[TheMarkRemains]

Quote:

ah, I missed that tidbit, sorry 
 

No problem, sorry if I was snarky. $450 is a lot for a non-serviceable IEM is my point (why I avoided the Shure 530 back in the day).

 

[Flavio T]

I was never an adept of replaceable cables probably because of my experience with the last batches of superfi series but the Shure and the Westone removable cables and most importantly the housing of the female connection on the earpiece have not disappointed me yet.

 

[SolidSnake3]

Quote:

I was never an adept of replaceable cables probably because of my experience with the last batches of superfi series but the Shure and the Westone removable cables and most importantly the housing of the female connection on the earpiece have not disappointed me yet.

But if the removable cables by Westone have yet to disappoint than why before, in the posts music quoted, were you quite the adamant defender of the "fixed" cable on the W4. If you have had such good experiences with the Westone removable cables and put some level of faith in them than what advantage could fixed cables possibly have? 
 
I'm not trying to poke holes or anything however this statement seems like a bit of a backtrack or change from the opinion you held strongly to just a short while ago. Seems a bit confusing to me is all...
 

 

[buffalowings]

Quote:

No problem, sorry if I was snarky. $450 is a lot for a non-serviceable IEM is my point (why I avoided the Shure 530 back in the day).

 
i completely agree with your point of view, even if the cabling doesn't doesn't break, in a year or two, the rubber/plastic sheath naturally hardens causing the cable to have a slight memory characteristic and microphonic as well

 

[Flavio T]

But if the removable cables by Westone have yet to disappoint than why before, in the posts music quoted, were you quite the adamant defender of the "fixed" cable on the W4. If you have had such good experiences with the Westone removable cables and put some level of faith in them than what advantage could fixed cables possibly have? 
 
I'm not trying to poke holes or anything however this statement seems like a bit of a backtrack or change from the opinion you held strongly to just a short while ago. Seems a bit confusing to me is all...
 

Hi SolidSnake3,

Please note that I used the word "yet". It's still too soon before we have enough data on returns and defect rate. The "trauma" in my case was caused by the last batches of 5EB a few years back where the issues were crazy high specially on the housing.

I personally tend to use more my fixed cable UM3X than anything else.

The replaceable cables both in Westone's and Shure's case come with the "memory wire" which I'm not a big fan of. The memory wire is very polarizing. You either love it or hate it and it's very personal.

I don't like moving parts where none is needed but completely understand the appeal and preference for removable cables but I own a pair of UM2s with fixed cables going over 5 years now.

These replaceable cable versions were introduced last year. Our company will have to wait and see how these connections will behave 1-2 years from now before we have a more definite opinion.. We don't know yet. I don't think the manufacturers know that either unless they have those machines that can cause forced and repeated stress on the connections for days (maybe they do).

But like I said, they have not disappointed yet. Another thing to note too is how nice, thick and pliable the new Shure cables are. They look great but still a relatively young product. I've been taking a set of Shure SE215 to the gym since last week and I'm enjoying them more and more despite the memory wire.

The cool thing about Westone's fixed cable is the lack of their presence. Sometimes it feels like you are using a wireless product. Perhaps another member can explain this better than I can

Thanks.

 

[kingice10]

In my ears, W4 for me is a slightly tamed SM3, less warmth in the mids, speedy bass and well pronounced treble. Presentation is also enveloping, but comparing to SM3s 3D environment, W4 seems slightly less soundstage.
 
I am comparing now with my J3, same eq settings Headphone 2, with both olive tips and playing "Are You In" by Incubus and some of my Jazz songs. I admit I can play music with W4 without distraction, easy, and fun but with my SM3s, some songs may become too musical and too enveloping. Sometimes I stopped work in the office because of the "Wow" factor the SM3 has. So I still like my SM3's sq because of this, at a value more than you pay for the W4. If W4 package would have those detacheable cables like UM3X, which I was planning to buy, then this would be my alternate iem. Only because of the price per package and sq of these iems, that I didn't think buying them. Not that this features are lacking in W4, but I am not that impressed. And this is from me who have 4 universal iems in a row with 1 custom iem. Maybe if I haven't gotten/heard SM3s then

, I'll definitely consider this iem in my list.

 

[sly_in_the_sky]

Hello,
 
First, sorry for my English.
 
I also own both SM3 and Westone 4 and with the Sensorcom tips, I really can't say wich one has better soundstage, both is huge... But to my ears, what W4 has more than the Sm3 is perhaps more space and precision in the medium frequencies. Also, in some difficult tracks with lot of instruments, the separation is also a little bit better with the W4...
 
 
 

 

[music_4321]

.

 

[onion]

Hi guys,
 
Just wondering about the suitability of the W4's for metal - things like Tool, Dream Theatre, (older) Metallica etc..
 
Currently trying to decide between these, the W3's or the UM3x's.
 
Or are there better options again these days (pm or link to more suitable thread welcome if this is the case so as not to derail this thread any more than it has been).
 
I've not really owned any high-er end IEM's before - my only real experience is a pair of UE SF3's that whatever I get will be replacing, but I own and enjoy both the Beyer DT250's and Alessandro MS1's for a point of reference.
 
Thanks!

 

[music_4321]

.

 

[SolidSnake3]

Music_4321,
 
Your post in the SE215 is what inspired me to post here regarding the seemingly contradictory opinions Flavio may hold regarding fixed vs. removable cables. I noticed the point you brought up which reminded me of the whole fixed vs. removable cable discussion that went on for a quite a while when it was announced that the W4's would be fixed. With my post I was hoping to get some clarity from Flavio since his preferred cable type did seem to change depending on what product was new and being actively marketed. 
 
Also, if the bad cable experiences were pretty much UE specific regarding removable than why use their reliability as a case for the W4's having a fixed cable? This seems like one is using data from another company's product to make implications about a different companies. IE, using UE's removable cable issues to make an assumption regarding removable cables in general and more specifically, those of Westone which, to me, seem to be on a totally different level regarding build and reliability. 

 

[Flavio T]

Quotes by SolidSnake3 /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 
Quote:

... Flavio since his preferred cable type did seem to change depending on what product was new and being actively marketed. 

 
No. That is not a correct interpretation of my statements. I did not change my preference. My preference is for fixed cables given the option in the same model. The Shure SE215 is just another product. A newly released one which sells for $99, has the feature that many people want (removable cables), Shure's design, dynamic drivers which some people also prefer, etc. And I took the gym and was surprised and happy with the product. The nature of our business makes us try everything we sell.
 
 
Quote:

Also, if the bad cable experiences were pretty much UE specific regarding removable than why use their reliability as a case for the W4's having a fixed cable?

 
Because UE was the only product with removable cables we had previous experience with.
 
 
Quote:

This seems like one is using data from another company's product to make implications about a different companies.

 
That is correct. When that is the only data available you use that data to speculate on future performance but carefully insert things like "too soon to know" and disclose that the data is from past products since the new ones did not exist yet, hence no data. Earphone Solutions has been doing this since 2000. Shure E1 was the first one after the pioneers Garwood back in the early 1990's.
 
 
Quote:

...regarding removable cables in general and more specifically, those of Westone which, to me, seem to be on a totally different level regarding build and reliability. 

 
That seems to be the case so far. Time will confirm your statement and my belief.
 

 
On my original post about "removable vs. fixed", one key statement I made was left out of the BOLD: "The only products we don't have enough data yet because they are relatively too new, are the SE535, SE425, SE315, UM2-RC & UM3X-RC."
 
I appreciate the good will when reading my posts. I love the community which is comprised of many intelligent people and we have been sponsoring Head-Fi for many many years and we are not going anywhere. I'm a merchant. I have vested interest in this business. It's disclosed on my signature. I also love these earphones and am a user. When in doubt don't think the worst possible. When you think you're "certain" about someone's "hidden motives", stop and think for a second that you could be wrong.
 
 

 

[TCD1975]

@ music_4321 and SolidSnake3
 
Cut Flavio a bit of slack. His posts are always friendly and helpful.
 
What are you? The forum police all of a sudden?
 
I used to highly regard posts made by music_4321 but lately you've got right up yourself.

 

[markh78]

I'm not too worried with fixed cable, I mean the day it breaks will be the day I'll dip my toe into the world of customs and get the thing re-molded.
In a way, I can't wait for that day to come

 

[jude]

After some reports (and a subsequent review), I've deleted some posts, and notified those whose posts were deleted.
 
Please keep this thread on topic.