgrades will likely be the custom tips and a new player.
 
I've been considering a Cowon product for some time. Can someone tell me how this compares to the iPod classic? I see that they've got a Cowon D3 Plenue expected sometime this year. Maybe I'll get that with a microSD card. It still won't be big enough for my library but I'll just put on some of my favourite albums and then put the new ones I've been meaning to listen to on rotation.

 

[mbfraser]

Also, is there anyone here that is located in Canada and has been to an audiologist for ear impressions? Where did you go? Did the impressions cost money? How does it work? Do you just book an appointment and explain to the doctor (?) that you'd like impressions for an IEM?

 

[lazysleepyboi]

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Okay, so my next upgrades will likely be the custom tips and a new player.
 
I've been considering a Cowon product for some time. Can someone tell me how this compares to the iPod classic? I see that they've got a Cowon D3 Plenue expected sometime this year. Maybe I'll get that with a microSD card. It still won't be big enough for my library but I'll just put on some of my favourite albums and then put the new ones I've been meaning to listen to on rotation.

it's hard when you put it in that way. I mean i have had an ipod touch for 2 years then i moved onto a cowon iaudio 9. The difference is noticeable right away. It doesn't make the ipod a bad player at all, it's just that i felt more at ease with the cowon player. What really made a big difference for me after that was when i added an arrow amp. I can't listen to my cowon player alone anymore, i always have it attached to my amp now when i'm on the go. It just sounds better with an amp. I usually tell people that you don't know any better until you're shown it. So for you, right when you get your player, you'll be satisfied with it until someone exposes you to what it sounds like from an amp. This entire audiophile business is something that isn't going to end for a lot of us. There is no end all product for audiophiles, we're always searching for more. For now, the player and custom tips should do good for you. 
 
For your custom tips, go onto the Westone website and type in UM56 and then find out what you're supposed to do. I don't personally own a Westone product, so i'll tell you what i went through for my custom tips for me IE8s. What is supposed to happen is that you pay westone directly, i dont know the price, and then they give you a form. On that form you fill out all your billing information, what color you want it, material, blah blah blah, they'll explain it to you. After that, you go on the westone website and you find out which audiologists are registered with westone in your area. Westone has association with a lot of audiologists since they want your impressions taken in a particular way. If you can't find an audiologist that's registered with westone in your area, call them and tell them your situation. They'll quickly tell you which one to go to, and they'll work with you. When you pay your payment to westone, it should cover the impression costs. All you should have to do is pay westone, and then go to the audiologist to have your impressions taken. The audiologist will use a syringe and squirt......i dont know what the material was, but they'll squirt it, let it sit in your ear for 5 minutes (it's kind of cold at first, but you kind of get used to it), and then take it out. I don't know how westone does it, but for me personally, i was able to get my audiologist to send my impressions over. (some audiologist will have you send it instead, really depends on which one you go to.) After westone gets it, they'll contact you saying that they received it and they'll ask you for additional information if they need it. After that, let them work with it for two weeks and then they'll send you back the finished products. The whole process really varies according to how busy westone is along with how long shipping takes. On average, most custom tips from start to finish take about a month to complete. The end product is worth it in all respects though.
 
If you have anymore questions, i'll be happy to answer them. 

 

[shotgunshane]

Same here.  It took me a while to find an authorized audiologist who knew what they were doing.  Price is definitely negotiable, so it's worth it to call around.  I got black silicone for less than the msrp of vinyl.  Same 2 week turn around time.
 
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Well, that's one way to get UM56s. Another easier way is to choose an authorized Westone audiologist in your area (if one exists), and order through them. They do the impressions, send them to Westone, and call you when they are done. You choose the color, materials, etc., from the audiologists catalog. They quote the price and you pay the audiologist. How do I know that? Because that is how I got UM56s. I also found you can get a better price if you do it that way. My cost was $115 including impressions. Not saying you will get the same price, and I was surprised it was so inexpensive (I expected to pay more). Oh, and it took two weeks for mine to arrive at the audiologist.
 
Just go here and type in your address, see what you get.
 
http://www.westone.com/dealer-locations